Just to add this. I had the Stock clutches setup pretty well. shift assist w/ 46/36 (i think) on the secondary w/ 77g and yellow white spring in the primary. I got a good deal on the STM and i had multiple stress fractures on the stock secondary sheaves so thats why i have what i have. it was either 200 bucks for new sheaves or 350 for a used STM secondary. I think the STM is a better setup. I can touch my clutches after long pulls. I think this is the biggest advantage is cooler clutch and belt temps which equals more consitent performance from the clutches.
What's the Best Aftermarket Secondary (Driven) Clutch?
- Thread starter Frostbite
- Start date
Guys, any updates on secondary clutches?
I have one:
I have been talking with the guys from Shockwave adjustable helix about clutching. After my coaxing, they have now purchased a STM secondary and have fitted the shockwave adjustable helix to it easily (it bolts right up). There is a bushing length vs. shaft length issue that they are trying to resolve with STM and then one or both of them may offer a secondary with the capability to have an adjsutable helix angle very shortly.
I have one:
I have been talking with the guys from Shockwave adjustable helix about clutching. After my coaxing, they have now purchased a STM secondary and have fitted the shockwave adjustable helix to it easily (it bolts right up). There is a bushing length vs. shaft length issue that they are trying to resolve with STM and then one or both of them may offer a secondary with the capability to have an adjsutable helix angle very shortly.
i would like to see a reasonable answer for the belts blowing and a reasonable fix for the M8's. yes i understand they are mountain sleds and not ferrari's. but, the m's have to be ridden on the trail somewhat to get to the good stuff. if you cant open it up, and hold her pinned on the trail over 80 mph, what is the sense in having 800cc's?
this isnt about sleds in the deep or on a hill pull or about the 1000cc sleds. this is about m8 sleds on trail, with lots of load and traction blowing belts over 80mph. i have to beleive it is a gearing issue AND secondary flaw that allows the belt to way over shift and get hung up in the helix and get cut then boom.
out of all the sleds i have owned skidoo's, yamahas, i have never not been able to hold it wide open for as long as i want on a lake or trail. now with the M i am scared to go over 60mph for short periods. kinda taking the fun out of having a bigger cc sled.
the guys we ride with (all non cat people), dont understand why the wife and i cant rip down the trail with them at 60-80 mph all day, saying they would never own a sled like that. the wife loves to open her sled up periodically and i have had to reel her in to tell her dont go over 60 on the trail. it isnt making it any funner for either of us.
i really think the best bang for our bucks is to replace both the primary and secondary clutches right off the bat. never mind the pipes, fuel controlers, venting, suspension upgrades ect... the primaries on the cats dont last very long which simply amazes me, that a large item like that, has become a wear item and WE have to buy another which isnt any better. and the secondary has some sort of terminal over shift ability without a reasonable stopper to prevent belt failure.
DOESNT MAKE ANY SENSE TO A LAYMAN.
i would love for a cat engineer to ride an m8 over 80 on the trail and experience what we are experiencing and then help us get a fix.
i wouldnt mine going to 60-60 gearing to lower cruising rpms to help with fuel economy and aid in higher mph without the boom but, i am not sure how bad i will sacrifice my steep and deep riding.
i understand there is a trade off but, i want to be able to do both, ride faster and hold the flipper wfo on the trail, and have decent gearing in the deep fluff. there has to be a happy medium in there somewhere. ski
this isnt about sleds in the deep or on a hill pull or about the 1000cc sleds. this is about m8 sleds on trail, with lots of load and traction blowing belts over 80mph. i have to beleive it is a gearing issue AND secondary flaw that allows the belt to way over shift and get hung up in the helix and get cut then boom.
out of all the sleds i have owned skidoo's, yamahas, i have never not been able to hold it wide open for as long as i want on a lake or trail. now with the M i am scared to go over 60mph for short periods. kinda taking the fun out of having a bigger cc sled.
the guys we ride with (all non cat people), dont understand why the wife and i cant rip down the trail with them at 60-80 mph all day, saying they would never own a sled like that. the wife loves to open her sled up periodically and i have had to reel her in to tell her dont go over 60 on the trail. it isnt making it any funner for either of us.
i really think the best bang for our bucks is to replace both the primary and secondary clutches right off the bat. never mind the pipes, fuel controlers, venting, suspension upgrades ect... the primaries on the cats dont last very long which simply amazes me, that a large item like that, has become a wear item and WE have to buy another which isnt any better. and the secondary has some sort of terminal over shift ability without a reasonable stopper to prevent belt failure.
DOESNT MAKE ANY SENSE TO A LAYMAN.
i would love for a cat engineer to ride an m8 over 80 on the trail and experience what we are experiencing and then help us get a fix.
i wouldnt mine going to 60-60 gearing to lower cruising rpms to help with fuel economy and aid in higher mph without the boom but, i am not sure how bad i will sacrifice my steep and deep riding.
i understand there is a trade off but, i want to be able to do both, ride faster and hold the flipper wfo on the trail, and have decent gearing in the deep fluff. there has to be a happy medium in there somewhere. ski
B
boosted1
Member
way too paranoid
I have blown 2 belts on my 2009 m8 162, each time i was wide open across the lake for about 2-5 miles trust me you wont blow it unless your holding it wide open for some time!
the 2009 M8 got the Supreme tool secondary treatment, as well as a turbo kit from CPC.
I believe its an easy fix, phone up BDX order yourself a set of gears, i put 2.1 ratio in my 2010 HCR 153 that equals 104mph, I ride this sled hard! with 500miles on it...no belt issues
you dont have to go to the 2.1 ratio, but gear them up for 150-200 dollars, ask for the upgraded bearing, remove your secondary, set the sled on its right side, remove the DD cover, slide the gears out and replace with new set, install cover with cleaned up gasket and ride....
with the added top speed, it has not hampered bottom end one bit!
when i go to the mountains, i change the gearing back to stock.
if you have any mechanical skills what so ever you will have no issues with this
B
I have blown 2 belts on my 2009 m8 162, each time i was wide open across the lake for about 2-5 miles trust me you wont blow it unless your holding it wide open for some time!
the 2009 M8 got the Supreme tool secondary treatment, as well as a turbo kit from CPC.
I believe its an easy fix, phone up BDX order yourself a set of gears, i put 2.1 ratio in my 2010 HCR 153 that equals 104mph, I ride this sled hard! with 500miles on it...no belt issues
you dont have to go to the 2.1 ratio, but gear them up for 150-200 dollars, ask for the upgraded bearing, remove your secondary, set the sled on its right side, remove the DD cover, slide the gears out and replace with new set, install cover with cleaned up gasket and ride....
with the added top speed, it has not hampered bottom end one bit!
when i go to the mountains, i change the gearing back to stock.
if you have any mechanical skills what so ever you will have no issues with this
B
F
FrostBite2010
Well-known member
Sounds like you guys need a cross-fire. These sleds are built for the mountains not for the trails. If your trying to go for top speed the M-series isn't probably your best choice. These sleds are geared down to what they are for a reason. Not saying that some of the torsional secondary options aren't something worth looking into, I am looking at RKtek secondary myself...but I'm looking for throttle response and low end torque not top speed. These efi sleds just don't crack like the flat sliders. But I can't really comment on the trail subject since I ride right from my house and never touch a trail.
Z
Zone28M7
Well-known member
What is the 2.1 setup for, trail riding? I see you're putting this on a HCR. I'm interested in this setup but don't want to lose climbing and boondocking abilities.
bosted1 did you go with 62-58 gearing to get 2.10?
was thinking about going to the 60-60 from the crossfire which is 2.24.
i believe the stock gearing is 53-67? is that correct???
not many gear selections offered for the new reverse (from the hi performance engineering catalog) but that may be just what they stock not what bdx would offer for the reverse DD.
fb2010 (this is not a bash, just giving you a heads up on what we do woth the sleds). these are mulit purpose sleds for us, i want the 153 track not a 144 for floatation. we dont use them just for trail and lake riding. we use them for bush and tree riding, and outwest 1 or 2 times a year. so they need to accomplish both.
unfortunatley we dont live in the mountains and have to ride trails to get to the pits, meadows or old airfields and bush roads we love to explore on. sometimes up to 30 miles one way on trail to get to the good stuff. no i dont want to ride 100 mph the whole time but, now and again, i would like to let the sled stretch it's legs without costing me an hour of digging kevlar belts out of the secondary, and 65-80 bux for a new belt.
i really dont think that is asking too much of the sled. ski
was thinking about going to the 60-60 from the crossfire which is 2.24.
i believe the stock gearing is 53-67? is that correct???
not many gear selections offered for the new reverse (from the hi performance engineering catalog) but that may be just what they stock not what bdx would offer for the reverse DD.
fb2010 (this is not a bash, just giving you a heads up on what we do woth the sleds). these are mulit purpose sleds for us, i want the 153 track not a 144 for floatation. we dont use them just for trail and lake riding. we use them for bush and tree riding, and outwest 1 or 2 times a year. so they need to accomplish both.
unfortunatley we dont live in the mountains and have to ride trails to get to the pits, meadows or old airfields and bush roads we love to explore on. sometimes up to 30 miles one way on trail to get to the good stuff. no i dont want to ride 100 mph the whole time but, now and again, i would like to let the sled stretch it's legs without costing me an hour of digging kevlar belts out of the secondary, and 65-80 bux for a new belt.
i really dont think that is asking too much of the sled. ski
I've had three M8s and have yet to blow a belt. Mine will only do 74 mph or so pinned on a trail with a 162 track. My girl's sled is stock 153 track with a pipe/can and it'll do about 70 mph on the trail. So I doubt you are going to run at 80-90 mph anyhow on a M8. I have yet to see a groomed trail in Washington/Oregon/Montana/California/Idaho where you could truely leave it pinned for minutes on end. That'd be a straight section of trail that was 3-5 miles long. Hmm.
Honestly, every time I've seen a guy blow a belt with an M8 or M1000 its because he's messed with the gearing and/or used a aftermarket secondary. And it's always been in a hard, LONG, hill climb at WOT.
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