That would eliminate half the riding season?
And 80% of the clear (= cold) days.
Earth X lithium in my bike started last week at -15F just fine.
16 sxf450
what are you guys using for batteries?
- Thread starter coryf89
- Start date
That would eliminate half the riding season?
And 80% of the clear (= cold) days.
Earth X lithium in my bike started last week at -15F just fine.
16 sxf450
K
kell8071
Well-known member
I found the husaberg kit that matched up to my 13 ktm for around $150 and install was easy. Easily worth it.
Agreed, same here. Seven decades of exposure might contribute to that position.
I have begun to heat my oilpan whit a propan torch before starting my bike in cold temps. Only takes a few minutes.
My BIL got a Banshee Li Ion last winter and boy, was that ever a mistake. The bike needed to either be kicked or jump started every time as the battery never had enough in it to start the bike, no matter what was tried, what with all the "warm-up" procedures like turning on headlights-which the 2008 CRF 450X didn't have anything to turn on until the bike was already running.
Then, just yesterday while going to start my bike as I had put my battery in his bike, and as I was using the Li Ion battery to see how long or, how well it would work until it got cold out, the battery was dead and thankfully, with the backup kickstarter, I was able to kick my bike 5 or 6 times while riding with my boy.
I ended up going to Batteries Plus and getting an Xtreme AGM for about $66.
No Li Ion for me as I think that they just suck in the cold.
Then, just yesterday while going to start my bike as I had put my battery in his bike, and as I was using the Li Ion battery to see how long or, how well it would work until it got cold out, the battery was dead and thankfully, with the backup kickstarter, I was able to kick my bike 5 or 6 times while riding with my boy.
I ended up going to Batteries Plus and getting an Xtreme AGM for about $66.
No Li Ion for me as I think that they just suck in the cold.
Little buddy propane heater works great.
Sit it on a bucket pointing at the engine.
(Less likely to singe skidplates/ pine needles/ alder branches. ?)
I tried the heat trick.. kinda.
I warm the bike up in the shop.. make sure itll even start before loading it.
drive 2 mins to gas station with bike off. fuel up, then start the bike ON the trailer, starts fine at that point.
drive 2 mins to get fast food breakfast with the bike idiling on the trailer. shut bike off before drive through. at that point its fully warmed up.
drive 20 mins to riding spot at -20 or so... bike wont start. went to a lead cell battery and it seems to be a bit better. 0w rotella t6.
I have a horrible over fueled tune... that could cause hard starting issues possibly?
ive also got a LED headlight (thought LEDs used barely any power?) and electric grip heaters that I can only run one at at time, otherwise next time I go to start my bike... the battery doesnt have enough juice. so I probably need a larger stator now too. ugh. constant electrical problems with me thats for sure!
I warm the bike up in the shop.. make sure itll even start before loading it.
drive 2 mins to gas station with bike off. fuel up, then start the bike ON the trailer, starts fine at that point.
drive 2 mins to get fast food breakfast with the bike idiling on the trailer. shut bike off before drive through. at that point its fully warmed up.
drive 20 mins to riding spot at -20 or so... bike wont start. went to a lead cell battery and it seems to be a bit better. 0w rotella t6.
I have a horrible over fueled tune... that could cause hard starting issues possibly?
ive also got a LED headlight (thought LEDs used barely any power?) and electric grip heaters that I can only run one at at time, otherwise next time I go to start my bike... the battery doesnt have enough juice. so I probably need a larger stator now too. ugh. constant electrical problems with me thats for sure!
The big problem you are creating is that when the bike is idiling, as the output from your stator is NOT enough to charge the battery, you have too much of a draw and not enough of an input to keep up, never mind that it is cold out. All you are doing is weakening the battery by idling it.
If you just started the bike up when you got to where you are going you'd probably have an easier time getting it started, or put a jump pack on it and it would probably fire right up. It is what I have been doing almost every time once I know it is cold enough, like single digits or -0 F.
If you just started the bike up when you got to where you are going you'd probably have an easier time getting it started, or put a jump pack on it and it would probably fire right up. It is what I have been doing almost every time once I know it is cold enough, like single digits or -0 F.
Interesting. I do have a jump pack and that usually does the trick. I’ve got a voyageur on it now so I can monitor voltage a lot closer and accurately now.
What’s using so much power on idle that the obviously pos stator can’t even keep up after 2-4 minutes of idiling?? That’s pretty pathetic is it not?
What’s using so much power on idle that the obviously pos stator can’t even keep up after 2-4 minutes of idiling?? That’s pretty pathetic is it not?
It’s a race bike, the stator is as small (lightweight) as possible to barely charge the battery for summertime mx racing.
Ktm is always chasing weight.
The propane radiant heater warms the motor and battery, bike starts up very easily.
Not necessarily. Friend of mine has a 2017 KX450, and if he doesn't start it in the morning and get it up to operating temp before we load and head for the mountain it will not start when we get there. Granted that is a kick-only bike so battery isn't an issue, but I could see others' electric start bikes giving the same fits. I can see your point though. Some bikes have smaller stators than others. Especially MX vs enduro bikes.
Kick start or not, with the FI bikes if your battery is dead enough a kicker won't do you any good. Not enough power to run the fuel pump and you're still dead in the water. Just had this happen to me on my Husky FX450 on Sunday in the mountains. Ran the battery too low with the cooling fan/stalling/restarting after miles of uphill technical trail. Had the whole mountain downhill to bump start and it wouldn't go. Had to pull the battery out of my buddies carb 2s that had a backup kicker and swap with mine to get going. I'm in the market for a lightweight jump pack to take with me on those adventures now!
It has been repeated many times that even on motor vehicles, the amount of amps at idle are so low that alternators are not considered chargers and are meant to maintain a battery and that is about it. Never mind stators, like one had mentioned that only put out a minimum of amps, at best, to keep the amount level. Couple that with the time that the bike ends up getting cold again and all that warm up has done is, nothing. All it did was maybe keep the battery the same volts/amps it had before it was ever started but then the bike and battery are dead cold again.
The only thing that might help would be if you increased the idle to feed the battery more amps otherwise one is really just wasting fuel.
Some bikes have such small batteries that after a few minutes of leaving the key on, not running, the battery is dead. These are not auto batteries or boat batteries with a huge reserve capacities, these are batteries the size of a 64 box of Crayola Crayons.
If it were me, I'd just charge the battery the night before. Not start it until I got to where I was going, but put a jump pack on the battery before the first start of the day. Otherwise, after a 20 minute ride, everything is cold again and it is like you did nothing at all with all the previous starts.
Last edited:
I had a rep from AntiGravity batteries answer a question about their Lithium batteries I had on the Beta Forum in Thumpertalk as my question was something like "Are Lithium batteries any good in the extreme cold, like from -10F to 10F? Here was their response:
"Being honest if your in that temperature most of the time... I see your avatar shows a snowmobile.... then you might want to stick with lead/acid because lithium batteries actually have a higher resistance that is caused from extreme cold... but that is only on the initial start attempts... but when you talking about 0 degrees and the vehicle left outside in that temp that is not the best for lithium. Yes lithium can work in the Zero Degree temps but you might have to get it to self warm by leaving your lights on for a good few minutes, or by bumping the starter a few times which discharges energy from the battery and causes it to self warm then it will start and get back to full power. But I am talking from a daily perspective and longer term use in continual zero degree weather, I don't think lithiums the best bet unless you keep your vehicle indoors at a more moderate temp. If your saying you ride in that temp occasionally then lithium would be fine... but you absolutely want to try to get the highest amp hour battery if you are mostly cold weather riding... because the higher the amp hour the more overhead power you have in the lower temps where on those initial start attempts when lithium won't have its full power until it gets warmed up.
We have alot of snowmobile racers and freestylers using the batteries, but I'm just being realistic about lithium in that low of temps. I might just require a bit more time to get self-warmed at those temps and not worth the hassle."
I have a new AGM from Batteries Plus and expect that it is going to be great for this upcoming winter and for many years to come.
"Being honest if your in that temperature most of the time... I see your avatar shows a snowmobile.... then you might want to stick with lead/acid because lithium batteries actually have a higher resistance that is caused from extreme cold... but that is only on the initial start attempts... but when you talking about 0 degrees and the vehicle left outside in that temp that is not the best for lithium. Yes lithium can work in the Zero Degree temps but you might have to get it to self warm by leaving your lights on for a good few minutes, or by bumping the starter a few times which discharges energy from the battery and causes it to self warm then it will start and get back to full power. But I am talking from a daily perspective and longer term use in continual zero degree weather, I don't think lithiums the best bet unless you keep your vehicle indoors at a more moderate temp. If your saying you ride in that temp occasionally then lithium would be fine... but you absolutely want to try to get the highest amp hour battery if you are mostly cold weather riding... because the higher the amp hour the more overhead power you have in the lower temps where on those initial start attempts when lithium won't have its full power until it gets warmed up.
We have alot of snowmobile racers and freestylers using the batteries, but I'm just being realistic about lithium in that low of temps. I might just require a bit more time to get self-warmed at those temps and not worth the hassle."
I have a new AGM from Batteries Plus and expect that it is going to be great for this upcoming winter and for many years to come.
Last edited:
Good info guys. I’ll have to do some testing and experimenting when the snow flies. Got snow south of Calgary last night. It won’t last though. But she’s coming!!
Anti gravity jump packs are amazing. Mine still has an 4/5 charge and it’s been sitting since April abandoned.
Anti gravity jump packs are amazing. Mine still has an 4/5 charge and it’s been sitting since April abandoned.
Similar threads
