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Twins or porting for 09 dragon?

M

Mr. Redrock

Member
Nov 26, 2007
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Ran slp single, carls clutching, vents, and intake mods last year. Would like more power but cant aford big bore or turbo.
Leaning toward slp twins, head cut and reflash from carls or there port and head cut with the slp single.

Who has rode or done this and what do you think?
Race gas is the down fall on the twins but a couple of gallons per tank is not a killer just a pain.
Ride mostly 8000' and up. Low as 6500' maybe once a year or less.

Do mostly boondocking, tree riding and climbing when avalible.
 

F-Bomb

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Nov 26, 2007
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South West Idaho
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I put 1200 miles on an 09 155 RMK from Carl's Performance. We did 800 miles with the 30% race gas head and the rest with the 50% race gas head. Their kit as you know runs SLP twins, head compression kit, and some kind of block off (Carls can coach you on this), and then they put an SLP map for that setup into your existing CDI. The original plan was to port this motor as well but it ran so good that I decided to leave it alone and ride it. It runs awesome is way more sled then an SLP single with Carl's clutching in a similar sled configuration. (WAY MORE) Now I've also ridden this same exact package but with porting and while it is a bit more I'm not certain that for the full cost of all of it that I wouldn't opt for turbo now that they have those running so much better and more reliably. Porting is costly!

One of my friends has a spot on Dragon 800 with SLP single, full top and bottom porting by Jack Struthers, and these two sleds are very close to a heads up tie. (we also have at least 5 09 non ported standard customer package SLP single Carls sleds that go along regularly for comparisons) So it appears to be way more cost effective to get simple twins and put a little race gas in as opposed to single and porting.

Out of the hole the twin pipe 800 feels a little lazy especially if you are coming off of a really good running single pipe BUT the funny thing is when we drag race those exact same sleds the 800 twin is never EVER behind and the mid-range pull is OUTSTANDING. It also really likes the RPM's so if your tune is 8500-8600 it sings and will carry that on very very long pulls. Like I said a lot more sled then the single and it shows on deep long pulls if you are comparing like sleds, with similar weighted and skilled riders.

As far as a tuner is concerned I agree that in the hands of the right person a fuel controller can be theoretically useful. The problem is that none of them are really a fully looped EFI controller that is set it and forget it. You still have to manage fuel and it appears to me from experience that the variances are about 4000 feet in altitude before things change radically enough to warrant fuel adjustments. We managed ours with the amount of race gas that we applied to the system depending on altitude. Knowing that the testing had been done and the system was designed for 6000 - 8000 feet when I run at 4000 I add a % of additional race fuel and like wise when we rode at 8000 - 11,000 it ran better when we weaned it off . That is completely an at your own risk proposition but it worked well for me and the sled ran consistantly strong from 4000 in Oregon to 10,000 in Wyoming. Obviously you need to make some weight adjustments but the fuel delivery and timing seemed to be pretty close by controlling octane.

I'm waiting for them to get the controllers better dialed in for this system and the power commander V is very interesting but once again I have very limited experience with any of them. The ones that I experienced seem to be even more sensitive to alt and condition changes so there was alot more constant adjustments needed for high performance then our set it and forget it stuff from Carls. They have a closed loop for the bikes but the done deal for our environment is not released. The guys running the PC III that are qualified intelligent applicators are all very pleased with the results. I'm a huge EGT fan (being one of the foremost experts on Digatron data acquisition instruments it's easy to see the value...plus I know what I am doing and seeing so the data actually means information) there seems to be a natural tie in. I'll probably start experimenting with the PC V and a data logger with the twin pipes next year and see if there is more performance being left on the table. Designing fixed maps for the various applications is very very time consuming and I don't think near as much testing went into the twin setup as the single for all of the variations of altitude and air conditions on these 800s. Mine runs great and so do several others that I know of but that is right here in our backyard where the stuff was designed to run. That is personal speculation and I'm waiting for the year to roll around again so that I can see for myself with the data logger (which I shouldn't have been lazy so that I would know as I wasted all of last season for information)...then I'll know for certain.
 

shortstuff

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Nov 30, 2007
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Rigby, ID
I also ran the twins last year. As far as performance I have to totally agree with f bomb. We had mine with twins one with single an port an one with just a single. The twins really do pull hard. Worth the race gas in my opinion.
F Bomb could you tell me more about carls setup with the twins? All I did was put the pipes on, clutch, and the reflash. I haven't heard much about the head mod only what you have mentioned before. What about the block off you could tell me alittle about it if you know anything? Also if you could or would be willing to tell me anything about your setup would be helpful for comparison. I never rode the sled stock and it ran spectacular for the first quarter of the year. Then it burnt down we put new top end in it. It ran terrible till it burnt down again. polaris was out of parts for awhile finaly got some and went thru everything we could think of checked every system on the sled trying to find why it ran so poorly. Everything checked good. ran it tinkering on stuff trying to get it to run like it did at first of year. Never did make any improvement nothing we did would change the way the sled ran. It burnt down again fixed it and never had the chance to ride it again. I was really wanting to try some gauges and fuel controller to be able to tune and see what was goin on this year. But then I think why did it run so strong for first of year, replace the top end and the sled would barely pull itself in deep snow. Its like something else is wrong ,but we checked everything we could think of.
 
S

SNOW JW

Well-known member
Nov 26, 2007
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Belgrade MT
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My Dad runs the SLP twins on his 08 they pull much harder than the single hands down even with the porting the top end of the twins picks you up a good amount of track speed to pull away from the single.

Not sure how many miles he has on them now I know he has had them from Feb of the first season 0 issues runs around 1-2 Gal or Race at 5500ft and above even ran some Av gas and never had an issue. SLP recomends 20% mix of 108 motor octane.

As far as a Reflash not compensating for altitude that is not true at all as even a controller piggybacks off the stock ECU and it's sensors. I agree with F-Bomb with the right tune on a controller you could pull some extra HP and get that perfect tune but for the average Joe the reflash does just fine. I do notice a lean spot around 5500 and 6000 RPM but it has never stuck once just jocky the throttle from time to time and you should never have a problem.

Sounds like you got some good replies and all of them are views from others that own and ride them.
 
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M

Mr. Redrock

Member
Nov 26, 2007
279
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I was wondering about the bottom end snap, I like to pop the front up to cross creeks, logs and so.
Are you guys running reeds with the twins?
I can get a set of used twins for $400
At 8400-8600 rpm is close to the rev limiter, is that a problem?

Thanks for the replys.
 
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