Turbo heads?

[TheBreeze]

I am going to be sending my 2010 M8 head out for some work, i.e. lowered compression to help cut back on the octane requirements. What shops are a good option for this service? I want to send it to someone who is actually doing the work, and has experience with turbo applications - Boondocker specifically. Any input is appreciated.

 

[mk2g60]

RKT should be able to set you up. We had to have our M8 head cut for lower elevation, no det issues yet even @ 18 lbs.

 

[backcountryislife]

Ditto.

I'd go to Kelsey, he's a great resource for what will WORK on your sled and he's got a ton of experience dealing with turbo heads.

I'm thinking I'm gonna do that this summer as well, I'd like to be able to run 14 without dumping all that $$ in fuel!

Matt, have you played with the TPS at all yet though? I've been thinking about trying that first.

 

[TheBreeze]

I have not, and to be honest, don't know anything about it. What are you referring to? Timing adjustment? I am going to do a fair bit of low elevation riding this winter, and would like to get away with 100ll, or a blend of 110 and 93 pump. I don't think that is possible with the stock 2010 head at 1000 ft.

 

[JasonAK]

Call Dakota Performance. He runs turbo M8's at low elevation.

http://www.dakotaperformanceinc.com/

I ran mine with a 09 head on it last year at 800 ft. 9 psi was the limit w/100ll. This year I plan to run it with a -2 degree timing key and 10 head at 6 psi.

 

[backcountryislife]

I have not, and to be honest, don't know anything about it. What are you referring to? Timing adjustment? I am going to do a fair bit of low elevation riding this winter, and would like to get away with 100ll, or a blend of 110 and 93 pump. I don't think that is possible with the stock 2010 head at 1000 ft.

Adjusting the Throttle Position Sensor, A few people who don't talk smack have said that adjusting it to the bottom of cat spec will decrease timing, and will then help greatly with octane needs.

 

[TheBreeze]

Call Dakota Performance. He runs turbo M8's at low elevation.

http://www.dakotaperformanceinc.com/

I ran mine with a 09 head on it last year at 800 ft. 9 psi was the limit w/100ll. This year I plan to run it with a -2 degree timing key and 10 head at 6 psi.

Why are you going that route? Is that supposed to be a more responsive setup than dropping copression?

 

[backcountryislife]

Why are you going that route? Is that supposed to be a more responsive setup than dropping copression?

From most of the people I've talked to in regards to that, yes. It's a cheaper, and more effective way to lower octane needs without noticing it in the bottom end. I'd love to try the new BD timing box, if I could lower timing at 3/4 throttle I'd never worry about it again. I'm having to lower the whole map because of one spot.

 

[WyoBoy1000]

There was a guy on here that I can't get a hold of that said he had a cutler kit with custom head work and I think porting on a M8, then tweaked the tps settings with an actual AC tps tool and was running 15lbs on pg at 10000ft.
He seemed to know what he was talking about but my gut wants to call BS, wish I could get a hold of him. On 4 stoke car engines they seem to create more torque in the low end with less timing and more on the top when advanced, but with boost you need to be able to cut the timing back with the amount of boost, ie the more boost the less advanced. If we could set it up on a base setting and then as boost was added it retarded the timing, Depending on elevation if I could run the base timing up to 4-5lbs and then every 1lb of boost after than retards the timing 1-2* would be nice.

Does anyone even know how far these sleds are advanced at different rpm.

 

[smoking_powerstroke]

From most of the people I've talked to in regards to that, yes. It's a cheaper, and more effective way to lower octane needs without noticing it in the bottom end. I'd love to try the new BD timing box, if I could lower timing at 3/4 throttle I'd never worry about it again. I'm having to lower the whole map because of one spot.

Has BD announced a release date for their timing box?

 

[backcountryislife]

Has BD announced a release date for their timing box?

Oh sorry, I thought it was already out.


Wyo, I'd assume you're talking about pinehills? That's who I had talked to, and adjusting it to bottom of spec was what he told me... haven't tried it yet.


Riding weekend after next, maybe I can get it done before that & test it then.

 

[WyoBoy1000]

That would be the guy, he lives in my area and I want to see him fill up on 91 and run 15lbs, he also says it runs as strong or stronger than the rg sleds on the same boost.??????????? If I still have my 09 next season I might try it then with a 2876

 

[smoking_powerstroke]

Oh sorry, I thought it was already out.

They might be, I just haven't heard anyone actually using one.

 

[gus bohne]

retarding timing after half throttle would be the BEST method to use for elevation and boost changes that go with it.

compression adjustments are for BOOST level increases, boost pressure increases burn speed, faster burn speed can instigate deto, timing retard will slow burn speed,,,

for altitude you guys need the compression AND could tolerate more timing under half throttle then pull it back -2 from stock and run your boost where you like for your fuel and alt needs..

an adjustable box from tokyo mods would be nice, button on bars to swap timing curves as you need and dip switches to set the plot

Gus

 

[WyoBoy1000]

So your saying for boost above 6lbs you should drop compression, increase timing off bottom then drop 2* on top or actually go into negative timing on top.

 

[backcountryislife]

You'd want more on the bottom for before you start building boost, then retard in the mid-top.

On my sled though, as long as I stay pinned I can run notably higher boost, my issue is JUST at 3/4-7/8 throttle... so I'd want 2 transition points ideally.

Looked at tokyo mods, wish they did sleds!

Seems like the upcoming BD box would be the only way to do what we're talking about here though.

As for the timing versus compression, I think higher boost is exactly what we're all trying to achieve, the question is which loses more bottom end, lower comp, or (using just what we have available right now) a -2 timing key?

I've already got an 09 head, so the next step would be even LESS compression, or mess with the timing.

 

[realbass]

If you want put -2 key, don't forget that your EGT will go up.
IMHO

 

[WyoBoy1000]

I think some of that mid range deto comes from the PV's closing and opening, and the stock mapping around that rpm, would be nice if they would open at a little lower rpm

 

[w2bridin]

Push Tial kit

I have run the piss out of my 2010 m8 with stock head and 2* key set up by dakota no det yet on 100LL at 800ft alt running 8 psi. I am not saying its the best setup but it works very well and is a place to start for you flatlanders. If I only ran it at 800ft I would maybe try lowering compression but half the time I am at 8000+ft.

 

[backcountryislife]

If you want put -2 key, don't forget that your EGT will go up.
IMHO

Can you explain? I would have thought the opposite.

I run about 1150 max egt, so I'm ok with that.