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Taylor Park access closed!

snowmoboarder

Well-known member
Lifetime Membership
It looks like a logging company took it upon themselves to plow the cottonwood pass road up to cow creek access totally shutting down any access from the Buena Vista side of cottonwood pass. Needless to say this is unprecedented. I will contact the usfs today but if you plan to ride to Taylor park from cottonwood it is not possible with out riding 5 + miles of dirt.

Just a heads up and I will update as to and if the access will re open.
 
Had planned on riding Cottonwood this coming weekend. Does this mean the road from Avalanche parking lot to Cottonwood pass is bare and unrideable now?
 
Thanks for the report! You saved me a trip this Friday...bummer I guess I'll have to go somewhere else. Anybody have any recommendations? I need to put 100 easy miles on my sled before I can let he "rip". Is Marshall Pass open and groomed? I guess I can go to Turquoise Lake and dodge the folks riding wheelchairs and walkers.


SNOMOBOARDER, why don't you put BFP on the gate, i.e. big padlock.....
 
Had planned on riding Cottonwood this coming weekend. Does this mean the road from Avalanche parking lot to Cottonwood pass is bare and unrideable now?

Me too, bummer. Are there any areas on the east side of the pass to get off trail, maybe Ptarmigan Lake?
 
I just rode from Avalanche parking area on Buena Vista side of Cottonwood Pass to Mirror Lake below Tincup Pass this last Saturday 12/07. Plenty of snow up the east side to Cottonwood Pass. There is snow down the west side however yes they are still logging further down. Not sure if its because the weather is so cold or they came to an agreement for snowmobiling but there was about a 2 inch base on the plowed road. The plowed road was ride able when I was there and was about 4 miles of plowed road. Some warm weather might melt that away quick but as of the 7th still able to make it to Taylor Park, Tincup and whole area.
 
I hear you boys and I am pissed as well. Cant believe that the USFS would permit such a action but I have not heard from them yet. The local snowmobile club (Buena Vista Snowdrifers), as well as the local chamber, and outfitters are now involved so maybe it will stop the plowing but they have plowed 2 -3 feet off of the road so until it snows a bunch again the damage is done as the road is dirt.

The trailhead is at Avalanche on the BV side and there is enough snow to ride from there. All of the area on this side of the pass has 3-4 feet of snowpack. There were quite a few people up there since it snowed and since none of us went over to Taylor all of Cottonwood, Ptarmigan and that entire area got hit pretty hard. The boys who run the groomer got it up and running early this year so the trails and the main road on the BV side of the pass are in great shape.

What exactly got plowed is from the turn off of Hwy 55 at Taylor Park right by the trading post up to the Cottonwood pass road turn off, then the Cottonwood Pass Road, to the Cow Creek Spur Cut off, and a long way on the Cow Creek road. The monkeys doing the plowing are working very hard to ensure that there is no room for a snowmobile to run even in the ditch. They are doing it in such a way that there is no way other that riding miles of dirt to get from the Cottonwood Pass Trailhead or the BV side over to any of the riding on the Taylor Park side or even the Trading Post.

Sorry for a ****ty update but I did not want folks to run into what we did when we planned on riding on that side of the pass.

Also here are the 2 numbers for the USFS first on the Gunny side (Gunnison RD) and 2nd on the Salida side I have called them and if you like to ride over there I would suggest that you take 5 min out of your day and shoot them a call with your concerns.

Sorry I should have added that you can get to Taylor via Tin Cup (st elmo) if you want to ride what they have plowed between tin cup and the Trading post but then you will have to ride pavement to get north of the Trading Post if you want to ride north of there. Just dont go to either the Avalanche or Denny Creek lot as that route will not work.

Thx

Gunnison Ranger District (970) 874-6600

Salida Ranger District (719) 539-3591
 
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That sucks. Similar type of thing is going on at St. Elmo too. They have plowed the road from town up towards Hancock pass for about 4 miles as well. Drove our trucks up it, but there's absolutely no parking where they stopped plowing. No room on the side of the road either to cool your sled down.
 
Yea I know! Man now if they would only plow the road in front of my house :face-icon-small-coo!!

The St Elmo thing is EPA related as they are inspecting that mine I believe the Mary Murphy and should not last much longer but we have lost our ability to ride a lot of area's here in Buena Vista right now.

I wish they would only plow half of the road so we could still pass and access the area (s) in question.

Sucks for folks who have planned a holiday vacation to ride here around Buena Vista as if you know where exactly to go there is still plenty to ride but if you are not experienced with this area it will make it hard.
 
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Anyone in the area been up to North Fork or Marshall Pass? Wondering how the conditions are there?
 
I'm sure the logging company would be more than willing for you to pay their employees' wages so that they don't have to mess up your recreation. After all, I'm sure it's more important that you have unfettered access to the snow than it is for them to make a living.
 
I'm sure the logging company would be more than willing for you to pay their employees' wages so that they don't have to mess up your recreation. After all, I'm sure it's more important that you have unfettered access to the snow than it is for them to make a living.

HHmmm....they are logging on federal ground right? So how does that equate to them owning more of this federal ground than us? Wait, I have an answer. I buy stickers (yes plural) for my snowmobiles that pays for grooming and forest service amenities. Now loggers are taking that from me. HHmm...I guess the loggers owe me now then? Which loggers do I call to get my appropriate share of my sticker funds back from?
 
I didn't say they own it - But they did purchase the timber - which was a hell of a lot more expensive than your sticker. And those dollars go to the USFS to help pay the bills so that you can have your recreation. I pay registration fees too - 14 of them at last count - but I also firmly believe that we all have the right to make a living - sorry it might inconvenience you - NIMBY. And there is nothing wrong with making a living on federal land. You want to see it all locked up and throw away the key go join the tree huggers. Otherwise, you may occasionally have to put up with some use that you don't necessarily like.
 
I didn't say they own it - But they did purchase the timber - which was a hell of a lot more expensive than your sticker. And those dollars go to the USFS to help pay the bills so that you can have your recreation. I pay registration fees too - 14 of them at last count - but I also firmly believe that we all have the right to make a living - sorry it might inconvenience you - NIMBY. And there is nothing wrong with making a living on federal land. You want to see it all locked up and throw away the key go join the tree huggers. Otherwise, you may occasionally have to put up with some use that you don't necessarily like.

Plowing a road on federal land without authorization is a CRIME. Might not be anything wrong with " nothing wrong with making a living on federal land" but commiting a crime (as this appears to be) certainly seems wrong to me. Do a quick google search and see that more than a few people have been charged for plowing federal roads. Forest road 351 last year comes to mind....
 
Oh, by the way....a home owner at Ophir Creek plowed several miles of the snowmobile trail system there. I spoke with one of the trail groomers and he said the local snowmobile club is working with the forest service on a solution. You might have the same question as me, if that is an illegal activity why does the forest dervice not cite this guy?

Looks like we start standing up to these acts or start kissing our riding areas goodbye



As per the Forest Service (just in case you were curious)

2734.1 - Rights-of-Way Resulting From Contracts, Permits, or Leases

Use of existing forest development roads closed to commercial haul without a permit and all reconstruction, maintenance, or other activity, such as snowplowing, on a forest development road must be authorized by an appropriate road use permit (FSM 7730) both on the lease area and outside the lease area.
 
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The last few seasons they have been logging/removing a bunch of the beetle kill in the Snowy Range. This was marked/mentioned on the trail maps each year and communicated by the FS to local newspapers and on the FS website.

It doesn't seem like the whole story is out on this instance yet, but it seems like the ball was dropped somewhere in regards to communication. The logging is sometimes a pain for early season riding, but from my experience the crews are usually out of there when the good off trail riding starts.

I am all for logging, I wish they would sell more permits. It is amazing to see the areas that were logged in the last 20 years up in the Snowy Range. The trees are all green and healthy, in contrast to the other areas where the beetles have killed all the trees.

TK
 
Plowing a road on federal land without authorization is a CRIME. Might not be anything wrong with " nothing wrong with making a living on federal land" but commiting a crime (as this appears to be) certainly seems wrong to me. Do a quick google search and see that more than a few people have been charged for plowing federal roads. Forest road 351 last year comes to mind....

If they are logging it, then they are going to plow it. I imagine their permit only allows them to run to a certain date. So they have to get the wood out. Their permit will allow them to keep the roads open for logging truck and timber sale access.
 
Today's update is that is it s permitted logging operation who has it stipulated in their operating agreement to leave at a minimum 4" of packed snow on any road that they were plowing. So it looks like the company is in violation of their USFS operating agreement.

A group of us has been talking with the USFS to resolve the situation and recommended that the logging company put back 4" of snow pack in a track only 9' wide so the snowmobile club can groom and maintain this section. The local snowmobile club even said they would use the groomer for no cost to the usfs to help maintain and put back the snow necessary - again only a 9' section so that the logging company can get out what they need and we can have access. Happy ending for all!

With 4" of snow there would be no problem with the Cottonwood access and we would like to see them replace 4" of snow as it looks like it will be 7-10 days until we see snow and in that time the road will be all dirt.

Cat it something to think about is it is not only loggers who feed their families on USFS lands. Federal lands are all about mixed use and all commercial operations are bound by a operating agreement with the USFS. In this case it looks like they (logging company) did not abide by the operating agreement they were given and in turn is effecting the livelihood of others who make there living on federal lands. IMO all permitted by the USFS should operate with in their agreement, take responsibility for their actions of no adhering to their permit, and to put back the snow that they said they would not remove.

It is not fair for any permittee to operate out side of any USFS agreement and just expect all other users (both other commercial and private) to deal with it. This is the very reason we have these agreements in the first place. Operating outside of a permit will cause problems just like this one and it is the responsibility of the permittee to operate within the agreement as to avoid problems just like this one. Unfortunately in this case it looks like the logging company choose to operate outside of what they were permitted to do.
 
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Today's update is that is it s permitted logging operation who has it stipulated in their operating agreement to leave at a minimum 4" of packed snow on any road that they were plowing. So it looks like the company is in violation of their USFS operating agreement.

A group of us has been talking with the USFS to resolve the situation and recommended that the logging company put back 4" of snow pack in a track only 9' wide so the snowmobile club can groom and maintain this section. The local snowmobile club even said they would use the groomer for no cost to the usfs to help maintain and put back the snow necessary - again only a 9' section so that the logging company can get out what they need and we can have access. Happy ending for all!

With 4" of snow there would be no problem with the Cottonwood access and we would like to see them replace 4" of snow as it looks like it will be 7-10 days until we see snow and in that time the road will be all dirt.

Cat it something to think about is it is not only loggers who feed their families on USFS lands. Federal lands are all about mixed use and all commercial operations are bound by a operating agreement with the USFS. In this case it looks like they (logging company) did not abide by the operating agreement they were given and in turn is effecting the livelihood of others who make there living on federal lands. IMO all permitted by the USFS should operate with in their agreement, take responsibility for their actions of no adhering to their permit, and to put back the snow that they said they would not remove.

It is not fair for any permittee to operate out side of any USFS agreement and just expect all other users (both other commercial and private) to deal with it. This is the very reason we have these agreements in the first place. Operating outside of a permit will cause problems just like this one and it is the responsibility of the permittee to operate within the agreement as to avoid problems just like this one. Unfortunately in this case it looks like the logging company choose to operate outside of what they were permitted to do.

How exactly is the plowing of the road contributing to others economic loss??
No bash, it seems like a real inconvenient debacle for sleds, but still I see no economic effect to anyone.

Sam
 
How exactly is the plowing of the road contributing to others economic loss??
No bash, it seems like a real inconvenient debacle for sleds, but still I see no economic effect to anyone.

Sam

Right off the top of my head the Taylor Park Trading Post. They get alot of winter traffic from sleds coming over from Cottonwood. I am sure there are others.
 
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