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So I had a wonderful afternoon...

The wife calls me at work around 3:15 in a panic, yelling stuff I can't understand. So, I about puke because I'm thinking about Reb, our 7mo son. I tell her to slow down, and she tells me again to call the Vet, they are coming in with two of the three dogs (one is our 3yr old pupppy-Guyver, the other is the in-laws 7yo), something about eating a dead cat and they are seizing.:confused: Page the vet, we meet there ect...Anyway, they were on a walk and both ended up getting into a dead CALF that was in the ditch by our house (not our cattle) that was injected with, what looks like at this point, some type of organo-phosphate. Like only a few seconds later, the older dog was seizing in the road, my mother-in-law started running back to get the pickup, father-in-law drags her to the ditch and wait. Our dog Guyver, went over to the calf, and mom calls, but he dosen't come. By the time she runs back 1/4 mile and gets the pickup, Guyver is half way back. He jumps in, they grab Polly and come back to the yard. Then Guyver start seizing so in they come. The big dog is home, but our pup is staying the night and may not make it. He's unconscious, and might be developing renal failure (probably had some anti-freeze in it). He had a sustaind temp of 108 for at least two hrs. which didn't help his brain at all. We called the game warden and he went out (at 6pm) to triple bag it and was snooping around and found a dead coyote AND a dead friking eagle in the trees (he said stacked on each other which looks like human, not nature). He left them for evidence, as it's federal now. So, basically some chithead mother f***ing lowlife, injected a dead calf to kill coyotes, finds a dead eagle with his dead coyote, and comes and dumps that crap on our land, and now my dog might die. Why do people do stupid chit and not realize the consequences. I'm not even that but-hurt about the eagle and the federal offense thing, but burn the carcas or something. Don't freaking drag innocent people into you're stupid azz scheme, because you're too lazy to hunt coyotes, or even trap them. And some of you one here might poison coyotes. You know what, fine. I don't even care about that, I'm just raging pissed that they had to come dump it on our land. Why in the sam hell couldn't you at least drive it out in the middle of nowhere where there aren't humans and dogs... Sorry, first dog I've had (might be the last) and dang I love that dog...:brokenheart:
 
man that is a chitty deal! sorry to hear about the dogs! hope everything works out in the end and they catch the dill hole who did it!
 
I hope your dog makes it crazy 8. I dont know what I would do if I lost my pup of 6 years. They become a part of the family for sure. Thats a crappy situation, because some a$$holes ignorance. Good luck to you and your family.
 
Sorry to hear :(

I have worked on several ranches and maintained our land by injecting dead calfs with a product called "1080" you need a permit to carry it. Its pretty lethal, ive seen hawks drop out of the sky from eating it.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sodium_fluoroacetate

Read away. Its nasty stuff. Coyote's do not get far and neither do birds. I started using this stuff when I couldnt get out and coyote hunt as much in the spring during calving season. Every spring my brother and I would tag around 30-60 coyotes, when life happens we had to turn to poisions.

The 1080 toxin is IMO a nasty way to go about killing predetors or any animal.

Find out if that was used, there are restrictions to using it, and some states wont let you do it just because of your situation. We can use it in Wyoming just because of the sparse population and massive amounts of land.

:(:rose:

[edit] Toxicology

Fluoroacetate is highly toxic to mammals and insects.[3] The **** dose of fluoroacetate sufficient to be lethal in humans is 2–10 mg/kg.[10]
Species have different susceptibility to sodium fluoroacetate due to metabolic differences. The New Zealand Food Authority established lethal doses for a number of species.[11] Dogs, cats and pigs appear to be the species most susceptible to poisoning.[11]

[edit] Mechanism of action

Fluoroacetate is similar to acetate, which has a pivotal role in cellular metabolism. Fluoroacetate disrupts the citric acid cycle (also known as the Krebs cycle) by combining with coenzyme A to form fluoroacetyl CoA. This is then substituted for acetyl CoA in the citric acid cycle and reacts with citrate synthase to produce fluorocitrate. A metabolite of fluorocitrate binds very tightly to aconitase, thereby halting the citric acid cycle. This results in an accumulation of citrate in the blood which deprives cells of energy.[3]

[edit] Symptoms

In humans the symptoms of poisoning normally appear between 30 minutes and three hours after exposure. Initial symptoms typically include nausea, vomiting and abdominal pain; sweating, confusion and agitation follow. In significant poisoning cardiac abnormalities including tachycardia or bradycardia, hypotension and ECG changes develop. Neurological effects include muscle twitching and seizures; Consciousness becomes progressively impaired after a few hours leading to coma. Death is generally due to Ventricular arrhythmias, progressive hypotension unresponsive to treatment, and secondary lung infections.[3]
Symptoms in domestic animals vary: dogs tend to show nervous system signs such as convulsions and uncontrollable running, whilst large herbivores such as cattle and sheep more predominantly show cardiac signs.[citation needed]
Sub-lethal doses of sodium fluoroacetate may cause damage to tissues with high energy needs — in particular, the brain, gonads, heart, lungs and fetus. Sub-lethal doses are typically completely metabolised and excreted within four days.[citation needed]

[edit] Treatment

Because of the biochemical interference in the TCA or Krebs Cycle, sodium fluoroacetate poisoning is very difficult to treat, as once clinical symptoms are shown, the Krebs Cycle has shut down. There is no known effective antidote. Research in monkeys has shown that the use of glyceryl monoacetate can prevent problems if given after ingestion of sodium fluoroacetate, and this has been done in domestic animals with some positive results. The theory of using glyceryl monoacetate is that it will supply acetate ions to allow continuation of the cellular respiration process which the sodium fluoroacetate has disrupted.
In clinical cases, use of muscle relaxants, anti-convulsants, mechanical ventilation and other supportive measures may all be required. Few animals or people have been treated successfully after significant sodium fluoroacetate ingestions.

[edit] Environmental impact

Sodium fluoroacetate quickly decomposes in soil and water into harmless compounds, resulting in low persistence in the environment.[12]
 
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Thanks for the kind words. Nate, I totally understand the reason with doing this. My question is one, wouldn't you just drown the bird in gas and burn the somebietoch, or two, take it out away from the farms? Ya, I know, common sense thinking. Oh well. Oh, and Nate you might know, isn't there a product that you can use (a rancher I know down by Elk Mtn. I thought used it) that just makes the coyotes sick, to deter them from attacking again? I'm sure if there is, it dosen't work worth a crap, and that's why nobody uses it. :) Anyway, here's my boys...

REB6.jpg
 
Thanks for the kind words. Nate, I totally understand the reason with doing this. My question is one, wouldn't you just drown the bird in gas and burn the somebietoch, or two, take it out away from the farms? Ya, I know, common sense thinking. Oh well. Oh, and Nate you might know, isn't there a product that you can use (a rancher I know down by Elk Mtn. I thought used it) that just makes the coyotes sick, to deter them from attacking again? I'm sure if there is, it dosen't work worth a crap, and that's why nobody uses it. :) Anyway, here's my boys...


In Wyoming I call the game warden to come pick up the dead prey. If the weather is cold and the pelt is good I skin them out and burn the body. Game & Fish want the carcass. They do testing and what not on them.

I use 1080 for 1 reason and 1 reason only, and that is the fact it has without a doubt a 100% kill rating. Most of the time the prey dont make it much past 100 yards before laying down to seizure.

There is a MASSIVE movement going on trying to get rid of it. Rightfully so, its nasty stuff. It does kill alot of protected birds.

When we use it we usually tell all the ranch hands where the "infected zone" is, they check on that area about every 3-5 hours. The next morning is usually the busiest with the body count.

Yes there are other methods in detering prey off of your land. Most ranchers dont want to train coyotes to not eat the calves, dead or alive. They just want them gone. Other poisons work, but only 1 off the top of my head has a guranteed result.

I battle using this stuff myself. Being killed from the inside out is no way to go about dying, but when your on a 47,000 acre parcel of land its sometimes the only answer in protecting a few thousand head of cattle. In Wyoming, when it comes to killing prey, we kill by volume, if we dont it effects business.

1080 will be off the shelves soon, dead wolves are showing up more and more.
 
strict 9 is some bad **** too! my grandpa had some to kill gophers and he used a spoon to dish it out into holes. he put it in his tool box and forgot about it. over a year later he was feeding the dogs canned food and he needed a spoon and found one in his tool box. yup it was the spoon used to dish out that crap, his dogs were having seizures within 20 min and were all looped up from just eating food that was in contact with the spoon. and it had been bouncing around in his tool box for over a year. dogs got better and were ok in the end.
 
Wow what a d*ck! I hope they find the guy! Such a chicken **** way to deal with coyotes, especially in an area with humans and domestic animals around! I hope your dogs will be ok! I love my 6 year old lab....he is a pain in the a$$ a lot, but one hell of a hunter, companion, and awesome with my 2 boys. That would be one sad day if something like that happened to him. Hang in there bro!
 
that sucks to hear. we have had guys around here pull the same crap, our population is too high, and they get someones pet whenever they do it.
it only takes a teaspoon of an organo-phosphate to kill a full grown cow, shows how poisonous it is. thankfully they are going by the wayside with all the bt corn, so it is getting harder to get your hands on.
 
Well, the wife just talked to the Doc. A little progression since midnight, but still unconscious. He had some minor cardiac episodes, but that has resolved. We'll head down this afternoon and see him. It's looks like non-fatal organo-phosphate poisonings can take up to 48 hrs. to clear. The vet thinks his brain is out of neurotransmitters, and it needs some time to regenerate them. I NEVER EVER thought I'd be the guy to drop a few thousand on a dog, but at the slim hope he comes around, I can't help myself. That being said, if he has brain damage, he might not even be the same dog when he comes to. Jeeezzzus! Why do people have to be so stupid...:(
 
It's over...

No more worrying about making the decision. Guyver passed away at about 1:15 this afternoon. I've got a long afternoon ahead of me. Decided to bury him on the farm. He loved it out here. Put quite the scare into the coyotes for just being a little guy. Shessus! And nobody talk about the damn rainbow bridge thing or I'll smoke you with so much grey rep, you won't know what hit you! Farewell good buddy. We'll see ya on the other side:brokenheart:
 
Man that is seriously messed up.
Hope you dog gets better.

Also hope they catch the dumbazz.
 
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