SnoWest magazine: Yamaha 2017: Everything You Need to Know About the Sidewinder M-TX

[Motorbreath_]

I put the Zbroz upper arms and the 2016 spindles on our red Viper, went that way to keep the stock 38 inch lower arms and same shocks. AMAZING improvement in my opinion. Going to do it to my blue Viper also, highly recommended. I have not tried the stock 36 inch front ends so I have no input there.

Ya, I have this kit too. It did make the sled a lot better. I'd imagine the 36 inch kit will only be better. Will probably be a task to handle on the trail though.. but that doesn't bother me.

 

[0neoldfart]

Speaking the truth...

GUYS! Set up your Viper correctly first before you cry heavy. The Viper MTX and XTX came with a 110 pound spring in the front skid shock. Even the trail Vipers came with a 135 pound spring, and those of you with chassis experience know most front skid shocks run 160 or 180 pound spring. Riding a Viper with stock spring makes it feel like riding an Apex and putting a turbo on a sled with NO weight transfer makes it worse.

Christopher had a bad experience with turbo and chassis so I get it. But those of you that still have Vipers should spend the paltry sum for a spring before you lose big on your investment!

I stopped by Silverthorne Yamaha last Saturday and had the guys come out and lift the skis off the ground on my Viper and they were amazed. How can this spring thing be a big secret even dealers do not seem to know???

Think I am kidding? Look up the spring number on the online microfiche and google the spring rate. Yep a shock valved for a 180 spring has a 110 spring on it..............

My friend who has a new Doo and his wife has last years Doo rode my 285hp Viper and they loved it. Scared them both when they rode it, as soon as the skis get high enough you cant see in front of you it gets FUN! Doo is too tame, ok for girls sled though as it is so predictable but I like my sleds a little on the wild side.




Ok my point here is a stock Viper DOES feel like a heavy turd. FIX IT! PM me here and I will give you my phone number and I will help you if you wish. MY viper dances just like the 2014 M8 I replaced it with but that is miles from how it was stock. $80.00 spring from ZBROZ and done!

I agree 100%. My 13 M1100T was a tank out of the box, I replaced the front track shock spring almost immediately with a 160/260# spring from the race sled which made a huge difference in how the sled felt and handled. Since then, I've added a 16 front end and a kmod skid with custom rate springs that I had built. I'm not a professional rider, and I'm definitely middle aged, no where near the best shape of my life - and I can ride mine in the trees quite easily and keep up with the rest of the riders in my group - my Linderman built 925 M800 with a 162" x 3" usually sits in the trailer... Cat and Yamaha both missed the boat on suspension calibration with the 4S as they used the same setup as the lighter 2 strokes - must have been spending too much time riding trail sleds, or they never actually did any pre production testing - I've no clue as to why they were set up so poorly. The 4S proclimb chassis should have been a flagship for both companies, instead it was delivered as a barge. These sleds were labeled from the get go as being heavy belt blowers, and a good portion were hard on belts after power was added unless you beefed up the powertrain, but the ride and handling characteristics can be improved tenfold. Sad that even after I sent a few emails to Cat to discuss the suspension calibration (since 2013) they simply didn't do a damn thing about it - never even received a reply... the improvements were left to the consumer as per usual.

 

[christopher]

My bad then, memory is first thing to go!

And i can't remember what the 2nd was?

 

[BigFish BC]

Not trying to discredit you at all. But you are coming from a Nytro. I've done everything you said to do with my viper. It has helped a lot. I love the sled. But it is still too heavy.. my old Pro was powerless but so nice to ride. It's give or take. I think soon they will have 2 stroke turbos figured out.. then I'm out.

boost-it already have the 2 strokes dialed,they have less motors fail than stock.
if yamaha dosnt address some of the weight issues, my next sled wont be a yammi.
i can ride all my yammies just fine, but the weight gap has gotten to big & when you ride all the new sleds back to back its real noticeable.

 

[Motorbreath_]

boost-it already have the 2 strokes dialed,they have less motors fail than stock.
if yamaha dosnt address some of the weight issues, my next sled wont be a yammi.
i can ride all my yammies just fine, but the weight gap has gotten to big & when you ride all the new sleds back to back its real noticeable.

Awesome. I'm at sea-level though. I'm at the point that I'll put up with race gas rather than weight though.

I have heard good things about Boondocker turbo kits with low boost. Under 5 psi seems to be the magic number for sea level.. from what I've heard.

 

[BigFish BC]

Awesome. I'm at sea-level though. I'm at the point that I'll put up with race gas rather than weight though.

I have heard good things about Boondocker turbo kits with low boost. Under 5 psi seems to be the magic number for sea level.. from what I've heard.

Do yourself a favor & call the boost-it shop & talk with them,great guys & they are canadian so easyer & faster to get parts & support.
They make kits for cat,poo & doo.

 

[stingray719]

I agree 100%. My 13 M1100T was a tank out of the box, I replaced the front track shock spring almost immediately with a 160/260# spring from the race sled which made a huge difference in how the sled felt and handled. Since then, I've added a 16 front end and a kmod skid with custom rate springs that I had built. I'm not a professional rider, and I'm definitely middle aged, no where near the best shape of my life - and I can ride mine in the trees quite easily and keep up with the rest of the riders in my group - my Linderman built 925 M800 with a 162" x 3" usually sits in the trailer... Cat and Yamaha both missed the boat on suspension calibration with the 4S as they used the same setup as the lighter 2 strokes - must have been spending too much time riding trail sleds, or they never actually did any pre production testing - I've no clue as to why they were set up so poorly. The 4S proclimb chassis should have been a flagship for both companies, instead it was delivered as a barge. These sleds were labeled from the get go as being heavy belt blowers, and a good portion were hard on belts after power was added unless you beefed up the powertrain, but the ride and handling characteristics can be improved tenfold. Sad that even after I sent a few emails to Cat to discuss the suspension calibration (since 2013) they simply didn't do a damn thing about it - never even received a reply... the improvements were left to the consumer as per usual.

After much experimentation on both our Vipers the solution we found was changing the front skid shock spring to 160 or 180 depending on rider and adding Hygear chambers fron and rear - http://www.hygearsuspension.com/DualPressure.php

Difference was DAY AND NIGHT between stock and Hygear. Our other Viper had the front floats changed out to RC2 Floats with stock rear and that was great but still not as good as the cheaper Hygear chambers (less than $300 for fronts and $179 for rear). I also liked the Hygear because of how quick and easy they can be put on or taken off. Hygear sled can be set for soft ride and not bottom out, HIGHLY recommended.







EDIT: forgot to add, I did NOT use the Hygear link and a such had to slightly alter my stock link to get the Hygear to fit. Nothing against there link I just did not want to alter coupling.

 

[Climbmax]

Ripped the Sidewinder MTX last weekend. Firm spring snow at 6000' and it sidehilled real nice. Feels similar to Viper MTX on transition and ability to change directions on the mountain. Pulls way harder than a 180 kit overall. impromptu uphill drag race between the two. Pulled the Viper 180 by 8-10 lengths overall at 1000' distance. Most impressive was mid range pull and the throttle response. "Always on" as quoted by one of the fortunate ones who got a bit of time aboard it. Can hardly wait for November Pow conditions.

I know it will impress the skeptics.
Cheers
RS

 

[Motorbreath_]

I know it will impress the skeptics.

Its a Viper dressed up and powered up. I doubt anyone will be less skeptic after riding the sidewinder than they were after riding the Viper. Its a big heavy beast. I like my viper, but I can see why the majority of people out there don't ride one.

I'm sure the trail guys will love it though!

 

[Climbmax]

Its a Viper dressed up and powered up. I doubt anyone will be less skeptic after riding the sidewinder than they were after riding the Viper. Its a big heavy beast. I like my viper, but I can see why the majority of people out there don't ride one.

I'm sure the trail guys will love it though!

Ok whatever. Western guys love the big reliable HP and new chassis is a very comparable mountain sled. It boondocks and jumps like any current 2 stroke.
Cheers

 

[05900]

What kind of crater did that make upon reentry?

 

[RMKing1]

Is that Hoyer in the pic above Climbmax?

 

[awful knawful]

Well, as far as I can see its like this.
Yamaha Corporate, (and I suppose everyone who owns stock in that company), rather obviously DISAGREES with your revelatory insight. As does every person who has recently bought a new Yamaha and all the guys that are ordering new Turbo Sidewinders right now.

There is more to mountain snowmobiling that just having the lightest, most fragile, easily broken, shortest engine life sled money can buy.

For me, I rather like the idea of a bone stock full warranty factory boosted 204HP Turbo Sindewinder.

In your world its not possible to take out a Nytro or a Viper and have a good time. In mine, I have been doing it for 7 seasons now and LOVING it. And will no doubt be riding Yamaha next season again.

7 seasons? So you're brand loyal and biased?

The sales say different. Mountain riders want light weight! Poos were blowing motors left and right and were still #1 in the mountain segment. Doesn't sound like buyers give a crap about reliablity!!

 

[Climbmax]

lol......

 

[icr]

Vipers were blowing motors left and right too but allegedly Yamaha put stronger rods in.

 

[Climbmax]

Vipers were blowing motors left and right too but allegedly Yamaha put stronger rods in.

I don't think "left and right". Our friends in Altersbruk tested to find the limits so they destroyed the most. I know of only one North American Turbo builder who had a failure.
BTW....the Sidewinder motor is built for boost with a strong focus on very high HP output. I can hardly wait for the future
Safe sledding
RS

 

[Motorbreath_]

Ok whatever. Western guys love the big reliable HP and new chassis is a very comparable mountain sled. It boondocks and jumps like any current 2 stroke.
Cheers

I'm sure a couple westerners like them.. but not most guys. What two strokes are you talking about?? Must be mid 90s that are currently on the snow. Lol. Sorry.. but my viper does not handle as well as new 2 strokes.. they are just too heavy. The majority of the population feels this way.. it's not just me. However I own a trail viper and a mountain viper.. And all my buddies ride two stroke.. I should know as well. I honestly hope Yamaha has something up their sleeve for the mountain segment. I doubt I'll be sticking around to find out though.

 

[christopher]

Vipers were blowing motors left and right too but allegedly Yamaha put stronger rods in.

BULL CRAP they were!

 

[icr]

BULL CRAP they were!

Lol wouldn't expect you to believe anything negative about your beloved Yamaha, but there's plenty of reading over on TY about it. Several of the turbo companies quit selling viper kits and asked customers who already bought not to install because of the problem. Several stock motors lost rods. Yamahas own race team experienced the rod failure. Yamaha updated the rods, but hey, that's probably unrelated.

 

[christopher]

Lol wouldn't expect you to believe anything negative about your beloved Yamaha, but there's plenty of reading over on TY about it. Several of the turbo companies quit selling viper kits and asked customers who already bought not to install because of the problem. Several stock motors lost rods. Yamahas own race team experienced the rod failure. Yamaha updated the rods, but hey, that's probably unrelated.

Wait a sec.
Are you talking about after market boosted 2016 engines?

Or are you saying that OEM Viper Engines were BLOWING UP.