Shift assist a good thing or a bad thing. After running it, I'm leaning toward Bad.

[WyoBoy1000]

I don't know for sure but it seems to me when using a shift assist it works great at lower speeds but at higher shift stages all it does is help the secondary spring downshift restricting maximum track speed. I think the orange spring has to much pressure to get the best track speed. I say this because my sled rips off bottom but about the time it slows in upshift it then starts to down shift and pull rpm's down. I have also never been over 85mph on the trail (i know trail riding doesn't matter) but my primary is shifting out all the way, and not my secondary, and by doing so it is twisting my motor back before it will shift the secondary all the way out, it has also walked the belt over the primary, my track speed while climbing is also not as high as it should be. I either have a messed up secondary ( I have tried others though) or the spring is to stiff, or without the shift assist it lets it hold its shift point better rather than trying to back shift immediately. It has also destroyed motor mounts. I am running less clutch weight then other sleds as well. So is the shift assist a good thing, I think it is for boonedocking and lower speeds, but after that I think it can become a bad thing. Or what is my problem. The clutching worked great stock, but it has never been as good with mods and the shift assist. My belief is the orange spring works great on a stocker because in stock form the sled doesn't have the power to get into those stages of the secondary spring where it becomes to much. There is another m1000 like mine without a shift assist that pulls away, the one time It didn't I had the motor nearly mounted solid with a custom mount, which was way to stiff but proved my point that the clutching was causing a bind. On climbs the track speed goes to the same speed no matter the rpm but wont climb higher, almost like it locks up in gear until you let off.

 

[PowerJoe]

We have a group of 3 M7s and one in the group will get to 41mph track speed easily in the deep and the others are always at 36mph. I have coppied his clutching and not gained anything. I have ignored the shift assist just assuming that it would only help. I will definately try removing it, but I won't get to try it until after x-mas. Hopefully someone else on here has done some direct comparison with and without relative to track speed.

 

[WyoBoy1000]

Is the m7 turning 41mph running the shift assist. I usually don't ride tell after christmas but cooke has 29" and supposed to get about that much more over the next few days, well have to see though.

 

[PowerJoe]

M7 without shift assist is 41mph and 2 other M7s with shift assist at 36mph.

Here are the differences in sleds. All have stock motors and exhaust.

M7 with 41mph
- 2006 162 with challanger track and 10inch secondary

M7 with 36mph
- 2006 153 with challanger track and 10.4 secondary

M7 with 36mph
- 2005 with 162 powerclaw track and 10.4 secondary

2 things I haven't tried yet are switching back to the 10 inch clutch and removing the shift assist. Assumed that both would only help mph.

 

[sledr900]

I got rid of the shift assist.

Last year I battled with inconsistency in my RPMs when ever the conditions changed. I adjusted with changes in weights and primary/secondary spring tensions. Finally, last couple rides of the year I took out the shift assist and RPMs were consistent. Now, I just have to ditch the 40/36 progressive helix.
This was on a 2009 HCR.

 

[WyoBoy1000]

The 10.4 clutch give you better bottom end, once the belt drops in the secondary .2"(a total of .4) its the same as having a 10" secondary so I don't think that is going to help, the 10.4 should be better.

Well at least I'm not the only one. Thinking of trying a rkt kit, but I will be disappointed if the other m1000's still pulls with me or better. I will pull the S/A first.

 

[tchriste]

There was a post awhile back where RKT was talking about the orange spring and the problems with it....can't quite remember the title however it did end up in the clutching section and I believe the talk was about an M7. I use the shift assist, I find that it does allow faster up and down, could there be some over shoting due to sensitivity???? maybe but if your sled is trying to backshift is there another reason? Motor moving? I changed out my orange spring looking for a bit more track speed, however with the orange spring I did have good/stable rpm. While I'm not running an M1000 I am running an 09 HCR and I do like to make it dig.....

 

[mikew5945]

There was a post awhile back where RKT was talking about the orange spring and the problems with it....can't quite remember the title however it did end up in the clutching section and I believe the talk was about an M7. I use the shift assist, I find that it does allow faster up and down, could there be some over shoting due to sensitivity???? maybe but if your sled is trying to backshift is there another reason? Motor moving? I changed out my orange spring looking for a bit more track speed, however with the orange spring I did have good/stable rpm. While I'm not running an M1000 I am running an 09 HCR and I do like to make it dig.....

I think this is the thread:
http://www.snowestonline.com/forum/showthread.php?t=222843

M7 without shift assist is 41mph and 2 other M7s with shift assist at 36mph.

Here are the differences in sleds. All have stock motors and exhaust.

M7 with 41mph
- 2006 162 with challanger track and 10inch secondary

M7 with 36mph
- 2006 153 with challanger track and 10.4 secondary

M7 with 36mph
- 2005 with 162 powerclaw track and 10.4 secondary

2 things I haven't tried yet are switching back to the 10 inch clutch and removing the shift assist. Assumed that both would only help mph.

Sorry WYO, I don't want to turn this into a M7 BUT I have to say WOW on the grandma speeds.
I didn't know how good I had it.
2006 M7 153 challenger 36 helix. I held 48 mph on a climb at 8-10,000'. The 2009 Dragon 800 climbed 20-30' on me. I had the Titanium primary spring. 10" secondary with the green spring. I just changed to the RKT with duel spring 36/34P helix, orange/black primary hoping for the claimed top track speed. I also went to the power claw track. I am in the break in process for a new top end so I can not tell you if the track speed increased.

 

[Griff]

I believe the spring in the secondary is the key to obtaining the potential from the stock clutching. I found the stock orange spring to be more than I needed for my M8. I ran the stock AC white on my M7 and switched to Goodwin Blue. Then, on my M8 I ran the stock orange and switched it to the Goodwin Blue. Both sleds are stockers and in both cases there was a noticeable improvement. The Goodwin Blue is a just slightly lower initial rated spring than the AC orange. So, is there a happy medium between the AC white and the AC orange? Maybe,....the best working stock M7 I have seen was owned by a friend who rode it stock...with the AC white. I haven't had the nerve to try the AC white on my M8 as I tend to think it is too soft - any thoughts from the group on this??

Incidently, I also installed shift assist in both sleds after runnng the stock setup. I did not notice any seat of the pants improvement with it, or any decrease in performance either. It makes sense in principle so have left it in.

 

[WyoBoy1000]

What elevation, My m1000 is only turning about 47mph at 9-10k, but I have made fools out of stock xp's and piped dragons. Beat m8's even the 2010's. There was one m8 that got me, it was a 09 with dakota performance port and slp pipe and a lot of light weight stuff, we figured I was at least 75lbs heavier and he barely beat me, my clutch went out that day too so that might have been part of it. So my sled is no dog, I just feel there is more to be had. Maybe there is some speedo difference, as in it being off.
But my performance is down for sure. The other secondary I tried also had a S/A.

 

[jazzfan]

I ride a 2009 HCR and just recently did the Starting Line Performance package. I also put in the shift assist while I had everything apart. I havn't rode the sled yet but am I going to regret putting the shift assist in? You guys are making me nervous.

 

[AaronBND]

I ride a 2009 HCR and just recently did the Starting Line Performance package. I also put in the shift assist while I had everything apart. I havn't rode the sled yet but am I going to regret putting the shift assist in? You guys are making me nervous.

It's not going to blow up or anything. If you don't like it, spend 10 minutes taking it back out.

Aaron

 

[clutch]

Your clutching is not causing your motor to get out of alignment. Your motor getting out of alignment IS causing you clutching woes! I believe the orange spring to be to stiff to allow efficient clutching on any of the M's, but you need your motor to stay where it belongs before you start clutching. The shift assist actually speeds up upshift more than it affects backshift, and if you were on the edge of being too aggressively clutched and then add the shift assist it will cause you to loose rpm as it upshifts.

 

[WyoBoy1000]

I've got an extra mount on the motor and its breaking the bolts on it, with my mods the clutching should not be too much, and the other m1000 has the same mods and will pull 3g heavier weights, only diff at the time was a shift assist. I have thought of going with a shallower helix but a 36* with these mods should work. In fact I tried a 38* once and it pulled just as much track speed but at a lower rpm. So to me the shift assist is allowing the Orange spring to have more effect because it always happens at he same speed. Also my 07 m1000 would pull well over 50mph track speed with stock clutching and no shift assist,(some may be due to the better track but this is odd) on the trail it would hit 95mph in nothing flat and pull the whole way, the 09 pulls hard to around 60 then really drops off at 82mph and barely climbs(and the few times I do the belt usually go's boom, I think it climbing over the primary), I don't do a lot of high speed riding but the few time I did I sure noticed the difference. In my opinion my 09 has some serious motor movement problems and some might be from the powerclaw getting more traction and twisting the motor out of alignment and then one thing follows the next. But all in all the clutching is a problem. So its weather you can get it better with a S/A or without, or just chuck it and call RKT(which I prob will) but for all the cheap guys out there the S/A may not be what we thought it was. I do think it helps at low speeds. I am also very good at tranfering my weight as I am 210lbs and 6'6" so I can move around to get traction, which in turn just seems to pull the motor out of alignment and causes the clutching to lock up and quit shifting until I let off.

Even when I mounted the motor almost solid I could still feel there was some lack of clutching(clutches felt like they where playing a little catch up back and forth), but it was way better. On the trail the 38* helix pulled real hard to about 85mph???

I will be adding more mounts, 2 torque arms and a torque stop, if it still feels like there is movement I will run 4 torque arms total and stop. but I shouldn't have to.

How about some of the dealers on here, has no one thought of this, RKT what do you think.

 

[DonoBBD]

I believe the spring in the secondary is the key to obtaining the potential from the stock clutching. I found the stock orange spring to be more than I needed for my M8. I ran the stock AC white on my M7 and switched to Goodwin Blue. Then, on my M8 I ran the stock orange and switched it to the Goodwin Blue. Both sleds are stockers and in both cases there was a noticeable improvement. The Goodwin Blue is a just slightly lower initial rated spring than the AC orange. So, is there a happy medium between the AC white and the AC orange? Maybe,....the best working stock M7 I have seen was owned by a friend who rode it stock...with the AC white. I haven't had the nerve to try the AC white on my M8 as I tend to think it is too soft - any thoughts from the group on this??

Incidently, I also installed shift assist in both sleds after runnng the stock setup. I did not notice any seat of the pants improvement with it, or any decrease in performance either. It makes sense in principle so have left it in.

WE have tested the white spring over and over and it is 185/260 the Blue spring you talk about is as tested 220/307. The orange is 233/280 in the same rig as tested 2.4 then 1.63".

We have found the shift assist will pull 200 rpm's from the clutching and you need to take two grams from the fly weights.

For the gentleman that started the post take a good look at your primary spring. It sounds to me that your bouncing off your up shift. Try doing your pull then let off the flipper and mash it again. IF your track speed gos up you need to make room for the primary spring to grow in the spider cup. You can tell that your paint on the primary spring will be worn off and wearing through the spring. The marks on the weights from the rollers will tell you a story too. The shift will full shift but only for a second then back shift because your bouncing off the primary springs binding.

Don.

 

[Destroyer]

i'm running at least a couple hundred rpm low I'm going to try 70's instead of 71.5's tommorow. Hoping for the best.

Showing slip marks from about 1/2" from the top of the primary down about the width of the belt???

A hair of slip marks up higher on the secondary sheaves as well.

Clutch temps were pretty cool everytime I touched them

 

[WyoBoy1000]

The heat on my clutches is always ridiculous, to the point of instant burn. I do put hard pulls on, from what I remember when I let of and get on it there isn't much change in overall T/S, but I am very quick to get transfer and traction which seems to pull on the motor. My spring has always bound/worn paint off even after opening the cup. The weights have wear marks from the rollers the full shift. Yet I have never seen top speed, it looks like the primary has been at full shift more than a few times. Every time a belt goes it leaves marks like it just climbed over the top. I'm guessing somewhere along the way, I manage to get grip which pulls the motor out of alignment and locks up the shift, also when its pulling the motor back lets the primary shift all the way out, but rather than the secondary catching up it just binds. I have ran the MTX weights at slp's recommended weight, less weight, 4 diff primary springs, MDS weights, stock weight, ground stock weights, a 44/36r helix, a 42/36r helix, stock helix. Aligned clutches many times,

 

[noisycricket]

griff were did you get your goodwin blue spring and do you have a part # I look and the onlyt blue spring I could find was really low, also has anyone tried the h5 speedwerx springs in a stock m8

 

[WyoBoy1000]

Dono, where do I get the washers to go in the primary. I have also dropped weight and increased my rpm from 7350-7600 and no track speed was gained. Just remembered, when I had the custom motor mount in (i only put the mount in and nothing else) my rpm's went from 73-7400 to 7850, If that doesn't tell you how bad it is I don't know what will.

 

[M.M. 700]

Dono, where do I get the washers to go in the primary. .

if u are talking about the glide washers, here you go
http://www.thunderproducts.com/glide_washer.htm