Just bought new coilovers and wondering if anyone has good middle of the road sag numbers front and back for a starting point. Static and rider sag numbers would be great for reference. Thanks
Sag Numbers
- Thread starter Seabass152
- Start date
going to depend on the spring rates of the new coilovers, id call the manufacture of the coilover or start with factory specs and go from there
T
TheBreeze
Well-known member
I agree. Its suprising how little suspension setup is really talked about, in particular sag settings compared to the dirt bike world, where static and rider sag are routinely talked about, tweaked, and checked.
All I can add, is that with my raptor shocks I have significantly more static and rider sag than how the sled came set up with the stock shocks.
All I can add, is that with my raptor shocks I have significantly more static and rider sag than how the sled came set up with the stock shocks.
Like TheBreeze said, there are sag numbers that work with each sled and may be differ for different types of riding(pow, ditch banging, jumping). The springs rates vary according to rider weight to get you to those preferred sag numbers.
I'm being lazy and hoping someone did the testing and found those numbers. My shock company didn't really have a answer for me.
S
snobyrd
Well-known member
I also have raptor shox and with thier settings at 10.5 for rear trax shox, i get about 3.5 inches of static sag plus another 2 inches with a rider on it, compared to about 1.5 static inches on a stock suspension.
Ive often wondered if the softer suspension of the raptors is a negitive when it comes to deep snow performance, causing low ground clearances to the running boards .
Whats your opinion on this.
J
JJ_0909
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That does sound excessive - Where are you measuring sag?
I've noticed excessive sag with my raptor shocks as well. They ride nice, but I do wonder if it could have a negative effect as stated by the op.
Front track shock preload will greatly effect your rear sag. A slightly to stiff FTS, makes the rear of the sled want to pivot on the front of the skid and results in too much sag at the rear bumper. Remove a couple turns of preload and you will see the sag quickly reduce. Eric
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snobyrd
Well-known member
I had my fts spring almost loose with min preload with 3 clicks and the rts set at 10.5 inch, i even tighten that spring up by 1/4 inch and still only reduced 1/2 inch off sag.
I even tried increasing the fts spring to 8.25 at the recomended settings.
I removed the rts and presently run stock cause i feel losing running board clearance is defeating the deep snow performance the axys is made for.
Im starting to think all the things were modifying on our sleds are interfearing with the intensions the pol engineers have.
I guess we cant have smooth tral ride and deep sno performance in the same suspension at the same time.
I believe you are 100% correct about making them plush and losing some positive attributes. I have spent much time trying to get the best of both worlds with stock v.s. aftermarket parts. What I have settled on is stock clicker shocks with Raptor triple rate springs for a decent ride but there was too much transfer and sag so I engage our Source Innovations Suspension Coupler once the trail ride in is over. The result is the sled feels as the rear shock is tightened up when the coupler is engaged and this reduces sag and transfer on steep climbs.
J
JJ_0909
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This is an interesting thread...
I think a number of people are looking to "have their cake" and "eat it too".
I get that we all want a nice and plush ride into the zone. However, those of you running excessive sag, aren't you bottoming a lot too? Doesn't the sled push like crazy in corners? Doesn't the sled have excessive body role?
Sag settings should be run close to stock. I don't care what shock or spring you are running, if you are running too much sag, you aren't doing yourself any favors. In fact, the sled is going to feel harsher even on trail as you have less available travel. Use compression damping to change the of the ride in/out of the zone. (the rate in which the suspension cycles through its travel)
Only in extreme situations should you be changing the sag point. I get that triple rate springs were designed to be a progressive coil spring, but what I think people are finding is they either run too little sag and never use all travel or have too much sag and though never bottom, end up with an ill riding sled as the snowmobile is riding too low in its travel.
I see this all the time in mountain bike world where I'm a suspension tester. Unless you are a top pro, linear suspension with some form of bottom out control and compression adjust is going to be best.
I think a number of people are looking to "have their cake" and "eat it too".
I get that we all want a nice and plush ride into the zone. However, those of you running excessive sag, aren't you bottoming a lot too? Doesn't the sled push like crazy in corners? Doesn't the sled have excessive body role?
Sag settings should be run close to stock. I don't care what shock or spring you are running, if you are running too much sag, you aren't doing yourself any favors. In fact, the sled is going to feel harsher even on trail as you have less available travel. Use compression damping to change the of the ride in/out of the zone. (the rate in which the suspension cycles through its travel)
Only in extreme situations should you be changing the sag point. I get that triple rate springs were designed to be a progressive coil spring, but what I think people are finding is they either run too little sag and never use all travel or have too much sag and though never bottom, end up with an ill riding sled as the snowmobile is riding too low in its travel.
I see this all the time in mountain bike world where I'm a suspension tester. Unless you are a top pro, linear suspension with some form of bottom out control and compression adjust is going to be best.
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I run my RTS spring on my raptors .25" shorter than recommended (10.25") and it takes care of almost all of the sag that was there at the recommended 10.5" length. The sled still rides like a Cadillac and is super playful, so why not try tightening it up??
S
snobyrd
Well-known member
I did crank my spring up to almost 10 inches and reduced the sag by 50%, but i still wasnt happy, i would still high center on the boards compared to my friends stock suspension, and i also noticed , if the sled was layed on its side it would loose traction. I think like teth air said, using a coupler to help firm the suspension in the play areas is the only alternative to go if we wanna have nice soft springs.
J
JJ_0909
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I'll leave it at this, but I'd challenge the idea that anyone should want "nice soft springs". "nice" and "soft" being the two words that don't go together.
Put another way, what is better in demanding situations, a Cadillac or an track prepped M3?
Which of the two is plush? Which of the two is performance based and firm?
How much do you weigh? Could be pushing the limit of the standard spring and maybe need the firm... I weigh 170 and have no issues.
S
snobyrd
Well-known member
170sh with gear on.
I started this thread to determine what excessive sag is. Stock in season 155, the rear was blowing right through and smacking the stops hard on small stuff. Installed some Elka shocks and sag looks roughly the same but no bottoming unless expected. I am getting more push but I feel that is due to the front riding slightly taller and stiffer. No adjustments yet, out of the box settings so far.
Can anyone share their stock sled sag numbers for reference since I forgot to get them before I removed the shocks? How about using the end of the lip on the tunnel as a point of measure for the rear and in the front, the center body line on the bottom tub where the stock bumper brace attaches through the tub?
