I just finished installing the drop in kit in my 13 pro. Took 4hrs. Then I spent 1 hr to weld in an O2 bung for my AFR gauge and wiring in the new Boondocker fuel box. I ran it enough to fill the coolant and get rid of air bubbles. It ran smoother and reved up faster...on the track stand. Tomorrow I should be able to get it out on the snow. Nice product but just to put everything new it would have been nice to get a brand new bearing for the wrist pin...but no big deal re-using the old one. The cylinder was very easy to put back on the new pistons and I was able to leave the exhaust valves and y pipe on the cylinder. The worst part was trying remove the injectors without removing the airbox...still wasn't that bad a job.
RK Tech "Drop In" kit
- Thread starter Timberview01
- Start date
By the way the stock pistons have 450mi on them and they looked good...no scaring whatsoever. But they were rediculously loose in the jugs. There was next to no piston wash on either piston...Makes me wonder if the stock motor could use a fuel box as well.
Update
The new boondocker fuel box works good. Easy to tune. I'm running it based on duty cycle right now because I need to tap into the tos sensor to get a signal... I don't know why boondocker didn't just wire it into the harness. IMO the fuel box is mandatory on a 2013. It would cut out on the top end even in eth mode. This is for 13.5 domes at 3000'.
The sled is way more responsive then stock. The water temp. Seems to run way hotter then stock. I'm wondering if someone had this same issue and corrected it somehow?
It is a way smoother engine now as well. Put 30mi on today.
The new boondocker fuel box works good. Easy to tune. I'm running it based on duty cycle right now because I need to tap into the tos sensor to get a signal... I don't know why boondocker didn't just wire it into the harness. IMO the fuel box is mandatory on a 2013. It would cut out on the top end even in eth mode. This is for 13.5 domes at 3000'.
The sled is way more responsive then stock. The water temp. Seems to run way hotter then stock. I'm wondering if someone had this same issue and corrected it somehow?
It is a way smoother engine now as well. Put 30mi on today.
S
snobyrd
Well-known member
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geo
Well-known member
The new boondocker box for the Pro needs to have the engine running to sync in the throttle positions or it will not display just sense. No need to add another wire.
The reason for this is they display and read the voltage using the chassis ground not the computor (if your just powering up the ECM). There may also be something here involving the new single voltage regulator because the box senses a higher voltage than is actually present at the TPS.
Anyhow it is important to sync in to your sled because the installed #'s will leave you short of using all throttle positions available and in a wierd configuration of throttle positions. I have had good luck since new and now I understand why it is different.
This is a quirk I found with mine and after a lot of questions and a very helpful person in the know I got these answers . Thanks Dave.
Another thing to be aware of, is this box will use the same stock ECM modifications to the fuel curve for elevation and temp, etc. in the PCT mode but not in the duty cycle mode. So mildly modified may be better with PCT mode.
Coolant temp. I've observed this with mine (temp spike under load) even when stock. The more I load the motor the quicker it happens. Read lot's about these motors falling off and talk about backshift etc. For me it is not a clutching issue and I can unload the motor with clutching (keeping the same rpm) and it takes longer to get to the temp spike but still happens. As soon as you shut down it cools right down (no matter what snow conditions) so I think the heat exchangers are doing their job.
I've posted this comparison of coolant temp on the gauge to power fall of a couple of times but no others replied that they observed the same.
I'm just learning these motors this season so I am a little leary to try things (cause they've been modified and worked on for 3 yrs now). But I think the motor self protects around 129 ,130 131 degrees and start to lose a bit of power. And, i think it has something to do with an overly sensitive coolant temp sensor in worst-case-senario position in the head.
I've thought about making it into more of a heat sink reader by making a housing for it between the head and the sensor with a smaller bleed hole (instead of direct rush of coolant onto the sensor like stock). But I'm still thinking lol.
Anyone else thinking lol.
The reason for this is they display and read the voltage using the chassis ground not the computor (if your just powering up the ECM). There may also be something here involving the new single voltage regulator because the box senses a higher voltage than is actually present at the TPS.
Anyhow it is important to sync in to your sled because the installed #'s will leave you short of using all throttle positions available and in a wierd configuration of throttle positions. I have had good luck since new and now I understand why it is different.
This is a quirk I found with mine and after a lot of questions and a very helpful person in the know I got these answers . Thanks Dave.
Another thing to be aware of, is this box will use the same stock ECM modifications to the fuel curve for elevation and temp, etc. in the PCT mode but not in the duty cycle mode. So mildly modified may be better with PCT mode.
Coolant temp. I've observed this with mine (temp spike under load) even when stock. The more I load the motor the quicker it happens. Read lot's about these motors falling off and talk about backshift etc. For me it is not a clutching issue and I can unload the motor with clutching (keeping the same rpm) and it takes longer to get to the temp spike but still happens. As soon as you shut down it cools right down (no matter what snow conditions) so I think the heat exchangers are doing their job.
I've posted this comparison of coolant temp on the gauge to power fall of a couple of times but no others replied that they observed the same.
I'm just learning these motors this season so I am a little leary to try things (cause they've been modified and worked on for 3 yrs now). But I think the motor self protects around 129 ,130 131 degrees and start to lose a bit of power. And, i think it has something to do with an overly sensitive coolant temp sensor in worst-case-senario position in the head.
I've thought about making it into more of a heat sink reader by making a housing for it between the head and the sensor with a smaller bleed hole (instead of direct rush of coolant onto the sensor like stock). But I'm still thinking lol.
Anyone else thinking lol.
S
snobyrd
Well-known member
geo I agree with u about the issue not being a back shift issue, I honestly think it's electrical, and if it is coolant temp, couldn't we just solder inline a resistor to fool the engines temp, I guess the only thing is if it really gets hot we got no protection.
geo with my controller, r u saying I don't need to tap into the tps, and just enter my settings in the 13 % mode while the sled is running?
funny thing is, before I put my 13.5 head and piston kit in, my wash was 99% carbon, now after the kit with no controller my wash is 75% carbon, and wen I do add fuel specially in the mid, the throttle responce sucks the big one, and all of this is in deep pow sno
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geo
Well-known member
In the instructions it tells you where to read your TPS position at idle then again at wide open. With these numbers again the instructions tell you how to do the math and install the correct numbers in the proper throttle positions so you get a spread like they wan`t. Yes you have to be in the 13 rpm mode to do this.
I wouldn`t do the resistor thing myself and there are good alternatives in other threads (ie TRS and the Doo thermo). I was just thinking different because those engines run cooler so,,,
Sometimes modifications don`t need added fuel cause they are more efficient. I`m not familiar with yours or what yr of Poo 'putor but my 13 needs fuel every where lol.
I wouldn`t do the resistor thing myself and there are good alternatives in other threads (ie TRS and the Doo thermo). I was just thinking different because those engines run cooler so,,,
Sometimes modifications don`t need added fuel cause they are more efficient. I`m not familiar with yours or what yr of Poo 'putor but my 13 needs fuel every where lol.
Geo,u should compare your findings to a std rmk 800,i have a 2013 with the bulkhead cooler.my operating temps are steady 51-53 degree celsius.my 2011PRO was mostly over 60 degrees and up to 75,i have thought many times that there most be a self protect function based on temp and trottle position since they clearly loose power with over 60 degrees.when riding in the same conditions,you can feel the tunnel coolers on PRO is alot hotter than on the std rmk.(the switchback assault also have bulkhead cooler)
On the 2013 pros the tps is already being read, but the 11&12's need to be wired direct. My dealer said that the engine won't protect itself till 185f and that it should not hurt it at all to run it warm. Mine runs consistently warmer, but the temps don't spike anymore. Also I only have 30mi on it, so I would expect it to make a little less heat once it breaks in. These sleds are now burning more fuel therefore asking more heat then stock.
So after running this kit for 250mi I've found the following.
The kit makes more heat, enough that the ecu was protecting itself. I was pulling 62gr weights at 7000' and getting 8450-8500rpm but the temps were up to 156-160F while climbing. I just put the $28 upgrade tstat in and now I am running 104F in the powder and 111-116F on the trail where I was at 140-150F before....in my opinion it seems to have cured the high heat issue!
Is 104F too cold for this engine?
The kit makes more heat, enough that the ecu was protecting itself. I was pulling 62gr weights at 7000' and getting 8450-8500rpm but the temps were up to 156-160F while climbing. I just put the $28 upgrade tstat in and now I am running 104F in the powder and 111-116F on the trail where I was at 140-150F before....in my opinion it seems to have cured the high heat issue!
Is 104F too cold for this engine?
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snobyrd
Well-known member
I agree with u 100% buck, but the funny thing is , all the engine gods Iv spoken to say 145, but I disagree, there's more power at lower temps, and my tach shows it by staying up in rpms instead of falling of to 78/7900 and runnin worse than a stocker, geo also has the same findings with his slp head and pipe.
what are your numbers now after being to the hills, and wats your clutch settup?
buck, did u sync your tps, my idle number was 65 and my wot was 228
what are your numbers now after being to the hills, and wats your clutch settup?
buck, did u sync your tps, my idle number was 65 and my wot was 228
I have to check my numbers for you. I just left it on duty cycle for now and found it reacted quick enough.
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snobyrd
Well-known member
buckshot, did u do a compression test after install, also r u runnin any av gas, I'm runnin same heads as u on 91 with no det and my compression is 138-140, it just seams odd that I can run 13.5s at 3500' to 5000'
I am running 91 and have not had a chance to check compression. It's broke in enough now though.
O
ottawaair
Active member
I am bringing this thread back up. I have some questions.
2012 pro 800
Im running RK-Tek direct replacement pistons, then got his billet head, 12.5:1, riding in low elevations.
I recently bought a boondocker box, and have some questions.
I've figured out how to do most of the functions, 13 rpm mode/5rpm mode, % or fixed, etc.
I have the tps wire connected, and have the hi/lo tps numbers, but haven't done the math yet.
My first question is after running thru and adjusting the fuel, it goes to accel pump +/-, Duration +/- , and sensitivity +/-...
Do these need to be adjusted also ???
so far i have added fuel in midrange, 4,000-6,750, and left the other numbers at zero.
Also, im considering an afr gauge, to be safe, and get the most out of controller.
What gauges are you guys using. I looked at the ngk unit, but it's kinda spendy at $300.
Any better options ???
Thanks for any input.
2012 pro 800
Im running RK-Tek direct replacement pistons, then got his billet head, 12.5:1, riding in low elevations.
I recently bought a boondocker box, and have some questions.
I've figured out how to do most of the functions, 13 rpm mode/5rpm mode, % or fixed, etc.
I have the tps wire connected, and have the hi/lo tps numbers, but haven't done the math yet.
My first question is after running thru and adjusting the fuel, it goes to accel pump +/-, Duration +/- , and sensitivity +/-...
Do these need to be adjusted also ???
so far i have added fuel in midrange, 4,000-6,750, and left the other numbers at zero.
Also, im considering an afr gauge, to be safe, and get the most out of controller.
What gauges are you guys using. I looked at the ngk unit, but it's kinda spendy at $300.
Any better options ???
Thanks for any input.
G
geo
Well-known member
I found no advantage changing any accel #'s from stock last season.
I still use visual and feel. Don't trust probes in an expansion chamber or simply shooting for an air fuel ratio. Old school maybe but after years of watching and hoping for easy tuning, I still see all the questions that can only be answered and adjusted by feel, visual confirmation and experience.
Fuel #'s should work with the load applied. One set-ups "safe" can be another set-ups burn down.
I still use visual and feel. Don't trust probes in an expansion chamber or simply shooting for an air fuel ratio. Old school maybe but after years of watching and hoping for easy tuning, I still see all the questions that can only be answered and adjusted by feel, visual confirmation and experience.
Fuel #'s should work with the load applied. One set-ups "safe" can be another set-ups burn down.
your tpsreading should have worked without the extra wire connected,you have the box that just plugs into the ecu right..??
anyway reguardless..I ignored the acceleration function and have it at inactive for now..
I use a koso a/f and koso egt which were installed and safe numbers established a few seasons prior to the new box so I feel somewhat safe setting to my old base line as my mods have not changed...just my controller..but I still do a visual as well
so far I really like this new boondocker box..
generally bogs are lean and sputters are rich...but that's a general only..
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ottawaair
Active member
The box i have has a harness that plugs in between the injector harness, and a single wire that connecs to the TPS wire going to the ecu.
No direct plugs into ecu.
Thanks for the info on the accel pump. I actually think its for nitrous applications for more fuel when nos is on.
Im gonna skip the A/F gauge for now and just keep checking plugs and pistons.
Another question i have is........... If i do all this tuning in say 28 degrees and get plugs/wash looking good, then go to U P and ride in 0 degree weather, will the computer compensate for the temps ???
Or should i have a map stored with richer fuel #'s that i could switch to.
