Rear Suspension Talk

[JJ_0909]

any more talk on this? whats working o control the wheely monster??

I work for Tom's so obviously I'm going to say this...

https://tomsshocks.com/collections/...n4-rear-suspension-package-torsion-bar-delete

This way you can a higher spring rate & compression damping in the rear shock, as well as better geometry, to dial in ski lift just to the point you want it to be - all with keeping the front end nice and light. Personally I think its super awesome to be able to tune the amount of lift (spring rate) and the rate in which the lift comes on (compression damping)

But yeah, if you don't want to spend $1600 - I hear good things about the KISS coupler, but its kind of a pain to keep going back and forth from coupled to uncoupled. Buddy with one does like it, and it isn't crazy expensive obviously.

I've got a Fox QS3 shock that used the torsion bars (direct from fox) I was super unimpressed wtih. Only so much one can do without going UP in spring rate (or coupling the skid)

 

[Ace Freely]

165 X.
- revalved by BJ for weight
- ZRP relocation bracket
- ZRP t motion delete.
- limiter stock

... this did wonders for 600ish bucks.


Ace

 

[skank]

Do you know that part # for the heavy duty rear springs on a 2018 165 Freeride?

Rears
503192271
503192270

Fronts
505074309

I recently installed these on my 18 165 freeride and love the difference!

 

[Clutched Films]

Timbersled rear skid

I'm running the new 2018 Timbersled Haha. Originally for a 2010 this rearskid relocates the the rear arm 2" further back. This will be the 4th sleds it's been in still working great and out performing stock. Road mt Adams yesterday really whooped out on the way up she held togeather. And I'll have to put my limiter strap back in the stock position, amazing 2" back and no t-motion this sled climbs and sidehills like it should stock haha. Now it's time to get some professional help have a shop CNC up a one pice rail brace/mount. Probably carry the brace back to the factory kink in the rails. You can never have to much bracing on a skid haha. It will be nice not looking like a drunk hill billy with bubble gum welded parts haha.

 

[Matte Murder]

Different sled so maybe not good info for you. 18 X 175. Stock X shocks are just as soft as they have been for the last 5 years especially the fronts. Look at the spring wire, it’s tiny and it’s made from crap steel so it gets really soft in just 5-6 rides and the damping is also soft both in comp and rebound. The rear track shock seemed really soft to the point of pulling the skis off the snow on take off even with an easy throttle. Made the sled a bear on tight trails, squirrelly on the road ride in and very hard to control I’m the deep heavy snow we’ve been riding in.
I bought the QRS3 shocks straight from Fox. All 4. Kept the t-motion active and the torsion springs. Have a couple rides in. Front shocks are a LOT better. Can turn the sled now in deep snow(deep and heavy, haven’t had a good pow day yet) and on the tight trails. I’ve been adding preload to the front each ride, about 5/8” total now, going to try a little more but need good snow now. Still takes a bit more input to get it too turn downhill in a steep slow side hill tho. The 3 settings on the compression damping are too soft. I never run them on anything but 3, would be nice to have 3 as the base and two more stiffer settings for the 175. I’ll talk to Tom about a revavle at the end of this season.
The rear is way better too. Nose stays down so it turns better. Really easy to keep the nose down climbing the steeps even when the traction is really high. Pretty impressed by that but the sled stock wasn’t a wheelie monster either.

 

[Skidoo bachelor]

Will the relocation bracket work with the zbros KISS system?

 

[Devilmanak]

Different sled so maybe not good info for you. 18 X 175. Stock X shocks are just as soft as they have been for the last 5 years especially the fronts. Look at the spring wire, it’s tiny and it’s made from crap steel so it gets really soft in just 5-6 rides and the damping is also soft both in comp and rebound. The rear track shock seemed really soft to the point of pulling the skis off the snow on take off even with an easy throttle. Made the sled a bear on tight trails, squirrelly on the road ride in and very hard to control I’m the deep heavy snow we’ve been riding in.
I bought the QRS3 shocks straight from Fox. All 4. Kept the t-motion active and the torsion springs. Have a couple rides in. Front shocks are a LOT better. Can turn the sled now in deep snow(deep and heavy, haven’t had a good pow day yet) and on the tight trails. I’ve been adding preload to the front each ride, about 5/8” total now, going to try a little more but need good snow now. Still takes a bit more input to get it too turn downhill in a steep slow side hill tho. The 3 settings on the compression damping are too soft. I never run them on anything but 3, would be nice to have 3 as the base and two more stiffer settings for the 175. I’ll talk to Tom about a revavle at the end of this season.
The rear is way better too. Nose stays down so it turns better. Really easy to keep the nose down climbing the steeps even when the traction is really high. Pretty impressed by that but the sled stock wasn’t a wheelie monster either.

The 175/old 174 has a different rear suspension geometry than the 165/154 sleds. It came from the original (2011/2012? ) Freeride sleds when they were actually race/hillclimb sleds, to keep the front end down. No wheelies. Why Doo can't put that rear arm on the shorter sleds, I do not know.
On my 175 Summit, I put on the optional stiffer front ski springs, and the rear orange bushings (too many beers, can't remember the company) and call it good. Mountain sled, not trail sled. But it works pretty darned well, at least until the oil gets cooked, as mentioned above. Time to change oil.

 

[fredw]

Been playing with rear skid on 175 since Christmas.. What we found that's works for me in steep and deep with out losing anything for sidehilling..

We have sucked limiter up 5 holes, also gives a much better attack angle and holds skis to surface in steep...

Removed front stabilizer bar, then tmotion delete, finnally put rear scissor back 1/2 inch on the stock rails.. Involved drilling two holes.. Loose around a inch of rear clearance p..

All this is very cheap to do and sled is so much more predictable than before, it climbs well in steep and holds skis down well.. Sag is minimal

 

[Wapow]

Sucked up limiter 5 holes and moved the rear scissor back?!? You must really love ski pressure.

 

[cacsrx1]

Sucked up limiter 5 holes and moved the rear scissor back?!? You must really love ski pressure.

Yikes ....I was thinking the same.

 

[fredw]

Yes I like to take my summit to summits.. Not much a guy for skis two feet from snow anymore in steep/deep

 

[White Rad]

I had my rear skid shock completely explode and blow all the oil out. Replaced it with the full raptor kit. Rode it yesterday with the t motion locked out. Pretty hard to tell in snow that deep how well it was performing but when we were pounding the first tracks in up a couple long pulls the sled felt very controlled planted and smooth when rolling in hot on a bouncy trenched out track and really soaked up the hit from the 5ft headwall where the last guy turned out. Too busy riding to play around with tuning anything but I might play around with some more set up later.

 

[DRIVEBYE]

I had my rear skid shock completely explode and blow all the oil out. Replaced it with the full raptor kit. Rode it yesterday with the t motion locked out. Pretty hard to tell in snow that deep how well it was performing but when we were pounding the first tracks in up a couple long pulls the sled felt very controlled planted and smooth when rolling in hot on a bouncy trenched out track and really soaked up the hit from the 5ft headwall where the last guy turned out. Too busy riding to play around with tuning anything but I might play around with some more set up later.

Sounds great, Come on down to Utah you can hit bushes and rocks to get that thing turned in real nice.

 

[Ace Freely]

Is it physically possible to suck up the limiter 5 holes?

Ace

 

[fredw]

Yes it's sucked up tight..

I added the coil spring inserts for this last ride and I gotta say, this has to be the best upgrade I think you can do for rear sag, with the setting now on 5, and a 260lb rider full gear and fuel, the rear skid does not even drop 1 mm.. Can't beleve doo does not add this from factory, such a easy fix, for there rear sag problem

Would think now with this coil mod you could let out the limiter a hole or two, sled almost feels front heavy, can't wait to try it out under boost..

Is it physically possible to suck up the limiter 5 holes?

Ace

 

[Ace Freely]

These from Doo?

Ace

 

[fredw]

Was told they sold them in the past, not sure about now, there is a few aftermarket guys making them, I bought mine from Rene st Onge in sicamous

Best rear skid sag cheap mod out there..

 

[JJ_0909]

I do think its interesting some of you want to ride without sag.

The entire system needs to work together to give the ride you are looking for.

Under boost, the no-sag setup (with a Tom's kit or heavy duty coil springs) works fine in steeper terrain but puts *so* much weight on the skis its not a very fun ride elsewhere. Remember, unlike a stock setup, a boosted setup isn't going to transfer weight very well down low (heavy clutching, pushing air through the turbo - you are going to lose the snap that puts that weight on the skid immediately)

I've got a setup now in limiter 3 with a fair amount of sag that still controls (key word, controls) transfer while being a thousand times more fun elsewhere. It puts more weight on the skid in a neutral position (again, due to sag) but then relies on the progressive nature (and EVOL chamber) to stop the transfer in a very progressive way from here.

This is one reason I love air. It lets me go to this setup when appropriate, but with a shock pump go to something more front heavy when appropriate.

Also, compression adjust is super nice to control rate of transfer.

 

[cacsrx1]

Locked out Z Motion and a good set of shocks are night and day difference over a stocker.

 

[fredw]

Sag does nothing but hurt you in steep and deep, it's great to have strategic guys set up to take the perfect pictures in the medows or put in a movie but not a pratical feature for guys pushing the limit, sag causes skis to be off ground and no control..