Any one heard of putting two stroke oil or atf in the fuel to lube injecters? Heard that from a guy at work. I have a 04 Powerstroke and it's had injecters replaced under warrantee twice. My warrantee is up soon so I was wondering what i could do to prevent future problems. I change fuel filter every 20-30k and recently started running the Ford cetane booster and anti-gel additives. Both are saposed to help with cold starts.
Question for diesel gurus
- Thread starter rynokron
- Start date
you could but in the winter run powerservice, howes,stanyadyne, just something with additional lubricant as well as an anti gel.for me its cheaper to buy a 5 gallon container of stanadyne then any two stroke oil.the only down side of two-stroke oil is ash. be sure to use low ash if you try it.
Yah some guys have been putting in a light mix of 2 stroke oil for ever, and I think more guys do it now that the sulfur content is so low in the fuel. I haven't, I don't think theres enough hard evidence to make it worth it. It seems like mostly hearsay from guys.
Maybe some long haulers will pipe up. If they don't do it, I won't bother for my 40k km/yr.
Maybe some long haulers will pipe up. If they don't do it, I won't bother for my 40k km/yr.
btw 20-30k on a fuel filter is crazy. I would carry one in the truck for sure going that long.
I run Power Service ULSD treatment year around.
My opinon is that ULSD is harder on injectors, bottom line. While I am sure other home remidies have been used sucussfully, I rely on additives built for that purpose.
One problem with adding ATF is that it is red. Off Road/Farm Diesel is dyed red for purposes of identification and more importantly taxation. You get caught running red on a highway your injectors will look like pocket change campare to the fines. While I know some folks who sware by ATF as a good additive, and I am sure it as, for me its not worth the head ache. I have added a little here and there to the tractor with no ill effects.
As far as useing two stroke oil........well I got nothing there
Oh, the PS will get the ULSD down to around -35 before it will start to gel. which is a far cry from ULSD right out of the pump !
My opinon is that ULSD is harder on injectors, bottom line. While I am sure other home remidies have been used sucussfully, I rely on additives built for that purpose.
One problem with adding ATF is that it is red. Off Road/Farm Diesel is dyed red for purposes of identification and more importantly taxation. You get caught running red on a highway your injectors will look like pocket change campare to the fines. While I know some folks who sware by ATF as a good additive, and I am sure it as, for me its not worth the head ache. I have added a little here and there to the tractor with no ill effects.
As far as useing two stroke oil........well I got nothing there
Oh, the PS will get the ULSD down to around -35 before it will start to gel. which is a far cry from ULSD right out of the pump !
I always prefilled filters with ATF. Quart jugs were cleaner than anything else out in the field. Remember ATF is red, And it will stay in the bottom of a filter. But also good for the injectors.
There was a study that was done by some guys over on the DieselPlace (Duramax site) that compared all the additives - it turned out the best thing to do was run 2% bio-diesel
http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/showthread.php?t=178848
The pdf is too big to attach here but here are the key points from the paper:
"RESULTS
In Order Of Performance:
1) 2% REG SoyPower bio-diesel
HFRR 221, 415 micron improvement.
50:1 ratio of baseline fuel to 100% biodiesel
66.56 oz. of 100% biodiesel per 26 gallons of diesel fuel
Price: market value
2) Opti-Lube XPD
Multi-purpose + anti-gel
Cetane Improver, Demulsifier
HFRR 317, 319 micron improvement.
256:1 ratio
13 oz/tank
$4.35/tank
3) FPPF RV, Bus, SUV Diesel/Gas Fuel Treatment
Gas and Diesel
Cetane improver, Emulsifier
HFRR 439, 197 micron improvement
640:1 ratio
5.2 oz/tank
$2.60/tank
4) Opti-Lube Summer Blend
Multi-purpose
Demulsifier
HFRR 447, 189 micron improvement
3000:1 ratio
1.11 oz/tank
$0.68/tank
5) Opti-Lube Winter Blend
Muti-purpose + anti-gel
Cetane improver
HFRR 461, 175 micron improvement
512:1 ratio
6.5 oz/tank
$3.65/tank
6) Schaeffer Diesel Treat 2000
Multi-purpose + anti-gel
Cetane improver, Emulsifier, bio-diesel compatible
HFRR 470, 166 micron improvement
1000:1 ratio
3.32 oz/tank
$1.87/tank
7) Super Tech Outboard 2-Cycle TC-W3 Engine Oil
Unconventional
(Not ULSD compliant, may damage 2007 or newer systems)
HFRR 474, 162 micron improvement
200:1 ratio
16.64 oz/tank
$1.09/tank
8) Stanadyne Lubricity Formula
Lubricity Only
Demulsifier, 5% bio-diesel compatible, alcohol free
HFRR 479, 157 micron improvement
1000:1 ratio
3.32 oz/tank
$1.00/tank
9) Amsoil Diesel Concentrate
Multi-purpose
Demulsifier, bio-diesel compatible, alcohol free
HFRR 488, 148 micron improvement
640:1 ratio
5.2 oz/tank
$2.16/tank
10) Power Service Diesel Kleen + Cetane Boost
Multi-purpose
Cetane improver, bio-diesel compatible, alcohol free
HFRR 575, 61 micron improvement
400:1 ratio
8.32 oz/tank
$1.58/tank
11) Howe’s Meaner Power Kleaner
Multi-purpose
Alcohol free
HFRR 586, 50 micron improvement
1000:1 ratio
3.32 oz/tank
$1.36/tank
12) Stanadyne Performance Formula
Multi-purpose + anti-gel
Cetane improver, Demulsifier, 5% bio-diesel compatible, alcohol free
HFRR 603, 33 micron improvement
480:1 ratio
6.9 oz/tank
$4.35/tank
13) Used Motor Oil, Shell Rotella T 15W-40, 5,000 miles used.
Unconventional
(Not ULSD compliant, may damage systems)
HFRR 634, 2 micron improvement (statistically insignificant change)
200:1 ratio
16.64 oz/tank
price: $0.00
14) Lucas Upper Cylinder Lubricant
Gas or Diesel
HFRR 641, 5 microns worse than baseline (statistically insignificant
change)
427:1 ratio
7.8 oz/tank
$2.65/tank
15) B1000 Diesel Fuel Conditioner by Milligan Biotech
Multi-purpose, canola oil based additive
HFRR 644, 8 microns worse than baseline (statistically insignificant
change)
1000:1 ratio
3.32 oz/tank
$2.67/tank
16) FPPF Lubricity Plus Fuel Power
Multi-purpose + anti-gel
Emulsifier, alcohol free
HFRR 675, 39 microns worse than baseline fuel
1000:1 ratio
3.32 oz/tank
$1.12/tank
17) Marvel Mystery Oil
Gas, Oil and Diesel fuel additive (NOT ULSD compliant, may damage
2007 and newer systems)
HFRR 678, 42 microns worse than baseline fuel.
320:1 ratio
10.4 oz/tank
$3.22/tank
18) ValvTect Diesel Guard Heavy Duty/Marine Diesel Fuel Additive
Multi-purpose
Cetane improver, Emulsifier, alcohol free
HFRR 696, 60 microns worse than baseline fuel
1000:1 ratio
3.32 oz/tank
$2.38/tank
19) Primrose Power Blend 2003
Multi-purpose
Cetane boost, bio-diesel compatible, Emulsifier
HFRR 711, 75 microns worse than baseline
1066:1 ratio
3.12 oz/tank
$1.39/tank
CONCLUSIONS:
Products 1 through 4 were able to improve the unadditized fuel to an
HFRR score of 460 or better. This meets the strictest requirements
requested by the Engine Manufacturers Association.
Products 1 through 9 were able to improve the unadditized fuel to an
HFRR score of 520 or better, meeting the U.S. diesel fuel requirements for
maximum wear scar in a commercially available diesel fuel.
Products 16 through 19 were found to cause the fuel/additive blend to
perform worse than the baseline fuel. The cause for this is speculative. This
is not unprecedented in HFRR testing and can be caused by alcohol or other
components in the additives. Further investigation into the possibilities
behind these poor results will be investigated.
Any additive testing within +/- 20 microns of the baseline fuel could be
considered to have no significant change. The repeatability of this test allows for a
+/- 20 micron variability to be considered insignificant.
Copyright© The Diesel Place & A. D. Spicer - 9 - August, 2007"
http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/showthread.php?t=178848
The pdf is too big to attach here but here are the key points from the paper:
"RESULTS
In Order Of Performance:
1) 2% REG SoyPower bio-diesel
HFRR 221, 415 micron improvement.
50:1 ratio of baseline fuel to 100% biodiesel
66.56 oz. of 100% biodiesel per 26 gallons of diesel fuel
Price: market value
2) Opti-Lube XPD
Multi-purpose + anti-gel
Cetane Improver, Demulsifier
HFRR 317, 319 micron improvement.
256:1 ratio
13 oz/tank
$4.35/tank
3) FPPF RV, Bus, SUV Diesel/Gas Fuel Treatment
Gas and Diesel
Cetane improver, Emulsifier
HFRR 439, 197 micron improvement
640:1 ratio
5.2 oz/tank
$2.60/tank
4) Opti-Lube Summer Blend
Multi-purpose
Demulsifier
HFRR 447, 189 micron improvement
3000:1 ratio
1.11 oz/tank
$0.68/tank
5) Opti-Lube Winter Blend
Muti-purpose + anti-gel
Cetane improver
HFRR 461, 175 micron improvement
512:1 ratio
6.5 oz/tank
$3.65/tank
6) Schaeffer Diesel Treat 2000
Multi-purpose + anti-gel
Cetane improver, Emulsifier, bio-diesel compatible
HFRR 470, 166 micron improvement
1000:1 ratio
3.32 oz/tank
$1.87/tank
7) Super Tech Outboard 2-Cycle TC-W3 Engine Oil
Unconventional
(Not ULSD compliant, may damage 2007 or newer systems)
HFRR 474, 162 micron improvement
200:1 ratio
16.64 oz/tank
$1.09/tank
8) Stanadyne Lubricity Formula
Lubricity Only
Demulsifier, 5% bio-diesel compatible, alcohol free
HFRR 479, 157 micron improvement
1000:1 ratio
3.32 oz/tank
$1.00/tank
9) Amsoil Diesel Concentrate
Multi-purpose
Demulsifier, bio-diesel compatible, alcohol free
HFRR 488, 148 micron improvement
640:1 ratio
5.2 oz/tank
$2.16/tank
10) Power Service Diesel Kleen + Cetane Boost
Multi-purpose
Cetane improver, bio-diesel compatible, alcohol free
HFRR 575, 61 micron improvement
400:1 ratio
8.32 oz/tank
$1.58/tank
11) Howe’s Meaner Power Kleaner
Multi-purpose
Alcohol free
HFRR 586, 50 micron improvement
1000:1 ratio
3.32 oz/tank
$1.36/tank
12) Stanadyne Performance Formula
Multi-purpose + anti-gel
Cetane improver, Demulsifier, 5% bio-diesel compatible, alcohol free
HFRR 603, 33 micron improvement
480:1 ratio
6.9 oz/tank
$4.35/tank
13) Used Motor Oil, Shell Rotella T 15W-40, 5,000 miles used.
Unconventional
(Not ULSD compliant, may damage systems)
HFRR 634, 2 micron improvement (statistically insignificant change)
200:1 ratio
16.64 oz/tank
price: $0.00
14) Lucas Upper Cylinder Lubricant
Gas or Diesel
HFRR 641, 5 microns worse than baseline (statistically insignificant
change)
427:1 ratio
7.8 oz/tank
$2.65/tank
15) B1000 Diesel Fuel Conditioner by Milligan Biotech
Multi-purpose, canola oil based additive
HFRR 644, 8 microns worse than baseline (statistically insignificant
change)
1000:1 ratio
3.32 oz/tank
$2.67/tank
16) FPPF Lubricity Plus Fuel Power
Multi-purpose + anti-gel
Emulsifier, alcohol free
HFRR 675, 39 microns worse than baseline fuel
1000:1 ratio
3.32 oz/tank
$1.12/tank
17) Marvel Mystery Oil
Gas, Oil and Diesel fuel additive (NOT ULSD compliant, may damage
2007 and newer systems)
HFRR 678, 42 microns worse than baseline fuel.
320:1 ratio
10.4 oz/tank
$3.22/tank
18) ValvTect Diesel Guard Heavy Duty/Marine Diesel Fuel Additive
Multi-purpose
Cetane improver, Emulsifier, alcohol free
HFRR 696, 60 microns worse than baseline fuel
1000:1 ratio
3.32 oz/tank
$2.38/tank
19) Primrose Power Blend 2003
Multi-purpose
Cetane boost, bio-diesel compatible, Emulsifier
HFRR 711, 75 microns worse than baseline
1066:1 ratio
3.12 oz/tank
$1.39/tank
CONCLUSIONS:
Products 1 through 4 were able to improve the unadditized fuel to an
HFRR score of 460 or better. This meets the strictest requirements
requested by the Engine Manufacturers Association.
Products 1 through 9 were able to improve the unadditized fuel to an
HFRR score of 520 or better, meeting the U.S. diesel fuel requirements for
maximum wear scar in a commercially available diesel fuel.
Products 16 through 19 were found to cause the fuel/additive blend to
perform worse than the baseline fuel. The cause for this is speculative. This
is not unprecedented in HFRR testing and can be caused by alcohol or other
components in the additives. Further investigation into the possibilities
behind these poor results will be investigated.
Any additive testing within +/- 20 microns of the baseline fuel could be
considered to have no significant change. The repeatability of this test allows for a
+/- 20 micron variability to be considered insignificant.
Copyright© The Diesel Place & A. D. Spicer - 9 - August, 2007"
S
sled-fiend
Well-known member
Good post Tmk50
Problem with BIO is that it gels at around 32 F. Even at 2% your going to clog a fuel filter !
2 stroke is not gonna help much with the gelling. it will give the lubricity that is being removed. atf and motor oil will burn and contain ash that may goof with some late model diesels. if you want lubrication, a oil designed for use in a combustion engine would be a good idea......somthing like.....2 stroke oil. if you are tryingto fight the wax there are products that do just that.
I just run diesel. the injectors do not have enough moving parts in them to worry about and the clearances are beyond tight. as for the IP I drive a dodge, so I know they are not gonna last. I will prolly puke the electronics well before I wear out a rotor.
I just run diesel. the injectors do not have enough moving parts in them to worry about and the clearances are beyond tight. as for the IP I drive a dodge, so I know they are not gonna last. I will prolly puke the electronics well before I wear out a rotor.
Problem with BIO is that it gels at around 32 F. Even at 2% your going to clog a fuel filter !
Have you had issues? I ran a few tanks of B-20 below freezing with no problems last fall/winter.
http://biodiesel.org/cold/
http://biodiesel.org/pdf_files/fuelfactsheets/COLD_BIOGenrlFactShtNOSOY.pdf
http://biodiesel.org/cold/Cold Flow - Master.ppt
Blue Sun (the stuff that I run when I purchase bio diesel) also claims to have bio diesel blends that work down to -30F
http://www.gobluesun.com/main.html
You Minnesota guys should chime in here - isn't ALL diesel sold in your state 2% bio blend?? (please correct me if I am wrong)
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Good info guys, like usual. Thanks.
Am i missing something? Ford recomends every 30k for my truck. (04 F350 6.0 PSD) I have been doing every 20k and thought i was playing it safe. BTW they are $140 to have them changed at the dealer.
I change mine about every 10,000 miles
I order them from here and change them myself to save some $$
http://www.fleetfilter.com/
Looks like your fuel filter sells for $44.43
Rep for you.
Try www.lethaldiesel.com They carry Fleetguard filters which is what we use on all of our equipment. Cheap too. I see they have a couple different filters for the 6.0. Does that have 2 fuel filters?
I have dump trucks you dont need to add oil to your fuel it still has plenty of lube in it.and on your filter your alright it wont take the injectors out.how many miles are you getting out of the injectors? you can run any kind of oil in the fuel if you are worried about it.
