pro climb vs pro rmk

[wasatchcomm]

http://www.snowestonline.com/forum/showthread.php?t=296022


i wrote up this comparison on the two sleds and posted in the pro climb section.

i figured i would give a chance to the polaris crowd to comment on my experience on the two sleds.

maybe some of you are as curious as i was/am.

i also would like some feedback on what some of you rmk guys did to fix/resolve some of the things i felt could be better on the rmk.

dont get me wrong its a great sled out of the box, as is the cat!

if you have not had a chance to ride the cat i think you would be equally impressed with it as well!

like i said in my comparison in the original thread i think they are both fantastic sleds and a lot of fun to ride!

thank you in advance for any honest feedback!

please no bashing, the cat guys so far have been very reasonable with my post.

 

[tdblakes]

Nice review. I think many of the handling comments you had on the Polaris can be fixed by setting up your suspension properly. I've noticed that a little goes a long way with this sled. I'd suggest tightening up your front track shock and make sure your rear track shock is set to spec per the manual. The front is personal preference imo. I honestly don't think there is any reason to remove the sway bar, I think you can adjust out of that. When my cousin first got his '12 pro he said he noticed alot of pushing with the gripper skis when turning flat in a few inches of powder. After some time on it he can take it almost anywhere. Ride it like a jet ski, subtle leaning here and there. Some of your trail riding comments about the smothness on the trail could just be the shocks lacking. I have an Assault so the upgraded shock package and I dont really bottom much and I think its pretty fluid through the woops. You can feel a difference in shock performance from my Assault to my cousin's Pro. I've never riden a proclimb to compare it to tho...

 

[wasatchcomm]

tdblakes,

thats the kind of info im looking for

i agree with the shocks, just needed to get some confirmation from the polaris guys with the experience of the chassis.

im going to take some preload out of the front shocks and the front rear for sure. before i mess with the sway bar.

thanks for the input!!!!

 

[tdblakes]

im going to take some preload out of the front shocks and the front rear for sure. before i mess with the sway bar.

Loosening the front track shock is only gonna make your front end feel more planted and harder to roll on its side. You actually need to tighten the front track shock preload and double check the rear track shock preload is set correctly per your manual. The lengths for certain weight ranges are listed. This actually makes a huge difference in performance.

browse through this thread, might help a bit. http://www.snowestonline.com/forum/showthread.php?t=287491&highlight=fts

 

[aebsledder]

Nice review.

Loosening the front track shock is only gonna make your front end feel more planted and harder to roll on its side. You actually need to tighten the front track shock preload and double check the rear track shock preload is set correctly per your manual. The lengths for certain weight ranges are listed. This actually makes a huge difference in performance.

browse through this thread, might help a bit. http://www.snowestonline.com/forum/showthread.php?t=287491&highlight=fts

What he said^^^^^. I tweaked my suspension a tad from the factory settings and noticed a difference. On the trail...I like my shocks stiff up front, so I have pretty much accepted the fact that my Pro will never be that great on the trail. I will sacrifice trail rideability for deep snow performance. I rode a pro-climb for a day as well and echo a lot of your comments on the comparison. I think the Pro-Climb is a pretty good sled. The next time you are out, do a comparison of a dead stop stop to full throttle in deeper, untracked snow. That is where I noticed a big difference between the RMK and the Cat. The Cat I was riding seemed to trench quite a bit more than my sled, but once it got up on the snow it felt like it had really good power. Maybe it was just the way the Pro-Climb that I rode suspension was set up. Good to see an honest, non biased review though. I agree with you, if both sleds prove to be reliable, you would have a tough time going wrong with either of them.

 

[hyperduc]

The fact that everyone complains about it performance on hardpack and or trail use is a good indication that polaris is building a purpose built MOUNTAIN sled. If you haven't set up the suspension, you can't complain about. if you don't like the way it handles on hardpack, you bought the wrong sled.

This sled's dominance comes from it's ability to get on top of the snow quickly and its handling in deep snow (particularly while holding a side hill).

 

[wasatchcomm]

Loosening the front track shock is only gonna make your front end feel more planted and harder to roll on its side. You actually need to tighten the front track shock preload and double check the rear track shock preload is set correctly per your manual. The lengths for certain weight ranges are listed. This actually makes a huge difference in performance.

browse through this thread, might help a bit. http://www.snowestonline.com/forum/showthread.php?t=287491&highlight=fts

tdblakes,

thanks for correcting me, i did mean i was going to do just what you originally stated...

hyperduc,
who is complaining?

 

[Pro-8250]

The only comparison I have to offer.

To me I see one problem in the comparison. The Polaris has electric start and the Cat doesn't???? IF this the case add another 20 pounds of dead weight to the Cat and then compare the two.
This is what happened to us in Cooke City December 31, 2011. This was not a test, it's just what happened.
Two riders, same age, weight, and riding skills.
One rider on a 153" 800 Pro Climb.
The other on a 155" 800 Pro RMK.
We had to cut the day of riding short because the Cat was running low on gas.
The RMK did have a little more riding time because the Cat had cut back for fear off running out of gas.
At the end of our day that was cut short, the Cat had 1 gallon of gas left and the RMK had 3.5 gallons of gas left.
I was on my sled all day and did I not ride either one of their sleds.
I hope I am not bashing here. Just telling my ONLY comparison between the two sleds.

 

[Clarke673]

i rented a 2012 cat for sat..... we will see how it does next ot my pro.... if it keeps up at all. My sled won't exactly be all stock.

 

[800 hillbilly]

I really liked your review on both sleds. I'm going to be honest I bleed red not Green and I am not bashing in any way here. You really need to adjust the rear shocks to find the sweet spot on the pro, 2 turns on the front or rear shock totally changes the way the sled gets up or keeps the ski's planted. Adjusting the shocks from when you ride it and when your wife rides it will change the way it handles for her also. There is no need to touch the sway bar trust us!!! You said that both sleds had 50 miles on them, it took a couple rides for my Pro to come alive and i'm sure the M8 is the same. Good review though just the same, alot better than most of the other crap people conjure up in low snow conditions.

 

[kidrman]

My 2010 M8 drinks gas like it is cheap beer, just gulps it down. The 2012 will probably be the same.

 

[wasatchcomm]

I really liked your review on both sleds. I'm going to be honest I bleed red not Green and I am not bashing in any way here. You really need to adjust the rear shocks to find the sweet spot on the pro, 2 turns on the front or rear shock totally changes the way the sled gets up or keeps the ski's planted. Adjusting the shocks from when you ride it and when your wife rides it will change the way it handles for her also. There is no need to touch the sway bar trust us!!! You said that both sleds had 50 miles on them, it took a couple rides for my Pro to come alive and i'm sure the M8 is the same. Good review though just the same, alot better than most of the other crap people conjure up in low snow conditions.

i appreciate the comments,
and from the feedback i have received i will for sure try the shock changes without losing the sway bar.
this is the main reason i posted this in this section to get info on how others felt and handled the changes....

i too have bled one color for a long time,,, but i am not afraid to try something else out.

its a great sled like i said in my post, if i had to choose one today to keep, i am not sure which i would choose.
thankfully i dont have to make that choice....

I will keep them both!!!

 

[440dart]

The next time you are out, do a comparison of a dead stop stop to full throttle in deeper, untracked snow. That is where I noticed a big difference between the RMK and the Cat. The Cat I was riding seemed to trench quite a bit more than my sled, but once it got up on the snow it felt like it had really good power.




The pro gets up on the snow way better because its pretty much the same setup as a holz suspension, the holz works very well i put one on my dragon this year i can be trenching WFO even at low speeds i can feel it pop up on top. I have rode both sleds i really really like the pros handleing but the cat definitly had more power and wasnt broke in yet going to spend more time on both iam a polaris guy and never ever thought of owning a cat till i got on the pro climb.

They both have there tradeoffs cat has more power and alot more power potential and cheap, polaris best handleing best performing platform stock best boondocking sled IMO.

 

[dmkhnr]

I rented a 162" cat yesterday in cooke, and rode it through 7 gallons of gas.
I thought it was a great sled, needs new skis, and a narrow ski stance, the susp was plush, and plenty of power.
I thought the seat was a little low, and a little to wide.
I'm sure every one of these issues will be dealt with for 2013.
I was right at home on the sled, as it has similar characteristics to my old m-series sleds.
I had to really lay it over to do a downhill/uphill power turn, and I see why guys say that it washes out while initiating this turn. If you put it on edge at the same angle you put an old M-chassis it will wash out, but angle past and really lay it over and it pulls right around. I think the narrower ski stance would help.

Next season cat will refine this sled, and I'm thinking this might be my next sled. I really liked the chassis.
I post here in the poo section, just because there is a good thread already going, and I think the guys over in the cat section are overly sensitive, and to be honest, question how many of them are advanced riders that can take a sled to it's limits.

 

[The Fourth Wolf]

wasatchcomm,
Your obvious Cat bias aside, your review was pretty fair...but flawed IMO because neither machine was past it's break in period.

I own a 2012 Pro 163 with almost 300 miles. This weekend I completed the break in period. My buddy ('12 Assault 155 w/Pro track)) and I rode 125 miles (RT) down a road that does not get winter maintenance to a friend's place. The "trail" was mixed--sections of smooth soft snow on hardpack, to hard dirfts, to wind scoured, hard-beaten icy snow.

Like some others have mentioned trail handling is near the very bottom of priorities of most folks who buy a mountain sled. Unless the thing is dangerously unstable, most don't care if their machines will hold a corner at 75 MPH or not since they're not riding them that way.

I'm 240 all dressed out w/pack. My Pro is set up for powder--FTS has 3/4" of threads left, RTS is 1" into the threads. Ski shocks about half way. It pushes through turns on thin snow so I adjust by slowing down. When I left the trailhead I had 81 miles on the odometer and when I hit about 110 miles indicated it woke up. My throttle became noticably snappier. Then 25 miles later we hit 12 miles of near constant wind drifts and hardly ever got over 15 MPH (suckeh). I had my scratchers down and veered off into the willows and softer snow every now and again and never got a temp reading over 141*. On a two mile section of essentially wind-scoured ice with the scratchers down the sled ran 127* at 40MPH--so gang the trick to keeping your Pro cool, is speed.

Being new to this sled I wanted to see what it could do...

1) The Stuck Test:
We found some meadows and little bowl shaped glades with deepish (4-5 feet)untracked powder. I actually put my sled in reverse and blipped the throttle to dig in a bit then pinned it going forward. The sled kept climbing out of the hole until the surface of the snow was more than a foot above the front bumper. When I did stick it, it popped out with my buddy pulling on the ski loop.

Then we slow-rolled up to the base of some small inclines (about 25* slopes) and pinned it. We started at about 10 MPH and slowed down each run until stuck. 2 MPH with the 163 and about 4 MPH on the 155. Both sleds stuck from dead stops.

Analysis--The Pro "pops" up onto the snow in 95% of normal conditions. For me it actually surpassed my expectations.

2) Tree Riding: I have nothing new to add. It's effing awesome.
Analysis--A bit of bar input, a touch of body-English, reverse, repeat and you're in Sine Wave Heaven.

3) Sidehilling: A one-eyed, retarded monkey with a club foot could hold a sidehill on this sled.
Analysis: It's stupid easy.

4) The Downhill-Uphill Turn Test:
This took some doing mainly because I have never been able to execute this before. I either washed out, stuck, or high-sided. The slop we found wasn't terribly steep, about 27* and the snow had been windblown a bit and was much firmer than new powder but not set-up. After about a dozen failures I got "a" technique that worked in that spot at that time. My goal was a hairpin reversal not much wider than two sled lengths.

Left hand reversal
-wrong foot forward (it works)
-about 12 MPH/4700ish RPM
-full bar input right + body lean
-as the sled transitions through the apex plant the foot stomp and pin it
-as the sled comes around to uphill scissor kick the right leg over the seat
-ride back up the hill
Analysis--A guy who couldn't pull this trick before got it done in 30 minutes of dedicated practice on this sled. (I also need more practice making hard right turns)

The Climb Test:
Didn't have an opportunity to pull any big hills but did pull some short (50-75 yards), steep & deep (5-6 ft) pulls through the trees. Got stuck twice in 7 pulls. First run I didn't have enough momentum and came to rest pointed straight up at the base of the hill. Fourth run the left ski bumped a 3" pine just enough to stall me.
Analysis--Conditions will dictate technique but it pulls hard and it carves uphill quite well too.


On the ride out the trail was a bit better due to some of the drifts being beat down somewhat by sled traffic. It handled the chatter bumps and whoops pretty well.

Comparison: This was an incomplete test and very impromptu but I'm glad I didn't get the Assault or a 155 Pro. It's only about another 3.5" of footprint but there's huge difference in deep soft snow between the two.

I have no opinion of the Pro-Climb as yet, but two of my fence-straddling riding buddies are getting them so before winter's out we'll take turns playing Bill Nye: Sled Science Guy. I'm sure the Cat will impress, but to be honest I don't really care. I'm happy and as long my pards are happy with whatever they ride we can concentrate on having fun.

BTW I'm suing Polaris now because my Pro got me fired. My boss thinks I'm on drugs from this stupid grin I can't seem to wipe off my face.

 

[wasatchcomm]

i agree about the break in period, which is why i mentioned the mileage in the original post.

the cat bias i had is/was gone the day i spent 12k on a polaris.

im not the type to buy something so i can make fun of it..

quite the contrary,

im taking it out today over both my cats, because i want to, not because its better/worse, i made adjustments and i want to see what it can do..

i think both sleds are fantastic, you cant go wrong with either one!!!

great review and info the fourth wolf

 

[TS Drag Racer]

Rhode 011 Pro last season, an M1000 season before that, a XP 163 the year before that. This season I chose to go with the Pro Climb 162. First off I'm not brand loyal whats so ever as you can see. I enjoy riding differen't machines and comparing them. I'm 6' 4" 245lbs and consider myself an aggressive Mtn rider. Like high marking, love boondocking in the trees, side hilling etc.

So far out of all the machines I've owned, I like my Pro Climb the best by alot. First off being a bigger guy, I like the ero's from seat, bars, steering location forward ero's, running boards pretty much everything. I love the way it side hills, easy to tip on it's side will hold the side hill with ease as did my Pro. Far as power, it definetely is better than my Pro hands down plenty more torque IMO. Now my Pro was last years model, I haven't ridden a 012, but from what I gather there's not a big difference in Hp, possibly a small Hp increase.

Things I don't like about the Pro Climb are stock ski's junked them right away, changing the belt, tight quarters, just overall pain in the @ss, no storage, turning radius blows will be fixing that soon, and fuel gauge isn't accurate what's so ever. So far that's about it for the dislikes.

My Pro Rmk I liked how nimble it felt, stock ski's were fine, handled very nice side hilling etc, felt very light, when stuck was easy to throw it around and get it unstuck etc. I will admit the cat feels heavier when stuck, no doubt about that. Liked how easy every thing was to get to, not compact and cramped in engine department. The sled turned on a dime and overall was a good handling sled.

Didn't like ero's as much as my Pro Climb. I felt seat was a bit low, ero's not forward leaning enough for my style of riding, I felt cramped on the sled and I know part of that is me just being a big guy. The power was a bit flat, didn't have that bit off extra torque that it take's, to make all the difference in the world for a guy of my size, others even under 200lbs mentioned they would have liked a little more pop under the hood with the Pro. Storage was another disapointment, but an under seat bag, took care of that and of course my back pack. Another thing when climbing really steep hills, the Pro front end seemed extremly light, I really had to go out of my way to get my weight over the front end, to keep it from doing serious wheel walking. My Pro Climb, XP, and my M1000 felt more stable to me climbing the steep hills far as weight transfer. Could just be do to my size, not that I was uncomfortable climbing the steep with my Pro, just took more effort for me to keep the weight over the nose.

All in all both sleds are great sleds, but IMHO and for my style of riding it's the Pro Climb for the win hands down. I like the power delivery better, the ero's, just the overall feel of the sled. I know some of the shorter smaller guys like the ero's of the Pro better, it really comes down to your riding style and what makes you happy. Anymore you can't really go wrong with any of them. I have no doubt I could take any one of the big three out and have a blast with any one of them. Hope every body has a fun safe year.

 

[pus1100]

I guess you had the 11 163 Pro with tipped up rails?they seem to wheely more than the 155 with straight rails.

 

[m1kflyingtiger]

I spent 5 days last week riding with 2 new proclimb 163's, '12 assualt w/5.1, '10 m8 153, and my '11 pro.

Power: Both the new cats were turbos so I can't really comment on power difference beyond that the m8 definatly had more the the 12 poo.

Side hilling: I love the way the pro side hills. It is just effortless,that's why I bought it. The pro climb will definatly side hill. It needs more turning radius for counter steer, but one other thing I found is that it dives like a doo. I felt too far forward on the sled and the front to rear balance seemed way off for me. When on the throttle there was no issue, but in a down hill turn situation I found that the sled liked to dive. One had Simmons skis, the other stock, and they both had this unpredictable diving character.

Handling: the pro climbs were the best on trail for the 15 minutes we had them on trail. The pro rmk was a hudge step in trail handling for poo, but it does like to push and tip a little more than the cat. The m8 was, well, an m8 on a trail. On powder snow it all changed though. On the m8 when you get off the power the nose stays up, the rmk as well, but not quite as much as the m8, and the proclimbs diving character just shined here. I found that if I wasn't on the throttle accelerating I was diving the nose in. The rmk was the easiest to whip around followed by the m8 then the proclimb. I think this will be solved by increasing the turning radius though.

Set up: I tried some changes to the pro climb set up, but don't feel I had enough time tinkering with it to make the sled do what I want. I HOPE that's all it needs, but fear that too much of the trail sled carried into the new proclimb chassis. The ski-doo rider of the bunch (owner of one of the proclimbs) seemed to have no issues riding the new cat, and all the rest of us have issues riding a doo FWIW. Also I'd like to point out that the guy on the assault had no clue on set up. He was having issues making the sled predictable. Felt it was "squirley". His rear preload was fine for his weight, I loostened his fts TWO threads, and moved his handle bars from plus 2 to -1 and he fell in love. Every time we stopped for the rest of the day he pointed out what a night and day difference that made.

I was not a fan of the new cat chassis. That's not to say with some set up, time learning the chassis, and simple mods, it won't be a great sled. It is very capable (as we're all 3 turbos running 8-10psi at sea level ) but I feel it was a step backwards for cat from the m-chassis.

 

[wasatchcomm]

ts drag racer,

very good review.

good to see honest opinions>
i agree with a lot of what you said.
both sleds are very capable...