pcv pti cfi-4
- Thread starter jeepin270
- Start date
J
jeepin270
Well-known member
I am going to go over my experience installing and setup. I have searched my ars off trying to find information with this unit on the cfi-4. There isn't any. I am sure there is other people that would like to upgrade there fuel controller on these older sleds. Hopefully it can be beneficial. The install is pretty easy, if your coming from a dobeck unit more than likely you have to splice your wires back to stock. I was running a fpr with my setup, if you have one it can be taking off and the fuel lines go back to stock. I cant find my original instructions so I am keeping the fpr on for now. I set it to 59psi. I am missing some things in my stock fpr so until I figure out what I need I am gonna leave the silber fpr. I have received a couple of emails last week from Tj guiding me through the setup process. I downloaded a stock 800 map from Jim at dynotech. When I setup the pressure table to cylinder advanced it blanks out all the numbers in the fuel table from Jims map. At this point I am stumped, I pretty sure I have all the tables set correctly. I called the dynotech hotline and spoke to a guy named Jerry, I guess he wasn't familiar with sleds at all. He sent me a email with stuff that doesn't really apply. I have watched every video on youtube and read mostof the threads about the pcv. More information regarding tuning the cfi-4 would really be helpful. Most of the info out there is geared toward the autotune which isn't a option here. I hope we can get some good information posted here for not only myself but others that would like to go this route.
J
jeepin270
Well-known member
I don't understand why Jims map isn't showing up in my fuel tables. In the notes box at bottom of table it shows the notes from Jims map but the fuel table is blank. I should have numbers in 4 fuel tables, it doesn't make sence to only have fuel in 1 table if there is 4 injectors. I cant move forward until I figure this out.
J
jeepin270
Well-known member
I think that might be the problem, Jims map is for a stock 800cfi. I have 8 tables, 4 fuel and 4 pressure. I thought I would be able to use it as a base fuel map and then I would just have to dial the pressure tables in. Wondering if I will have to start with completely blank map.
You can go to Jim's map highlight the whole table... Right click then copy Jim's map.. And then go highlight your complete "fuel" table in the pcv pti and paste Jim's map in to the pcv pti in your "fuel" tables.
Now wether Jim's N/A map is gonna want to run on a turbo setup is a different story...but a starting point none the less.
Now wether Jim's N/A map is gonna want to run on a turbo setup is a different story...but a starting point none the less.
That's because his maps aren't made for the pcv pti and don't involve boost pressure, the map you have from him is for a NA setup with 2d mapping... So if you wanted you could use what Jim's map is showing below like 5000rpm because once you are above that you are making boost pressure. Even then the maps are gonna be different.
You shouldn't have to put any big numbers in the "fuel pressure" tables because the map sensor will sense the pressure coming in and add the fuel for it.
It be best to throw Jim's map out the window and just spend a day to make your own map.
J
jeepin270
Well-known member
Is there any way to datalog with a laptop? I have a aem afr, I doubt there is anyway to tie them together. At this point, I don't see anyway for me to dial this in perfectly without being on the dyno. Starting to wish I didn't pass up a great deal on a boondocker box. Customer support for this pcv pti is non existent.
jeepin270,
gmustangt is correct with all of his facts. Thank you for your interim assistance providing information to a new Power Commander user.
Maps for any snowmobile PCV can be obtained from one of our great dealers. When they create a modification such as a pipe/intake/porting setup, they spend countless hours on the dyno and in the field developing a coherent map for the setup. These dealers provide fantastic customer support helping with PCV setup or mapping assistance.
Turbos may be another story since fewer dealers are utilizing the PCV for their applications - yet. This is changing as we become more and more noticed in the sled world....
Jim's map from Dynotech is made for a stock machine to improve the midrange on the CFI4's. Depending on your ECU flash, injector color, and sled modifications - his map may or may not be the ticket to clearing up the midrange. Advancing the map out to individual injector control creates a scenario that is not what Jim's map was built for. Therefore, there is no reason for the PCV to keep the prior map since it no longer applies -- though if you wish to run it as a base, copy Jim's map before advancing your device, then paste the values into the Fuel tables for all cylinders.
Yet - Since you've bolted a turbo onto the end of the exhaust which heavily restricts flow at low RPM/TP, you'll need to subtract a significant amount of fuel from the bottom end. For your CFI4, this would be the upper right corner of the Fuel table for Cylinder 1 and 2. These tables and range of RPM/TP's correspond to the Primary (part load) injectors that operate at low load conditions where many turbos stumble off the bottom end. I'd recommend a negative 10 in the 20 and 40%TP columns from 0-4500RPM. Then a negative 15 in the 60 and 80%TP columns from 0-5000RPM. And Finally, a negative 20 in the 100%TP column from 0-5500RPM.
The pressure tables will be the very Easy part for you. Since the PCV-PTI comes with dual TMAP sensors letting us compensate for all pressures, you'll have to input NO numbers into the pressure tables. The CFI4 engine is lucky enough to not require secondary injectors since it already has 4 of them - leaving plenty of duty cycle left over to increase boost without running them static. Even by Leaving zeroes in this table still means that once your sled develops any PSI of boost, the PCV will still add the proper amount of fuel to keep your engine at the AFR requested by the ECU.
Running a 1:1 FPR is a wise thing to do on any fuel injected turbo machine to keep things at "theoretical correctness". Great plan to leave that on your sled.
The datalogging capability resides within the LCD-200 accessory. This plugs into the external CAN port of the PCV providing the user with datalogging, real time gauges, map sending, and in-field fuel adjustments as well as other features. Datalogging is not possible with a laptop.
Hooking up your AEM AFR to your specific PCV enabling the wideband to read into the control center is not possible.
Once your feet are firmly planted on the ground, you'll be off to a well tuned turbo Polaris.
~T.J.
gmustangt is correct with all of his facts. Thank you for your interim assistance providing information to a new Power Commander user.
Maps for any snowmobile PCV can be obtained from one of our great dealers. When they create a modification such as a pipe/intake/porting setup, they spend countless hours on the dyno and in the field developing a coherent map for the setup. These dealers provide fantastic customer support helping with PCV setup or mapping assistance.
Turbos may be another story since fewer dealers are utilizing the PCV for their applications - yet. This is changing as we become more and more noticed in the sled world....
Jim's map from Dynotech is made for a stock machine to improve the midrange on the CFI4's. Depending on your ECU flash, injector color, and sled modifications - his map may or may not be the ticket to clearing up the midrange. Advancing the map out to individual injector control creates a scenario that is not what Jim's map was built for. Therefore, there is no reason for the PCV to keep the prior map since it no longer applies -- though if you wish to run it as a base, copy Jim's map before advancing your device, then paste the values into the Fuel tables for all cylinders.
Yet - Since you've bolted a turbo onto the end of the exhaust which heavily restricts flow at low RPM/TP, you'll need to subtract a significant amount of fuel from the bottom end. For your CFI4, this would be the upper right corner of the Fuel table for Cylinder 1 and 2. These tables and range of RPM/TP's correspond to the Primary (part load) injectors that operate at low load conditions where many turbos stumble off the bottom end. I'd recommend a negative 10 in the 20 and 40%TP columns from 0-4500RPM. Then a negative 15 in the 60 and 80%TP columns from 0-5000RPM. And Finally, a negative 20 in the 100%TP column from 0-5500RPM.
The pressure tables will be the very Easy part for you. Since the PCV-PTI comes with dual TMAP sensors letting us compensate for all pressures, you'll have to input NO numbers into the pressure tables. The CFI4 engine is lucky enough to not require secondary injectors since it already has 4 of them - leaving plenty of duty cycle left over to increase boost without running them static. Even by Leaving zeroes in this table still means that once your sled develops any PSI of boost, the PCV will still add the proper amount of fuel to keep your engine at the AFR requested by the ECU.
Running a 1:1 FPR is a wise thing to do on any fuel injected turbo machine to keep things at "theoretical correctness". Great plan to leave that on your sled.
The datalogging capability resides within the LCD-200 accessory. This plugs into the external CAN port of the PCV providing the user with datalogging, real time gauges, map sending, and in-field fuel adjustments as well as other features. Datalogging is not possible with a laptop.
Hooking up your AEM AFR to your specific PCV enabling the wideband to read into the control center is not possible.
Once your feet are firmly planted on the ground, you'll be off to a well tuned turbo Polaris.
~T.J.
PCV
T.J.
One thing we need to remember on the dragons are that from which flash is in the ecm Polaris swapped the injectors from top being the main injector to the bottom.
It is nice to see you on here giving out some info and some starting points so we are not going out blind and wasting a whole year trying to tune our sleds with your box. The more you can help the more you will see your pcv pti box out there.
T.J.
One thing we need to remember on the dragons are that from which flash is in the ecm Polaris swapped the injectors from top being the main injector to the bottom.
It is nice to see you on here giving out some info and some starting points so we are not going out blind and wasting a whole year trying to tune our sleds with your box. The more you can help the more you will see your pcv pti box out there.
J
jeepin270
Well-known member
Update, took the sled up to the hills this week. I didn't have high expectations, figured I would be spending most of the time tuning. I loaded the map with Tj's recommendations. Midrange was lean from 1/4 to 1/2 throttle, I added some fuel in the areas. Topend is a little rich so I took some fuel out of the fuel tables in that area. I am not sure if I should subtract any fuel from pressure table. Overall I spent about a hour tuning and then I enjoyed the rest of the time riding. I am very happy with the pcv, it isn't dialed in perfect yet but it is a nice upgrade from my old fuel controller. Even with it not being dialed in perfectly I am seeing the best plug readings since I have had a turbo.
I am using the autotune as afr only,and have it hooked up to the lcd 200 display. I must say that the display is the best tuning tool you can get to pcv. It has a sd card,and i can log all data to the sd card,then look at data in exel data.
I log afr,tps and rpm.
That way i can run some logs on the hill, and at home after the day i can look at logs and perfekt the tune. It has never been easier tuning a piggyback.
Sent from my LT25i using Tapatalk 2
I log afr,tps and rpm.
That way i can run some logs on the hill, and at home after the day i can look at logs and perfekt the tune. It has never been easier tuning a piggyback.
Sent from my LT25i using Tapatalk 2
jeepin270,
Great to hear that you are seeing positive results from your new PCV. Very impressive and always love hearing the success stories of customers.
The Dynojet Wideband setups are extremely valuable tuning tools providing a constant monitoring of your exiting exhaust gases.
There are two different products you can choose from.
- The first is the Autotune (AT-200) which provides users with full closed loop fuel tuning for your sled. The AT does struggle with these 2 injector per cylinder setups since it cannot differentiate between secondary/primary for the same cylinder. On the very top end of the power when the secondaries are dominating the fuel delivery, Autotune will work much better than in the midrange where the load is shared between the two sets. Entering a value in a target AFR table at WOT should keep the burn consistent to your desired AFR at that condition.
- The second is the Wideband2 (WB2) which offers all of the features of the AT-200 as well as the option to drive an external gauge! This gauge will provide a visual indication of what the wideband sensor is seeing jsut as you do with your AEM gauge right now. You can choose from various color options for your gauge, and even choose between Analog or Digital readout.
Either of these accessories paired with the LCD200 will enable full monitoring/datalogging just as Daltech has stated. The LCD will also allow storing of multiple maps on the SD card so you can send different maps while on the hill, and also offer In-Field Fuel adjustment to trim the LO, MID, and HI areas of your map.
Just FYI - While operation in the snow is far outside the design scope of the LCD, it has found a home in the hands of backcountry riders who find the benefits far outweigh the potential shortcomings of the display. While I have not personally seen an LCD fail in 3 years of use in a group of 6 riders using them here in MT, they are vulnerable to snow inclusion as they are not a potted unit. For protection and to prolong the life of the LCD, many riders choose to remove the display when just riding around only mounting it when they wish to alter maps or make a datalog. Others enclose the LCD in a waterproof GPS case.
~T.J.
Great to hear that you are seeing positive results from your new PCV. Very impressive and always love hearing the success stories of customers.
The Dynojet Wideband setups are extremely valuable tuning tools providing a constant monitoring of your exiting exhaust gases.
There are two different products you can choose from.
- The first is the Autotune (AT-200) which provides users with full closed loop fuel tuning for your sled. The AT does struggle with these 2 injector per cylinder setups since it cannot differentiate between secondary/primary for the same cylinder. On the very top end of the power when the secondaries are dominating the fuel delivery, Autotune will work much better than in the midrange where the load is shared between the two sets. Entering a value in a target AFR table at WOT should keep the burn consistent to your desired AFR at that condition.
- The second is the Wideband2 (WB2) which offers all of the features of the AT-200 as well as the option to drive an external gauge! This gauge will provide a visual indication of what the wideband sensor is seeing jsut as you do with your AEM gauge right now. You can choose from various color options for your gauge, and even choose between Analog or Digital readout.
Either of these accessories paired with the LCD200 will enable full monitoring/datalogging just as Daltech has stated. The LCD will also allow storing of multiple maps on the SD card so you can send different maps while on the hill, and also offer In-Field Fuel adjustment to trim the LO, MID, and HI areas of your map.
Just FYI - While operation in the snow is far outside the design scope of the LCD, it has found a home in the hands of backcountry riders who find the benefits far outweigh the potential shortcomings of the display. While I have not personally seen an LCD fail in 3 years of use in a group of 6 riders using them here in MT, they are vulnerable to snow inclusion as they are not a potted unit. For protection and to prolong the life of the LCD, many riders choose to remove the display when just riding around only mounting it when they wish to alter maps or make a datalog. Others enclose the LCD in a waterproof GPS case.
~T.J.
Similar threads
