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P to the 22 roller bearing delete…..

These sleds work pretty darn well stock.

Aside from clutches spinning off due to all the reasons, I really don't see a problem with the P-22 other than preference-based "the old P-85 was better because I like tuning/thinking about it better" dialogue.
 
These sleds work pretty darn well stock.

Aside from clutches spinning off due to all the reasons, I really don't see a problem with the P-22 other than preference-based "the old P-85 was better because I like tuning/thinking about it better" dialogue.

If you can't get it to stay on the sled, then all other P22 discussion is moot. I would want a P85 so I DON'T have to think (obsess actually) about clutching. I could care less about optimization, because I the rider am the weakest link. I just want to enjoy the backcountry with my wife without the additional stress of not trusting my equipment.

I've done my P22 due diligence....researched/installed the best recommended clutching for my area (not for performance, but rather to control the over rev), had both clutches balanced, lapped my primary to the crank, bought the installation bolt, torqued to 140ft/lbs, installed the most recent bolt at 110, ordered the TRS alignment bar to be sure lapping hasn't affected my offset.... So if the P22 still tries to leave my machine I'm going P85 one of two ways...either retrofitted to my 9R, or an 850 is in my future. For what it's worth though, the P22 was the one thing on my Boost that didn't give me issues lol. Who knows, maybe the lightweight 9R crank will try to reject anything you bolt onto the end of it. I've talked to some guys with 2000+km on the 9R and have not so much as had to even re-torque the bolt.
 
Good lord, every Jeff Brines post is a college thesis paper… TL;DR. You can do all the math and over thinking you want but you aren’t gonna know chit till you ride it.



I can’t really imagine gearing a boost down… and I’ve been a proponent of lower gearing on 800s/850s for a long time. Don’t knock it till you try it I guess 😂

Definitely high effort, Forum Expert move for sure.
 
Good lord, every Jeff Brines post is a college thesis paper… TL;DR. You can do all the math and over thinking you want but you aren’t gonna know chit till you ride it.



I can’t really imagine gearing a boost down… and I’ve been a proponent of lower gearing on 800s/850s for a long time. Don’t knock it till you try it I guess 😂
LOL. Guessing you haven't read a real college thesis eh? Also I'd argue one of the great parts about being a human is all the knowledge you can infer without actually doing something first hand. But yes, once you decide something is worth trying, first hand testing is always best.

As to your other point, I've considered gearing my boost down for awhile. I think its a good idea for a number of riders looking for better bottom end. After all when we are riding in good snow track speeds are way off of full shift out. To add, Doo and Cat both have stock gear ratios significantly lower than the 850s.

That said, TRS's new product looks to really fix the problem in a better way if better bottom end is what you are looking for. Both would probably make for a killer combination.
 
Definitely high effort, Forum Expert move for sure.
I've learned the hard way that you have to read the room before taking the time to put out a detailed explanation, but I'm glad some people still put in the effort. You've just gotta realize that, depending on your audience, you might get nuked by one stupid meme. At least SW has a decent cross-section between the peanut gallery and guys who really care about every nut and bolt; glad I don't bother with FB anymore - that was as bad as the courtroom scene from Idiocracy.

I haven't rode a boost yet, but generally if your priority is responsiveness, then gearing down can only help. Clutching is least efficient when it's nearest the engagement point, and by gearing down, you're able to get out of that zone more quickly, and will be closer to peak efficiency in low-speed riding. The downside is, you'll lose peak track speed. It's all about trade-offs: the gearing Polaris chose will be ok for most people, but with room for improvement in many cases.

Going back to the clutch itself, I have no doubt a properly adjusted P-85 will act like a lower gear, although mostly at engagement. That advantage disappears if you don't tighten the deflection as the belt stretches and wears though, and that's probably part of the reason Polaris added the bearing. This roller bearing delete should get some of that back, but I don't see it making a difference in the P-22's biggest downside (premature evacuation). If I had a P-22 and money to burn, I'd convert to P-85 - probably with TRS clutching - and forget about it (other than the usual clutch maintenance). Short of that, I can see taking your chances until the warranty's out.
 
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I've learned the hard way that you have to read the room before taking the time to put out a detailed explanation, but I'm glad some people still put in the effort. You've just gotta realize that, depending on your audience, you might get nuked by one stupid meme. At least SW has a decent cross-section between the peanut gallery and guys who really care about every nut and bolt; glad I don't bother with FB anymore - that was as bad as the courtroom scene from Idiocracy.

I haven't rode a boost yet, but generally if your priority is responsiveness, then gearing down can only help. Clutching is least efficient when it's nearest the engagement point, and by gearing down, you're able to get out of that zone more quickly, and will be closer to peak efficiency in low-speed riding. The downside is, you'll lose peak track speed. It's all about trade-offs: the gearing Polaris chose will be ok for most people, but with room for improvement in many cases.

Going back to the clutch itself, I have no doubt a properly adjusted P-85 will act like a lower gear, although mostly at engagement. That advantage disappears if you don't tighten the deflection as the belt stretches and wears though, and that's probably part of the reason Polaris added the bearing. This roller bearing delete should get some of that back, but I don't see it making a difference in the P-22's biggest downside (premature evacuation). If I had a P-22 and money to burn, I'd convert to P-85 - probably with TRS clutching - and forget about it (other than the usual clutch maintenance). Short of that, I can see taking your chances until the warranty's out.


You are right. Reading the room is important, and it really is a bummer most of the snowmobile community discussion points have devolved significantly over the last 10 years. I really shouldn't spend the time, because it really is more or less wasted.

Social media fragmented the point of connect significantly, but the culture also seems to have followed suit in this weird sort of race to the bottom. Its not just snowmobiling, but it sure seems worse in this sport, where tribalism around people and product is more significant/meaningful than any thinking in "first principles". Personally, I really enjoy intellectual discourse and critical thinking around technology (all sorts of technology).

I still reject this idea that anyone is going to feel the difference in gearing between the 22 and 85 for all the reasons I've already articulated. I also think its funny how people are so willing to ignore the huge advantage the bearing offers (if its not roached). Polaris didn't add this to impact performance negatively, after all. If its bottom end you are after, a really tight belt is going to help, not hinder, this attribute.

Anyway, I'll keep my thoughts to myself going forward. They are largely wasted here.
 
You are right. Reading the room is important, and it really is a bummer most of the snowmobile community discussion points have devolved significantly over the last 10 years. I really shouldn't spend the time, because it really is more or less wasted.

Social media fragmented the point of connect significantly, but the culture also seems to have followed suit in this weird sort of race to the bottom. Its not just snowmobiling, but it sure seems worse in this sport, where tribalism around people and product is more significant/meaningful than any thinking in "first principles". Personally, I really enjoy intellectual discourse and critical thinking around technology (all sorts of technology).

I still reject this idea that anyone is going to feel the difference in gearing between the 22 and 85 for all the reasons I've already articulated. I also think its funny how people are so willing to ignore the huge advantage the bearing offers (if its not roached). Polaris didn't add this to impact performance negatively, after all. If its bottom end you are after, a really tight belt is going to help, not hinder, this attribute.

Anyway, I'll keep my thoughts to myself going forward. They are largely wasted here.
Yes, thank you for all your insight. I didn't really learn jack from your wasteful posts. I'll keep my thoughts as they were.
 
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