Observations on the proclimb

[CO 2.0]

Well after a full weekend with my new proclimb 800, I have some observations on the sled with fitment and design. Just my opinion, yours may vary.

1. The oil tank and gas fillers are small. The oil tank filler is at a bad angle, and the gas filler is smaller than I've ever seen. Nice gas spiller on the seat.

2. The foam around the clutch is pointless. The only way to get the belt off is to destroy the foam in that area. I just went ahead and took all the foam off around the clutch and side panel. Much more room to work with now.

3. The clutch cover design is questionable. First off it's 2 separate pieces. The back piece is a finger slicer, so deburr the pointy edges. The front piece is bolted down. One small bolt that needs to come off also is used for the exhaust support spring hook on the other side. So taking this off requires taking the hood off if you want to get at it easy. I do like the design on the exhaust brace though. Better than the M's.

3. The exhaust hits the hood on the clutch side. Why is there no indentation in the heat shield on the pipe to accomodate for this like they did on the 2011 M8? Seemed easy enough to gain clearance there by doing that. Hopefully the Cat vented hood and side panels will help with any heat issues.

4. There is an issue with my sled on the secondary clutch. There is a alignment spacer behind the secondary. If I use this spacer the clutch bolt isn't long enough to grab threads when trying to open the clutch sheaves to install a belt. If I take the alignment spacer out I have enough bolt length to grab threads and open the clutch sheaves, but with it I don't. The secondary bolt, at least on my sled, needs to be 3mm longer in order to use the alignment washer. Clutch bolt is kind of small in diameter too IMO.

5. The snow flap is huge and in the way. I'm not the type that likes big snow flaps in my way while digging a sled out, and the rear cooler stops shorter on these sleds, so I cut it down.

6. My front bumper was not tight like many others. There was a push pin plastic piece in my airbox when I took the hood off for the first time. Tuesday build too.

7. Will we have bending rail issues with the same inner idler wheel design on this chassis? Is everyone going to take them off like they did on the M's?

8. The bottom frogzskin vents on the intake where not installed very well and are pealing off in a couple bends. Need to take a bit of heat to it and get them stuck down again.

9. What is with the huge hole behind the big coolant hose? Unless the 1100T has something in that area, then we are losing a good gallon of gas they could have added to the gas tank capacity there.

10. I had to cut down an ace hardware metric thumb screw for the rear of the seat. The ones at ace are too big and will hit the rear lip of the seat when trying to screw in.

11. The secondary looks beefier and easier to work on. No more snapping those 9 small torx bolts in the helix. Just 4 big ones now.

12. What is the gold plate bolted to the back of the primary for? Counter balance for the clutch fan on the cover, or to dissipate heat on the crank side clutch sheave? I like the side panel vent that dumps air directly onto the slits in the clutch cover.

13. The spark plugs caps/lines and coils are in a much better position IMO. Shouldn't be any more rubbing on anything, especially the steering post.

14. I mounted Fox float evol R's off a M series onto the new proclimb. The float 2's that came on it are about 1/4" longer body but measure the same 17.5" eye to eye. The shaft covers are different lengths. The eyelets on the shocks are different between the M's and proclimbs so I had to swap the eyelets and spacers to install the evol R's on it. The rebound adjuster on the evol r's clear just barely and can still be turned in this position.

15. I got my Muff pot with custom steel baseplate to fit right before the can on the pipe. It's not hitting the hood or side panel. This is great news. I would have been upset if I didn't have a way to get the muff pot on the new proclimb.

Little side by side pic next to the M to finish it off...

 

[snowmanx]

WOW, that seems pretty poor for a new sled. Most of them are small, but all that stuff should be worked out. What's the price tag on that Baby?

Looks good though.

 

[cb2honk]

Good write up and initial review.

Thanks

 

[Woody67]

Thanks for the write up. I agree with most of your observations. There is a large washer in the tool kit to aid in compressing the sheaves. You will need to remove all the stock spacers and washers and then install this washer for belt changing.

Woody

 

[madness]

the clutch is going to stump lots of people. they had to change it.lol so if you look in your tool kit you well find a large washer.use this to open the clutch then put it back in your kit.and install stock endcap.

 

[RickM]

Good Write up, I found the same issues on my new orange M800, Just a little final fit and finish by the end user and they will be fine. On getting the belt off. Use only the washer in the tool kit and the bolt. It will spread the sheaves fine.When you try and get the belt over the driven, rotate the clutch with the belt in the flat spots between the clutch towers. then rotate again while going over the outter cover. It was a little tough the first time for me but now will be ok. I fixed all the issues you have mentioned including smoothing all edges on belt guard. Sure has high air pressure in rear shock. 145 to 150 PSI, ?
Thanks RickM

 

[dmkhnr]

Thanks for posting that pic of the 2 sleds side by side. They look to be about the same width. Is the pc noticeably narrower when sitting on it?

 

[Goin For Snow]

Is the pc noticeably narrower when sitting on it?

IMO, they feel skinny and its like there is nothing in front of you when your standing up.

Good write up CO!

 

[madness]

if you read the little book that comes with your sled it explains it all even the highter shock pres.fronts are way higher because of the new leverage on the shocks. same in the rear.rear skid is a redesign.arm angles are different. the one thing that no one has mentioned is the clutch alignment. lets hope it right from the factory or your all going to take your sleds back to the dealer. the bar is a new one and its B/O till next month.

 

[RickM]

clutch engagement

I have noticed when i unloaded my new m800 and rode it around to the shop that the engagement was up around 3800 to 4000, but it was smooth engagement. I am use to the 09 M8 with lower engagement. Comes with
70 gr. for 6 to 9K el. Im thinking 68 or 67 for 9K and up. Any one know for sure what the 9K up is recommended. RickM

 

[geo]

Had mine '11 (STD) and '12 (HCR) side by side this weekend for about an hour.

Dang. Everywhere new holes. Bigger old holes. Smaller nuts and bolts. The '12 is shorter too. A real effort to lighten and strenghthen. Magnet doesn't stick to much. Hollow drive shaft. I'll be interested to see what weights more (if they do) 'cause from the surface they look like they should weight less lol.

Some things not too talked about. Cat did everything we want to keep belt temps down in the real world use (well directed vents, fan, zero alignment change, new secondary). The underhood venting (2 stroke) is second to none I,ve owned (I'll need to do some skins for early season fluff).
A real effort from engineering to give real world gains and less focus on EPA needs.
More suspention travel (tape don't lie). More tunnel clearance (sides and front)
I was real happy to easily see where this new sled will put more of the engine power to the snow through design not just clutching.

I'm going to the 38" front end. Haven't stripped or measured anything yet but wanted to comment on the above shock swap. The travel on the front end is limited top and bottom by the shock. The length AND the travel needs to be very close or you may allow the front arms to move further than design. That could cause some parts some problems.
Also a shock rebound valved for 60 psi start will likely be a little off in the main stack for a shock starting at 90psi. Just a heads up.

 

[GlennRMK]

I had an 11 and 12 M8 side by side today.

Anyone notice the distance from the spindles to the rear suspension arm mounting point is several inches shorter then 05-11 M series?

This would explain the more nimble, easier to handle feel in comparison to the previous Ms.

Anyone remember last years 800 comparo in Snowest where that was compared. If memory serves me last years M and the PRO were similar and the XP was quite a bit longer.

I think everyone will be impressed with the Pro Climb handling when people get to ride them. I know I was impressed with them last year.

There are several improvements I really like that I haven't seen mentioned a lot:

1.) The torque link from the motor to jackshaft. Should result in better belt life, lower clutch temps and better performance.
2.) The A-arms are way easier to change.
3.) The center section should be way cheaper and easier to replace then the old M series hood.
4.) The track tensioner bolts are way easier to access.
5.) The rear axle wheel assembly is way beefier.
6.) Chaincase should be more reliable
7.) No more melted oil tanks with the magnesium oil tank
8.) Handlebars go way high. Can't imagine needing a riser unless your 7' tall
9.) Steering effort is soooo much lighter then the 08 and up M and lighter then the 05-07 M
10.) Rides way better in the bumps

I had an 06, 09 and 11 M and while I liked all of them, I don't see any advantage to the old chassis at all. Basically Cat has fixed all the weak links of the old M series while combining the bulletproof motors. Whats not to like???

Also, I like your idea for the seat screw. May have to do something similar myself.

 

[jorgy]

I had an 11 and 12 M8 side by side today.

Anyone notice the distance from the spindles to the rear suspension arm mounting point is several inches shorter then 05-11 M series?

This would explain the more nimble, easier to handle feel in comparison to the previous Ms.

Anyone remember last years 800 comparo in Snowest where that was compared. If memory serves me last years M and the PRO were similar and the XP was quite a bit longer.

I think everyone will be impressed with the Pro Climb handling when people get to ride them. I know I was impressed with them last year.

There are several improvements I really like that I haven't seen mentioned a lot:

1.) The torque link from the motor to jackshaft. Should result in better belt life, lower clutch temps and better performance.
2.) The A-arms are way easier to change.
3.) The center section should be way cheaper and easier to replace then the old M series hood.
4.) The track tensioner bolts are way easier to access.
5.) The rear axle wheel assembly is way beefier.
6.) Chaincase should be more reliable
7.) No more melted oil tanks with the magnesium oil tank
8.) Handlebars go way high. Can't imagine needing a riser unless your 7' tall
9.) Steering effort is soooo much lighter then the 08 and up M and lighter then the 05-07 M
10.) Rides way better in the bumps

I had an 06, 09 and 11 M and while I liked all of them, I don't see any advantage to the old chassis at all. Basically Cat has fixed all the weak links of the old M series while combining the bulletproof motors. Whats not to like???

Also, I like your idea for the seat screw. May have to do something similar myself.

I'll second the handlebar height. I stood on one at Hay Days, put the thing all the way up, and for the first time my elbows were still bent. I'm 6'5".

 

[CO 2.0]

I'm going to the 38" front end. Haven't stripped or measured anything yet but wanted to comment on the above shock swap. The travel on the front end is limited top and bottom by the shock. The length AND the travel needs to be very close or you may allow the front arms to move further than design. That could cause some parts some problems.
Also a shock rebound valved for 60 psi start will likely be a little off in the main stack for a shock starting at 90psi. Just a heads up.

Trust me first thing on my mind when I installed them. That's why I posted the different shaft lengths thinking one is valved totally different. I put one of each shock on each side and did some garage riding on one ski. They felt the same with the evol r having more rebound, but I know that isn't real work testing or much load on the shocks. I measured the travel between the two while rocking the sled back/forth with a ski off the ground and the oil marks on the shafts measured the same length. Again, preobably doesn't tell me that much. I'm going to give Fox a call and possibly Tom's snowmobile and get their input on the matter before I go ahead and run them as is.

 

[CO 2.0]

I know I have a couple gripes about the sled, I expected that with a first year sled. But trust me this thing looks and feels amazing. The ergos are great, and it just feels more comfortable standing on it compared to my M. I just know this thing is gonna rock.

Looks like the intake bogging issues will be gone for me now which I had been fighting all the time in deep fluff on my M. And if they get clogged, they are easy to wipe off.

So since there is no mechanical gas gauge, how are we gonna know how much gas we have in reality? Does 1 bar on the electronic gauge mean 10 miles during normal operating conditions? I hope I don't over judge on it and run out of gas lol.

Looks like a Mountain Addiction gas rack can be mounted on the tunnel even with how the cooler cuts are oriented.

I covered the hole in the "storage" compartment under the seat like the other guy did on here with epoxy. I used a new product called JB weld Kwik Plastic. The stuff works great and is so much easier than any plastic repair methods I've used yet. Just had to spray paint it black since it's a blue color.

These 800's should run even stronger than the previous 800's considering the increase in primary weight.

I put my tool bag behind the oil tank. I used a velcro strap I had lying around and secured it to the metal tubing.

I still had a minor issue with my secondary. Thanks to those pointing out the washer we need to use instead of the cap (sneaky design change lol). I used my washer and opened the sheaves as far as I could. The belt is extremely tight to get on this way. What I did is double up the washer used so it's twice as thick. This allowed me to open the sheaves a tad bit more to get the belt on easier.

I see track tension went down to 2" spec now. The rails look like they curve up more gradually in front.

I added some more heat tape on the intake tubing. There are a couple areas that get close to the pipe where there is no heat tape. I feel keeping the intake tube plastic's temps down more will help with air charge temps.

I also notice my 1/2" and 9/16" tools I use for the M chassis are now 13mm and 15mm tools on the proclimb chassis

I took the fan off my primary and placed it on my '10 M8. It will fit, but it looks like the side panel will push against it and destroy it in a good solid sidehill.

 

[sled_guy]

You shaved a ton off that flap, wow. That might come back to haunt you, its a pretty important part of the cooling system. Be interesting to see if you have higher temps than others experience.

sled_guy

 

[CO 2.0]

It's not going to have as much effect as the M sleds on the rear flap. The rear cooler stops way shorter than the M's. I have my M flap cut shorter than this and have never had any cooling issues when running my scratchers down even on long hard pack trails. I am usually just in powder though The rear cooler should also be cooled off by snow sitting on the top of the tunnel. The new HCR has no rear cooler either, so I figure those sleds will get hotter quicker than mine. There is a new HCR in my group, so I'll know very soon once the snow flies.

I talked to Fox racing today and they said the shock size is a bit different and the valving is different on the M shocks compared to the new proclimb. So these evol R's off my M won't work for the new proclimb. They are developing a brand new evol R for the new chassis, and it will be available in mid October.

 

[geo]

The new chassis (std and sp) has 60% more cooling capacity over the olden, lol, M-sled (3.9 l before now 6.3 l). Probably to help the turbo 4 banger.
Coolant pump and flow across the head are the same as before. I never had any issue before and don't expect an issue now. That's why I chose to start with the HCR this year for my build. Finned heat exchangers with lots of capacity and placed in the correct area for deep snow riding. I think this will be adapted to the climb sleds in the future as AC refines the powder sleds.

Sled Guy. You've hinted at cooling problems before for this new chassis. The math doesn`t make sense to me. They were overbuilt before. Do you know something from your spring rides? Or, are you just angry that the 800 couldn't pull you out of that bowl last spring LOL.

Careful wording now. No anti proclimb hinting anymore please. I have one at home. Give it to me straight. Were they overheating POS's.

 

[WyoBoy1000]

Thank you Geo,

In '11 the doo and cat had nearly the exact same distance from the spindles to the arch in the rails where the track meets the ground and the PRO put the track down a long ways in front of them both. I think and always thought this was the key to rider input, then you add the geometry of the arms and spindles and you have one of the best sleds on the mountain. So Cat learned from it or maybe already was working in that direction and did the same, very good idea.

If you can stand on the sled and reach the handle bars with your arms bent, I don't think that is a good thing, maybe it is on these sleds but on the M series it made it harder to ride, i e get your weight behind it. If the P-C works anything like the M's in this aspect I will be lowering mine, and I'm 6'6".

 

[sled_guy]

Sled Guy. You've hinted at cooling problems before for this new chassis. The math doesn`t make sense to me. They were overbuilt before. Do you know something from your spring rides? Or, are you just angry that the 800 couldn't pull you out of that bowl last spring LOL.

Careful wording now. No anti proclimb hinting anymore please. I have one at home. Give it to me straight. Were they overheating POS's.

Nope, no issues with cooling that I saw and we rode them on some pretty hard packed trails at times. I've just seen issues when snowflaps get hacked down or removed and was curious on the new sled... of course we won't know until they are on the snow. I suspect you are right, the 2 stroke probably won't have any issues because of the increased size of the cooling system... that's one advantage of having the chassis designed to accomodate the 4 stroke turbo too.

sled_guy