Obama haters, what say you?

[ruffryder]

gas tax break reality


hmmmmm, McCain and 30 years or whatever of experience, and yet he got this wrong?

Post turtle Obama, having no experience, and supposedly always pandering to the public, got this right?

Maybe he is not the anti-christ after all? That or when they both flipped a coin to see which way to go on the subject, McCain got tails while Obama got heads.....

 

[yammadog]

It's already too late for construction spending, if they stop it, raise it or just leave it. WSDOT said that the funding is way low due to less gas being purchased and bids for projects are way high due to cost of asphalt and fuel to get it there. I heard they cancelled the repave of I-90 over snoqualmie. Which is a push since they are going to replace it all anyway in another year.

The arguement is a dead issue until we adapt and the government stops spending like it grows on trees. The next party is going to be the "Boston Gas Party" and the govt ain't going to like it, just like the last ruling party didn't like it when tea was the issue. I'm buying a gun and getting ready.

And your antichrist knows all the answers?

 

[ruffryder]

And your antichrist knows all the answers?

You bet, he even told me the winning lottery numbers.. Can be yours for 50 bucks.

 

[yammadog]

You bet, he even told me the winning lottery numbers.. Can be yours for 50 bucks.

LOL....I'll pay the 50 and you get the bar tab!!!

good thing you moved to seattle you liberal....thing is you wreck into more trees than you hug!!!

 

[pernikm]

Why would we have to raise taxes? Why can't the government do what businesses and families do when things get too expensive? I just do without and cut back on luxury. There is no entitlement to high standards of living. I am absolutely sure there is some government pork barrel project that we can all do without that can cover increased energy costs. No one is guaranteeing my job, insurance, home, food clothing, snowmobile. The whole concept of an entilement eludes me. If you can't afford it...you just can't f***'n afford it...

Karl

 

[H2SNOW]

drill, YOU CAN DRILL IN MY BACK YARD IF YOU WANT ....IF THERE IS OIL THERE !! royalty ,royalty royalties

 

[XC700116]

Why would we have to raise taxes?l

Well that would be because if people actually start using less they would have to raise the taxes on it to get the same amount of money coming in. They have absolutely no concept of spending less or cutting cost. They all continue to trow money at problems to fix them. Public housing, crime, unemployment, healthcare, Where does it end.

THIS IS THE SINGLE BIGGEST PROBLEM WITH OUR ECONOMY!!!!!!!!!!!

Until these chuckle heads wake up and smell the coffee we will continue our downward trend/spiral/plummet whatever you want to call it.

No matter how you spin it raising taxes will NOT HELP our economy. Giving out 3, 6 and 12 hundred dollar checks won't help either. (BUSH AND OBAMA) Thats not how to stimulate an economy. You want to see business come back to the US, unemployment rates fall, and government revenue increase. LOWER TAXES!!! Take a page from Ireland's play book. They lowered corporate income tax to 12% across the board and their economy exploded at a rate that had never been seen before in Europe. At that kind of tax rate business can afford to do business here, can expand and grow to create jobs, and expand the tax base thereby bringing in more revenue by spreading the burden over the larger tax base. Just like how Walmart (oh crap I said the dirty word) makes money on selling things at lower prices. Novel idea eh!

The stupid Gas tax debate is just that pandering to the public. Leave it where it is and don't raise it. The Gas tax Holiday makes about as much sense as the Economic Stimulus Plan it doesn't. I'm not saying I didn't cash my $600 check when I got it I'm just saying that I in no way expected it to stimulate the economy in a meaningful way.

The government needs a business lesson. If a business needs/wants to bring in more money it cannot successfully just raise prices (taxes in the govt sense) to make it happen. They will go bankrupt and close up shop. They need to look for ways to cut costs, and new ways to earn the money or boost capital through attracting investors.

 

[ruffryder]

thing is you wreck into more trees than you hug!!!

It is called foreplay, and as the name implies, I like it ruff!

 

[XC700116]

It is called foreplay, and as the name implies, I like it ruff!

Now that's funny!!

 

[ruffryder]

Well that would be because if people actually start using less they would have to raise the taxes on it to get the same amount of money coming in. They have absolutely no concept of spending less or cutting cost. They all continue to trow money at problems to fix them.

Good point, I don't have a clue as to what type of projects the money will go for, but I would assume some of them need to be done and can't be defferred.

Take a page from Ireland's play book. They lowered corporate income tax to 12% across the board and their economy exploded at a rate that had never been seen before in Europe.

It is my belief that a growth economies short term benefits are smaller than the long term costs. The costs grow at a faster rate that what the growth provides in benifits, and when the economy slows, so does the money coming in, while the costs remain constant, which is what is happening here now.

 

[XC700116]

It is my belief that a growth economies short term benefits are smaller than the long term costs. The costs grow at a faster rate that what the growth provides in benifits, and when the economy slows, so does the money coming in, while the costs remain constant, which is what is happening here now.

The only reason the money coming in has slowed is that it hasn't kept up to increased spending (the war, domestic feel good programs, ect) The barriers to business that are continuing to degrade our economy is ever increasing tax burdens and costs associated with the price of fuel.

As for your belief in how the economy is working that is true to an extent. But that would only apply in the relationship that our government has been in with Taxes and the way they spend money. They base programs and spending on continued future growth and in any economic slowdown it bites them in the A$$.

In reality our Economy isn't in bad shape minus the Gas prices and the "housing crisis" Both of which cannot be fixed by more government spending. But can be by getting out of the way.

Gas Prices can be brought down. Open ANWR to a limited extent. (one time only on the 2 thousand or so acres that was requested and proven to hold the type of reserves we need) and open up to off-shore drilling. Keep in place the highest environmental safety standards and start production. Tell the F-ing Sierra club to get F-ed and allow building a couple of new refineries. Then Give MONSTER tax breaks in the short term development stages to any alternative energy development by anyone willing to do it. Get RID of all Subsidies (in the form of govt hand outs) to both alternative and conventional energy companies. It's an artificial form of development and doesn't provide for a successfully functioning business.

As for Housing let them take their lumps. sure some people are gonna fall flat on their A$$ but the rest will come out better for it. Couple this with the lower Corporate taxes and that will keep the major banks going through the adjustment period as to not have a total collapse on Wall Street.

 

[yammadog]

The school board for my area, just approved a budget that is $1mil over their revenues.......how? This is just the school board of a small area, I think this is even larger in the larger gov't agencies. They actually approved spending more than they have, it was a group decision....... They have been pushing to get a bond passed for a few years, citing growth with more kids coming in....but the reality is that we are having less kids enrolled and it's causing budget pressures by not getting the states funding per child.

The gov't agencies have flat out decided they will spend whatever they want and make us pay the bill whether we approve the funding or not. It's happened for sports facilities and it happens with every aspect of our gov't.

They don't spend it wisely, then they threaten us with cuts in safety items and recreation. A local county is threatening cuts in the sheriff/prosecutors office, yet they are going to spend $7.3 mil on a fence to keep dumba$$ people from jumping off a bridge!!??

The big problem is that anyone with an ounce of common sense is not willing to spend their time in the gov't trying to make things work right. The one's that do show up are sold to the highest bidder and scared to tell the special interests..NO...Anyone know a state or higher politician that isn't well off financially?

The time is coming for a revolt and people better be ready. Unless you think it's going to change somehow.

 

[XC700116]

The school board for my area, just approved a budget that is $1mil over their revenues.......how? This is just the school board of a small area, I think this is even larger in the larger gov't agencies. They actually approved spending more than they have, it was a group decision....... They have been pushing to get a bond passed for a few years, citing growth with more kids coming in....but the reality is that we are having less kids enrolled and it's causing budget pressures by not getting the states funding per child.

The gov't agencies have flat out decided they will spend whatever they want and make us pay the bill whether we approve the funding or not. It's happened for sports facilities and it happens with every aspect of our gov't.

They don't spend it wisely, then they threaten us with cuts in safety items and recreation. A local county is threatening cuts in the sheriff/prosecutors office, yet they are going to spend $7.3 mil on a fence to keep dumba$$ people from jumping off a bridge!!??

The big problem is that anyone with an ounce of common sense is not willing to spend their time in the gov't trying to make things work right. The one's that do show up are sold to the highest bidder and scared to tell the special interests..NO...Anyone know a state or higher politician that isn't well off financially?

All big points of my argument. Fiscal responsibility and telling special interests, Big business handouts and sniveling winers alike NO.

 

[R J]

Idiots only believe this fuel thing is goverment related. Come fricken on, it won't matter who's in office as long as the dollar is weak, the economy is in the tank, the housing market is off and were in or on the edge of recession. Plain and simple. When everything is going good, prices are low, when things go bad in terms of money prices go up.

Maybe if we vote in Jesse Ventura he will make oil free? That's how stupid any oil talk is when it relates to who's who in the white house.

Yes I dislike Obama, I don't want to offend anyone by saying such a strong word as hate.

 

[XC700116]

Idiots only believe this fuel thing is goverment related. Come fricken on, it won't matter who's in office as long as the dollar is weak, the economy is in the tank, the housing market is off and were in or on the edge of recession. Plain and simple. When everything is going good, prices are low, when things go bad in terms of money prices go up.

Maybe if we vote in Jesse Ventura he will make oil free? That's how stupid any oil talk is when it relates to who's who in the white house.

Yes I dislike Obama, I don't want to offend anyone by saying such a strong word as hate.

Are you kidding? it has everything to do with government. If we cannot do anything to increase our production of Oil and refined petroleum products and the world wide demand increases what is the effect on the price? That is what has happened over the last few years. The inflation and instability has contributed, no doubt, but it isn't the sole culprit. The fact of the matter is we will continue to see rising gas/oil prices as long as we are not increasing our production. We aren't going to be able to talk China into using less and we can't continue to ask the middle-eastern nations to increase production when we refuse to do it ourselves, even when we have more oil under our land than they do. If I was them I'd tell us to get bent too, and keep rolling in the cash.

 

[winter brew]

Are you kidding? it has everything to do with government. If we cannot do anything to increase our production of Oil and refined petroleum products and the world wide demand increases what is the effect on the price? That is what has happened over the last few years. The inflation and instability has contributed, no doubt, but it isn't the sole culprit. The fact of the matter is we will continue to see rising gas/oil prices as long as we are not increasing our production. We aren't going to be able to talk China into using less and we can't continue to ask the middle-eastern nations to increase production when we refuse to do it ourselves, even when we have more oil under our land than they do. If I was them I'd tell us to get bent too, and keep rolling in the cash.

I keep hearing the oil prices being blamed on increases in demand. I have a difficult time believing this. It took 100 years for gas to go from a few cents to $2/ gallon all while we went from horse and carriage and a few wealthy people owning cars to where we are today.....then it literally doubles to over $4/gallon in a little over 1 year. No major increases in demand, no major fluctuation in supply, at least nothing that justifies much ore than a slight price increase. I think it comes down to pure greed, nothing more....as long as we pay it, someone is getting rich.

 

[XC700116]

Quotes from BBC NEW Oil Anylists



* Analysts say growth in global supplies is worryingly failing to keep pace with growth in demand
* Supplies from countries such as Russia are thought to have peaked and finding new sources of oil is difficult and expensive
* Increasing reliance on members of the Middle-East dominated oil producers group Opec, many of which are already pumping as much oil as they can
* Saudi Arabia is one of few countries with spare capacity but it has been reluctant to boost output substantially

DEMAND GROWTH

* Global thirst for oil is intense. Demand has risen by about 3 million barrels a day since 2005 and is expected to rise by 32 million barrels a day in the next two decades
* The US remains the world's largest oil consumer and high individual fuel usage continues to put pressure on crude stockpiles
* Fast-growing China and India are forecast to account for 40% of the growth in oil demand by 2030, as industry grows and demand for travel increases

source http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/business/7469124.stm

 

[Dogmeat]

that's actually about the only thing I actually agree with Obama on energy policy on ... the "gas tax holiday" is a gimmick that does nothing to address a problem, and will just cause the government to raise taxes on something else to make up for it.

 

[XC700116]

right there with ya dog

 

[R J]

XC700116

Somewhat true, but we haven't been doing that for years. Even back as early as 2-4 years ago what was the price. It was low, compared to now with the same government. We got ourselves into a bind with the mortgage mess, speculators, early on our economy was great which meant places like China were able to expand and so on putting a squeeze on evething. If our economy keeps slidding, so will all other developing nations more or less. With them going down and us going down, that leaves more oil on the world market which of course drives down prices.

There is enough oil out there, we should be drilling in places we know have oil. But that is 10 years from discovery to production if not more.