May we bring this thread back up in 6 to 8 months time when Ford is in the exact same boat? No major auto manufacturer in the world is profitable right now. None of them. You even said it yourself, Ford refinanced itself at the right time, but that only buys them more time. What's the difference if they are filing for bankruptcy now or late in the year? They are all bleeding cash and need a rebuild of their structure as a company.
GM and Dodge Possibilities after Bankruptcy
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May we bring this thread back up in 6 to 8 months time when Ford is in the exact same boat? No major auto manufacturer in the world is profitable right now. None of them. You even said it yourself, Ford refinanced itself at the right time, but that only buys them more time. What's the difference if they are filing for bankruptcy now or late in the year? They are all bleeding cash and need a rebuild of their structure as a company.
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Diesel99
Member
from the WSJ
General Motors Corp.'s $82.2 billion in assets and $172 billion in liabilities spell out the extent of its problems and sheer breadth of the 101-year-old giant's bankruptcy.
In a torrent of filings at the U.S. Bankruptcy Court in Manhattan, GM's mind-numbing scale is evident: It has 463 subsidiaries and has built 450 million cars and trucks over the years. It employs 235,000 people worldwide. This includes 91,000 in the United States, which it pays $476 million each month, and 493,000 retirees with various benefits. It spends $50 billion a year buying parts and services from 11,500 vendors in North America.
General Motors Corp.'s $82.2 billion in assets and $172 billion in liabilities spell out the extent of its problems and sheer breadth of the 101-year-old giant's bankruptcy.
In a torrent of filings at the U.S. Bankruptcy Court in Manhattan, GM's mind-numbing scale is evident: It has 463 subsidiaries and has built 450 million cars and trucks over the years. It employs 235,000 people worldwide. This includes 91,000 in the United States, which it pays $476 million each month, and 493,000 retirees with various benefits. It spends $50 billion a year buying parts and services from 11,500 vendors in North America.
I don't have a problem with the big three per say, other than if they go through bankruptcy and stay affiliated with the UAW. I have a problem with the UAW and government making the big three fail and not accepting any responsibility. Unions are dinosaurs and the government has gone way overboard on employee rights and too soft on CEO's. I think it is amazing that the big three have lasted this long with what was required from the unions and government. I have great respect for the way they gave above and beyond what anyone should expect for pensions and benefits. The small bit of corruption in these manufacturing companies does not hold a candle to the governnment or tech based businesses.
I will probably still buy their vehicles due to the fact that I need the HD trucks for towing and there is not a better product available. I would just feel a lot better if I knew my money wasn't Going to the UAW after they brought the best of America to it's knees.
I will probably still buy their vehicles due to the fact that I need the HD trucks for towing and there is not a better product available. I would just feel a lot better if I knew my money wasn't Going to the UAW after they brought the best of America to it's knees.
Have you found a way to NOT support it? If so, please let us know!!! I asked my state rep where I find the paperwork to withdraw from supporting this outrageous spending, I've yet to get an answer but I figure I'll have an IRS agent knocking on my door before too long.
Did I read correctly that the same day GM files Chapter 11, the admin gives them another 30 billion???? That brings it up to 110 Billion $$$, flushed down the toilet. NICE!!!!!
So, is GM going to dump it's retirees on the Union, or the pension guarantee corp? I'm guessing that's why Obama gave the unions the companies, so the government wouldn't get stuck with the employee's retirements. Something tells me, the union will "lose" all the money, and the employees won't be eligible for the guarantee corp.
So much for competition. Socialism is an ugly master. So, if GM's too big to fail, why should they do anything but just make the same old vehicles? There's no advantage to being the best anymore.
BTW, did you guys hear Amtrack and GM are merging? Some of you will understand what I'm saying....
So much for competition. Socialism is an ugly master. So, if GM's too big to fail, why should they do anything but just make the same old vehicles? There's no advantage to being the best anymore.
BTW, did you guys hear Amtrack and GM are merging? Some of you will understand what I'm saying....
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Ollie
ACCOUNT CLOSED
Hey, I just found out something.
I knew that Canada was going to get 12.5% of GM. I just figured that was to cover the Canadian unions part of their retirement.
I didn't know you nice Canadians were going to fork over 9.5 Billion for that 12.5%
Thanks.
oh,
and welcome to our socialist nightmare.
I knew that Canada was going to get 12.5% of GM. I just figured that was to cover the Canadian unions part of their retirement.
I didn't know you nice Canadians were going to fork over 9.5 Billion for that 12.5%
Thanks.
oh,
and welcome to our socialist nightmare.
...... the US government probably has the largest vehicle fleet in the world. They also now own GM. Do you think you're going to get a fair shot at the 'fleet replacement' business???
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Ollie
ACCOUNT CLOSED
It's deeper than that.
Ford saw the handwriting on the wall and leveraged themselves to the hilt.
They made it possible for them to weather the financial storm.
They were also betting that GM and possibly Chrysler would go into bankrupcy. This would cause the car makers to fracture and split into smaller and less profitable (there fore less of a buisness threat) company(s).
By doing so it would leave Ford as the only U.S. auto maker left.
That would put them in a great place to repay all their debt and recover from the financial mess in tact.
now, GM is getting a free ride, Chrysler already got a free ride and Ford still has to compete with both companies. It isn't fair. Obama stepped in and messed up the whole system to benefit his party and his carreer. This could very well force Ford in bankrupcy because GM and Chrysler don't have the debt load that ford now does. The one car maker that made the hard choices to survive may go down because the 2 companies that did everything wrong are getting a free ride.
On a side note,
I like Obama's speach about how he doens't want to be in the car buisness.
He just like to fire company presidents, dictate that the unions get several times more than they should have in bankrupcy, dictates what kind of cars are built and what the pay for managers should be.
Sounds like he is running it to me.
I like my truck...
Ford is only making it right now because of the great decisions by Alan Mulally when he took over....
These decisions made by the goverment will hurt Ford if they do not abide by fair trade practices...
Do you think they will do? I don't.
Ford is only making it right now because of the great decisions by Alan Mulally when he took over....
These decisions made by the goverment will hurt Ford if they do not abide by fair trade practices...
Do you think they will do? I don't.
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Ollie
ACCOUNT CLOSED
Well Ollie, when you sleep next to an elephant, you know when it rolls over...
More like you know when it takes a dump.
, I've yet to get an answer but I figure I'll have an IRS agent knocking on my door before too long.
NICE!!!!!
Per the Whitehouse last weekend there will be 800 new hires for the IRS, Hmmmm I wonder why?
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Ollie
ACCOUNT CLOSED
You want to know the thoughts of ultra liberals on the GM crash.
http://www.newsmax.com/insidecover/moore_gm_bankruptcy/2009/06/01/220369.html?s=al&promo_code=80C1-1
http://www.newsmax.com/insidecover/moore_gm_bankruptcy/2009/06/01/220369.html?s=al&promo_code=80C1-1
I received the same letter, they can KISS MY A$$.
No more money from me until WE get our money BACK and gm is back on their own ( which I plan to never see)
All spiffs & deals from GM have been recended per the news.
Filmmaker and leftist activist Michael Moore said the demise of General Motors filled him with ‘joy’ Monday and then suggested the Obama administration launch into a massive socialization of U.S. industry to build ‘green’ autos and bullet trains.
To pay for it all, he suggests a $2 per gallon federal tax.
The Whitehouse says the 50 Bil GM got will be paid back in 5 years, In 1980 GMs world wide sales was 11 billion with a 45% USA market share. In 2008 GM's world wide sales was 13 billion & a 22% USA market share.
So how can GM payback 10 bil for the next 5 years w-out Major Taxpayer help?
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Diesel99
Member
After it's all said and done there will only be about 7000 direct GM employes left in Canada so that works out too???
9.5 billion divided by 7000 = 1,357,142 per saved job
Nobody said politicians were very smart.
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