First ride on DTS 129 on groomed trail review

[Ben 500RR-S]

The setup; 35-40 degrees F, it was warm. Just enough snow to ride on=low snow. Snirt to perfectly groomed trail, very little in the way of bumps. There was really just enough snow to ride on and not enough to make any bumps, which was good.

I will also start by saying that I've always been a trail-rider, both on the snowmobile and on the dirtbike. My 2004 121" 600 cc snowmobile has SkiDoo precision skis. The precision skis were stopped by SkiDoo as they got sued by another skimaker that had a patent on the design. Those early years of the Rev and those skis that had the carbides on the very outside edge of the skis had many for the 2004, 2005, 2006-shoot, I don't know how many years people complained of ski-darting from all the sleds on the trails using the same skis. The dual runner skis were a new thing and everyone was running them and everyone was complaining of darting from everyones skis wanting to follow the same lines on the trails.

Now with that said, I have no expectations of a snowbike, with only one ski, to track anywhere near like a snowmobile on a trail-any trail. While we rode for a good 20 miles on mostly tight trails that had no one else on them yesterday, it sure was not a "riding on rails" experience by any means. The ski was loose as was the track, but this was the fun and again, I sure as heck ain't expecting snowmobile front end tracking at all. But compared to riding a dirtbike, the ride and handling is a LOT better than a wheel/tire would be over the same trails if they had no snow. Now, with that said, neither of us washed out once or even came close to it. Our confidence level with the front ski is notching up higher and higher with all the time we have been spending riding on every snow surface but ice. Not once have either of us worried about either darting, lack of front end control or confidence in the stick of the Camso front ski with its dual carbides and sweet outboard skags.

My BIL, who has probably 1/4 of the time on the DTS 129 kit that I do-I've been riding every second I've been able to, and he has had a lot less time the past year riding on the dirt but he was/has been thrilled with how the sled runs on all the trails and conditions we have been riding on/in. Neither of us wiped out or even came close to washing out or with the ski pushing, in fact, we both agree that the front ski rocks and that the handling on the groomed trails yesterday was great. He now wants to sell all 5 of his 2008/2009 snowmobiles, all of which have<2,000 miles on them for all snowbikes as he can't see himself ever getting back on one after all the time has been spent on the snowbike this winter.

Now, I will temper this review with the fact that the snow was very soft. I'll be looking forward to riding the groomed trails when they are as hard as a rock and until then will wonder how bad the ski may dart but I already know that I won't mind it and will just have to accept it as part of the game and that no ski is going to ever track like a sled with a 48" wide stance and a 15"-16" track out back going 450-500lbs and just consider it cross-training for when the dirt comes back this spring.

What also helps us is that we have no reference to any other snowbike kit. I think that this is a good thing as we have nothing to compare or complain/bitch or whine about and constantly worrying or wondering if there is something better out there. Sometimes this is a very good thing in this day and age of analysis paralysis and TMI. Some can't be happy because they know there is something else out there. Just enjoying it is good enough for us.

 

[Snowbikenewbie]

Great post Ben. Can you tell us what setup you were using?

1. Stock fork springs?
2. Limited cable position?
3. Suspension cam position

Thanks again

 

[Ben 500RR-S]

Yes, stock fork springs in my 2017 Beta, which has Sachs front forks, with Motorex 5W fork oil at the stock level. Rebound is full fast and compression is full-hard.

Limiter cable is at the stock powder setting, the way it comes from Camso. I will never change this setting as I want to be setup for powder and seeing/feeling how the sled ran on the trails yesterday, I feel no need to change it.

I have also left the torsion spring on soft, the way it also comes from Camso.

 

[Ben 500RR-S]

My boy finally got to ride his little yellow SkiDoo Rev and was loving it.

It was funny how, at first, he was afraid of all the downhill parts of the field and the road/trail but after the first go-round, he was fine with all of them. Every time he took a break I would turn down the throttle limiter and by yesterday, he said he needed more power so I turned the limiter screw all the way off so he could have full-power=nice.

 

[Misha Subo]

Ben, I knew you were out there enjoying the Camso as we have not heard from you recently.

I've only had two days out but so far...good feedback from the ski. I can't believe how similar the Camso is to alpine touring on fat skis in the deep powder.

Now if we could only figure out a good method for shuttling up the slope out in the Ontario wilderness there'd be no need for ski trips out to the Rockies.

 

[dirtnerd]

Now with that said, I have no expectations of a snowbike, with only one ski, to track anywhere near like a snowmobile on a trail-any trail. While we rode for a good 20 miles on mostly tight trails that had no one else on them yesterday, it sure was not a "riding on rails" experience by any means. The ski was loose as was the track, but this was the fun and again, I sure as heck ain't expecting snowmobile front end tracking at all. But compared to riding a dirtbike, the ride and handling is a LOT better than a wheel/tire would be over the same trails if they had no snow.

my experience is the same with my 2018 DTS 129, about 20 hours of total riding . Front ski works great doesn't wash out. it does follow sled ski ruts while on the trail but talking to my buddies that appears to be a snow bike in general trait.

our last ride was from Greystokes 201 loading area to Big White ski resort for lunch and drinks. trail was well groomed but soft snow. Was actually super fun, I could throw the bike full throttle into the corners and it would rail them. I could ride flat out with confidence. I recently upgraded my bike a bit so I can run 6th gear now where before I couldn't run 5th wihtout feathering the clutch, so made for some high speed trail riding.

bike 2017 fe501
mods:
6.2 front fork springs
FMF 4.1 slip on
desmog
vortex ecu - map 1

I need to try some other kits for reference but all of the "negatives" I heard about the Camso kit I personally haven't experienced.

 

[Ben 500RR-S]

Ben, I knew you were out there enjoying the Camso as we have not heard from you recently.

I've only had two days out but so far...good feedback from the ski. I can't believe how similar the Camso is to alpine touring on fat skis in the deep powder.

Now if we could only figure out a good method for shuttling up the slope out in the Ontario wilderness there'd be no need for ski trips out to the Rockies.

It was also good to see that you finally got the kits on and out there as well. Thankfully I've been able to ride at least once a week so far and this past weekend was bonus as Saturday was all snowmobile with the kid-I forgot how much fun it is to ride the sled again, but not as much fun as the snowbike. Then to trail ride on Sunday and back to the sleds to have fun with the kid at the hayfield was a total bonus.

I think that the entire kit in powder is just incredible. There were many times that I would be at a stop, going up a steep hill, in powder that was chest-high, and knowing in my head that the track would get me going again, I'd click into gear and up-up and away, the bike would sure as shyt, get up and go, not to mention the ski works as it should in the powder. I don't even have to think about it, that is how good it works in powder.

We need snow badly up north as it is going to rain tonight/tomorrow and again this upcoming weekend. I'm still planning to go up and ride as I will ride on anything, as long as it is white.

 

[Ben 500RR-S]

my experience is the same with my 2018 DTS 129, about 20 hours of total riding . Front ski works great doesn't wash out. it does follow sled ski ruts while on the trail but talking to my buddies that appears to be a snow bike in general trait.

our last ride was from Greystokes 201 loading area to Big White ski resort for lunch and drinks. trail was well groomed but soft snow. Was actually super fun, I could throw the bike full throttle into the corners and it would rail them. I could ride flat out with confidence. I recently upgraded my bike a bit so I can run 6th gear now where before I couldn't run 5th wihtout feathering the clutch, so made for some high speed trail riding.

bike 2017 fe501
mods:
6.2 front fork springs
FMF 4.1 slip on
desmog
vortex ecu - map 1

I need to try some other kits for reference but all of the "negatives" I heard about the Camso kit I personally haven't experienced.

Everyone has their opinion, no problem with that. Some like or love the ski, others hate it.

I will agree, though, that the ski has been about flawless for us on everything but glare ice as we have not tried it on that, yet. The bike does feel very dirtbike-like coming out of corners I/we can get the rear end to step-out just like the rear wheel on the bike. At the same time, I try to keep track spin to a minimum as I don't want to wear out my track too much, although I also know that a spinning track on snow doesn't wear out anywhere near as much as the rear tires on the dirt do. When I think about it, the only reason I had to change the track on my sled is from all the boondocking I would do and while the sled was on its side in turns, I would have the outside lugs of the track hitting the frozen ground and ended up chunking so many lugs over the years that I was worried I'd lose the track like my buddy did on a lake one night so I replaced the track with a 1.25" Ice Ripper=problem solved.

I'm glad I'm not the only one who is loving the DTS 129. It sure is a hoot.

 

[RMK935VA]

The DTS track is superb. The new CMX track is supposed to be even better. I don't know about the ski but my buddy who is a racer and rep likes the Yeti ski more than the DTS he had last year or the Timbersled that he has this year. Having not rode either I cannot say much about them. I do like my Yeti ski. It holds well and tracks well even on trails that are carved up with multiple sled tracks. It has never washed out on me on the trail or in powder.

 

[Vincenthdfan]

The setup; 35-40 degrees F, it was warm. Just enough snow to ride on=low snow. Snirt to perfectly groomed trail, very little in the way of bumps. There was really just enough snow to ride on and not enough to make any bumps, which was good.

I will also start by saying that I've always been a trail-rider, both on the snowmobile and on the dirtbike. My 2004 121" 600 cc snowmobile has SkiDoo precision skis. The precision skis were stopped by SkiDoo as they got sued by another skimaker that had a patent on the design. Those early years of the Rev and those skis that had the carbides on the very outside edge of the skis had many for the 2004, 2005, 2006-shoot, I don't know how many years people complained of ski-darting from all the sleds on the trails using the same skis. The dual runner skis were a new thing and everyone was running them and everyone was complaining of darting from everyones skis wanting to follow the same lines on the trails.

Now with that said, I have no expectations of a snowbike, with only one ski, to track anywhere near like a snowmobile on a trail-any trail. While we rode for a good 20 miles on mostly tight trails that had no one else on them yesterday, it sure was not a "riding on rails" experience by any means. The ski was loose as was the track, but this was the fun and again, I sure as heck ain't expecting snowmobile front end tracking at all. But compared to riding a dirtbike, the ride and handling is a LOT better than a wheel/tire would be over the same trails if they had no snow. Now, with that said, neither of us washed out once or even came close to it. Our confidence level with the front ski is notching up higher and higher with all the time we have been spending riding on every snow surface but ice. Not once have either of us worried about either darting, lack of front end control or confidence in the stick of the Camso front ski with its dual carbides and sweet outboard skags.

My BIL, who has probably 1/4 of the time on the DTS 129 kit that I do-I've been riding every second I've been able to, and he has had a lot less time the past year riding on the dirt but he was/has been thrilled with how the sled runs on all the trails and conditions we have been riding on/in. Neither of us wiped out or even came close to washing out or with the ski pushing, in fact, we both agree that the front ski rocks and that the handling on the groomed trails yesterday was great. He now wants to sell all 5 of his 2008/2009 snowmobiles, all of which have<2,000 miles on them for all snowbikes as he can't see himself ever getting back on one after all the time has been spent on the snowbike this winter.

Now, I will temper this review with the fact that the snow was very soft. I'll be looking forward to riding the groomed trails when they are as hard as a rock and until then will wonder how bad the ski may dart but I already know that I won't mind it and will just have to accept it as part of the game and that no ski is going to ever track like a sled with a 48" wide stance and a 15"-16" track out back going 450-500lbs and just consider it cross-training for when the dirt comes back this spring.

What also helps us is that we have no reference to any other snowbike kit. I think that this is a good thing as we have nothing to compare or complain/bitch or whine about and constantly worrying or wondering if there is something better out there. Sometimes this is a very good thing in this day and age of analysis paralysis and TMI. Some can't be happy because they know there is something else out there. Just enjoying it is good enough for us.

I'm sure glad to hear it works well on groomed trails.

If and when I finally go riding my 500 EXC Camso with my wife on her sled, we will be pretty well sticking to trails...with me dipping off the sides to play occasionally.

I was concerned based on some negative reports I've read regarding the ski darting on the trails.

I've heard from folks that the earlier 2017 carbides didn't dart as much as the 18 carbides...I have both, so I guess I'll experiment some and see.

Thanks for the re-assurance...great to hear.

 

[Ben 500RR-S]

While my BIL was feeding his 1 month old calf milk, as he is going to veal-out the little thing, we were talking about how to best ride the bike and I was telling him that I'm always telling myself to relax, and like that .38 Special song, "Hold on loosely. But don't let go. If you cling too tightly, you're gonna lose control . . . "

We had both agreed that anytime we both tried to force the bike to either turn, or move any which way we wanted it to go, other than the way the bike wants to go, it was more exhausting and wasted a LOT of energy. Provided there is no threat, no obstacle, no sled or other bike on the trail, to allow the ski to go where it wants to go is/was the right thing to do and by relaxing and letting the bike wander just a bit on the trail was a lot easier than fighting the front end and getting both frustrated and tired.

It reminds me of arm pump, and that by relaxing one's grip on the bars helps to lessen or eliminate the condition.

 

[Ben 500RR-S]

Three of us had more time on some ungroomed trails today and all of us, including my BIL's good friend, had a great time, even with NO powder.

The setup, a 2017 Beta 500 RR-S with a 2018 Camso DTS 129. A 2008 CRF450X with the same DTS 129 kit. Yoshimura pipe and no idea what else might have been done to the bike. All we know is that it runs really well.

It was Pete's first time on a snowbike and what a grand time he had. More of the setup, he rode the CRF. It was from 40 to 50 degrees F this afternoon. Softer loose granular snow, at least a 4" base that we could not get to bare ground on. Thankfully the snow was loose or we would not really be able to ride as I have learned that the bike will not ride on glare-ice or glazed over snow if the paddles cannot break through the ice. The snow was soft, Pete was a great rider and we set off for our closed course mountain road racetrack with enough snow to be able to get traction on and ride on.

I gave him only one piece of advice when riding on packed trails, to do like .38 Special sang about and "Hold on loosely, but don't let go. If you cling too tightly you're gonna lose control . . . " And it is so, so true with these kits on trails. Anything but pure powder really does demand some skill and some strength as the front ski grips so hard, and so well, that unlike how some (or many of the "street" riders-since any old moron can get on a streetbike and ride), any effort at resisting the turn and the lean means that one is going to get tired so fast, most will be wishing for their Mama as it simply ain't all that easy getting the snowbike to track on a trail if one does not have skill in piloting a dirtbike, no sir.

Now, there are many that can argue this but there is no winning it. Unless one has some pretty good skill on a dirtbike, to expect to get on a snowbike and just rail around and have a great time on any sort of trail just isn't or won't be possible. At least in all the conditions I've been riding in, which some could easily and justifiably call "East Coast Mountain Crap", where from the lack of snow, then warming, then thawing, we are East coast hardcore and will ride and have fun in anything as long as it is white, we take the time and go out if the trails can be ridden, and riding we are.

Many of you would not want to ride the garbage that some must think it is on the ground out there. But like the Camso DTS 129 commercial where they filmed the bike NOT riding in powder, but among pine trees where the snow is this springtime, loose granular, and I will say, as hard as it is to ride in, for some, I absolutely love it. Of course, we pine for the powder but, I will take riding on anything I can get on and at least the snowbike is actually still more fun than riding on any dirt, just because the dirtbike is the dirtbike, with gears, a clutch, but the surface is so smooth and so different. If one can just allow the body to relax-and this is my mantra on the hardpack, to relax, to just lean and let the bike go where it wants to go, that is it.

A little more riding tomorrow morning, then back home for another week of a harsh-reality that is no riding for 5 straight days and no big snowstorms in the forecast as we need another 24" for things to get good again.

 

[mb1]

My experience so far:
2011 Husaberg 570 & 2017 timbersled raw.

In retrospect I had the strut set too long and it was causing too much ski pressure and trenching. So the ski pressure gave a really positive feel but it was quite heavy to turn. And I spun out on a couple hills that I thought I’d have traction on. Now I see that it was due to the long strut and heavy ski pressure. Never washed out though!

I reduced the strut now so that the bike sits flat - ski- front and rear of track all touching the garage floor at the same time. The seat height is noticeably lower. I went for a quick rip now that we finally got some snow and it is much lighter steering feel. I’ve also welded on a pair of skegs to the timbersled runner. Hoping to get some confidence on the icy spots out there.