ETEC Engines in XPs for 2009

[Frostbite]

I am a boat guy as well as sledhead and I've always been impressed by the power, economy and the repsect earned by the Evinrude ETEC direct injected two stroke engines. They sip fuel, make great power and they get as good (if not better) emissions than the fourstrokes and they weigh in sometimes hundereds of pounds lighter. The boating magazines just love the engines.

When Bombardier bought OMC several years back I wondered? How long will it be before the ETEC engines find their way into the snowmobile line. Well I guess that question has been answered.

2009

Hey, I'm a Yamaha fourstroke guy but this announcement has sure turned my head. I want to ride one and there will demo sleds available soon.

I love the new XP platform but the engine reliability issues keep me away but this change just might make me look twice at Skidoos again.

Then again, if this engine line is successful in sleds; could it possibly drag Yamaha kicking and screaming back into the direct injected two stroke arena again? They have a very successful line of direct injected two stroke engines. I bet they will be watching the success of the XP chassis and the ETEC engines with great interest.

What do you think?

Frosty

 

[Ollie]

I think they still won't be able to hook a clutching system on it that will work, that and the cost will go up another 3k.

 

[MARV1]

E-Tec fuel economy is worse than a comparable 4-stroke, that extra bit of weight on the back of my boat doesn't matter. Plus burning that expensive 2-stroke oil in it along with the price of $1k more makes logical sense to buy that 4-stroke.

Did I just say that out loud? Sleds are different though, I'll take my lighter 2-stroke that is reliable over the E-Tec and 4-stroke.

 

[X-it]

E-Tec Is Here
The next generation is here, with the new Rotax 600 H.O. E-TEC engine. Proven in our Evinrude outboards, E-TEC technology delivers 15% better fuel economy than the SDI and has virtually no smoke or smell. Plus, most owners will have to add oil just once per season. It starts in one pull every time and even has an automatic summerization feature.

 

[drmiller100]

sounds like a great idea as long as it is cheaper or lighter then the competitors carbed 2 stroke.

 

[steveo10]

the 2stroke boats run a lot like a 4stroke. The 2-stroke technology has sure came a long ways in the last little while.

filling my oil once a yr... sure beats once a ride

 

[summitdude]

its funny how BRP spends $$$ on technology.....but reliability is going down the tubes!

if they consentrated on reliability as much as technology..they could have a monopoly on the sled market!

 

[Frostbite]

Not too many years ago Bombardier purchased both Orbital and fitch direct injection two stroke technologies. It wasn't too long after that they introduced the ETEC engines and set the boating propulsion world on its head.

They have done the same thing with the XP chassis. There's no doubt the other guys are scrambling (while disassembling an XP) to get even close to the weight loss Skidoo has achieved. I guess what i'm saying is if Skidoo develops a 900cc ETEC engine that get better economy and emissions than the four strokes (and it stays together) they could dominate sled sales.

Which could force Yamaha to build a direct injected two stroke or two to compete because I don't think (even as much as love Yamahas) they will ever get a fourstroke close to the weight of the XPs. Yes I love Yamahas but, happily wrestling with an extra 100 pounds of sled to drive one has it's limits.

Frosty

 

[rab]

I love the weight advantage of the two stroke and how the power band behaves
I can hardly wait untill the other manufactures get this technology in thier sleds
I wish the bombardier dept would look a little more at reliability, they could easily extend the life of some of thier components and still be light and strong

 

[actionfigurejoe]

Not too many years ago Bombardier purchased both Orbital and fitch direct injection two stroke technologies. It wasn't too long after that they introduced the ETEC engines and set the boating propulsion world on its head.

They have done the same thing with the XP chassis. There's no doubt the other guys are scrambling (while disassembling an XP) to get even close to the weight loss Skidoo has achieved. I guess what i'm saying is if Skidoo develops a 900cc ETEC engine that get better economy and emissions than the four strokes (and it stays together) they could dominate sled sales.

Which could force Yamaha to build a direct injected two stroke or two to compete because I don't think (even as much as love Yamahas) they will ever get a fourstroke close to the weight of the XPs. Yes I love Yamahas but, happily wrestling with an extra 100 pounds of sled to drive one has it's limits.

Frosty

A certain northern Minnesota sled builder is in fact disassembling their XP. Unfortunately it's to replace the S-Module. Which is still backordered.

 

[Idcatman3]

There is at least one E-Tec engine running right now, has been for a couple years. Take a look at the University of Idaho's Clean Snowmobile that they've been building for the last couple years. See if the engine sounds familiar.
Admittedly, it's not the 800R motor, or an XP, but the injection system is the same. Adapted from an outboard motor, makes very similar hp to stock, w/ 20 mpg.

I have a couple pictures of it, not many of the engine though

Link to UI CSC website
http://www.engr.uidaho.edu/csc2007/

A link to their design paper
http://www.mtukrc.org/download/idaho/idaho_design_paper_2007.pdf

 

[rab]

wow thats some angle on that spark plug
nice engine

 

[PooSlinger]

Before OMC was bought by BRP, Polaris had OMC engineers working with them on adapting the Ficht system to Poo liberty twins. I happen to know of a special XC 700 that was running around a few years ago with DI. Unfortunately, the project was scrapped when BRP bought up OMC and Polaris abandoned the watercraft market.

 

[geno]

engine reliability issues keep me away but this change just might make me look twice at Skidoos again. (Frostbite)


How does the etec help their reliability? Amost all failed, 800r engines, were cranks, were they not?

Even the guys turning the oil feed way down, would use more oil, than an etec, apparently.

 

[winter brew]

Whatever happened to the settup Holtzman was working on many year ago that used a simple diaphram operated off cylinder pressure to direct inject fuel? Sounded pretty good at the time, as you do any mods to increase cylinder pressure or as atmosphere would change cylinder pressure it would automatically compensate. Must not have worked out or ???

 

[Lunch_Box]

wow thats some angle on that spark plug
nice engine

From the looks of it, it runs 2 spark plugs per cylinder.

 

[winter brew]

Isn't that where it injects the fuel?....direct injection. How do they handle lower end lubrication with these settups?

 

[H20SKE]

E-Tec fuel economy is worse than a comparable 4-stroke, that extra bit of weight on the back of my boat doesn't matter. Plus burning that expensive 2-stroke oil in it along with the price of $1k more makes logical sense to buy that 4-stroke.



Were did you get your info on the fuel burn?? They are dilusional on that statement. I have run both the evinrude with ficht and the 4 stroke and the Evinrude was by far better performance and fuel burn.

And were did you buy a 4 stroke for less than a 2 stroke. I just priced 225HP engines. Evinrude E-Tec--$18000.00---Honda 4 stroke--$26,500.

Plus the weight difference is over 150lbs difference. I do not have any oil to change and no maintence for 3 years and only 1 to 1.5 tanks of oil a year. Plus a auto winterization system.

4 strokes are quieter than the 2 sstrokers--but not by alot like the old days.


DI 2 stroke is awesome--try it--you will like it!!

H20SKE...

 

[Beels]

Whatever happened to the settup Holtzman was working on many year ago that used a simple diaphram operated off cylinder pressure to direct inject fuel? Sounded pretty good at the time, as you do any mods to increase cylinder pressure or as atmosphere would change cylinder pressure it would automatically compensate. Must not have worked out or ???

The idea was great, but it wouldn't hold up on larger cc 2 strokes. I wrenched on a guy's snocross mod a bit, then later bought it and Holtzman had sent him a kit to try. It was on a Yamaha 700 triple. Ran great when it worked (about an hour) then it decided to spit the guts of the pumps out and spew fuel everywhere... The last I heard he figured it didn't like high cylinder pressure and cold weather. We ended up capping off the holes into the cylinders with brass plugs I had a machinist build. I bet it would work great on a small 2 stroke lawnmower or chainsaw...

 

[Beels]

engine reliability issues keep me away but this change just might make me look twice at Skidoos again. (Frostbite)


How does the etec help their reliability? Amost all failed, 800r engines, were cranks, were they not?

Even the guys turning the oil feed way down, would use more oil, than an etec, apparently.

I'm wondering the same. I think I'll sit on the sidelines and wait to see how this pans out...