Av Gas/Race Fuel... Drop in Kit

[bryceraisanen]

Are any of you guys having to run alternative fuel with an RKT drop in kit? I popped DET twice since putting my kit in with 12.5 domes at 1000 feet elevation. Thinking running a gallon or so per tank might help prevent that.

Thoughts?

 

[BILTIT]

Some have complained with those domes about some det. Add some race and your good to go, be sure you are weighted properly too. 1gal should be fine.


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[Reg2view]

Are you banging into det for a second or two, but not going into limp mode requiring a restart? I've experienced both, and too much compression usually results in limp mode requiring restart. Overrev not so much.

What's your primary setup, stock 68's and stock spring? Make sure you are not hitting the rev limiter. Use the record, as the gauge display doesn't respond as quickly real time.

What fuel settings, both non-eth and ethanol? If it goes away on the eth setting when you are running 91 non-eth, also points to temp overrev. This one is easy to test.

Add weight, does it go away? If you have access to more weight, that's what I'd try next. Stock compression is 12.5:1, which can even handle 87 on the ethanol setting, but unless you know squish before and after the kit, it's a guideline, not a benchmark.

Increase octane could make it go away if it's too much compression, but could also reduce hp abit, enough to stop the overrev. These might give you some ideas, unless you've covered them all already.

 

[bryceraisanen]

Biltit quit following me around just trying to cover my bases b4 spending money on av gas

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[rmscustom]

I bet you need more weight.

 

[BILTIT]

Biltit quit following me around just trying to cover my bases b4 spending money on av gas

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Haha, someone has to keep an eye on you!!


What are you weighted at? I was running 67.7g at 2200' with my 12.5 and LR. Gained 250rpm with the 13.6 heads, more race gas for me


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[600ho]

I have been having the same issue of hitting the det sensor with his drop in kit. I added fuel and it helped a little. I ran a gallon of race fuel and it didn't do much either. So I added more weight and it fixed my problem. Good enough that I took all the fuel I added back out. Hit the sensor once. I'm adding more weight this week then I'll know for a fact if it's clutching.

I have rooster weights and set them up as per Kelsey's recommendation. Heavy heal and a little in the middle with the toe empty. I'm moving more weight to the middle and a little in the toe. I think it needs load in the midrange.

I guess long story short.....more weight IMO.

 

[bryceraisanen]

A couple times it was just for a split second, and once it was for a bit longer at WOT, made me shut down and restart to shut off check engine light. Primary setup right now is 140/330 with MDS weights at 71.3 grams. I don't plan on running the 140/330 just wanted to get a few miles on while waiting for new assortment of springs to arrive. Will be popping in a 120/310 shortly, and will report my findings. I wouldn't be surprised if the couple times I thought I had DET for a split second, it was actually overrev, but who looks at the gauge during WOT on hardish ground? Which in that case, would mean I only actually hit DET once, IF that is the case. Am heading back to the shop now with some fresh 91 non oxy and new clutch springs.

Rev limiter kicks in at 8600 correct?

 

[bryceraisanen]

Rookie mistake!!! Forgot to mark the inner n outer sheaves before taking clutch apart. The spider goes on on a single thread, so if I put it back in with the same shims, I'm pretty sure it would have to go back right where it was.

Problem is, I want to put it back in with zero shims. There is only one in there (.03) and when I take it out that puts me at .015 .... is it ok to run w/o any shims? And will this shim change throw me off on alignment too much?

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[bryceraisanen]

Aka.... how much shim adjustment can u do typically before u have to rotate the spider to the next tower?

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[wi.switchback]

I just put a set of keleys replacement pistons and my sled is poppin the det sensor also! I talked to kelsey and he was definitly sayin its the **** fuel we are offered.

 

[bryceraisanen]

So I put clutch back together with the original shim, tightened down and than marked a line across the sheaves. Took back apart, removed shim (.03) and put back together. Removing the shim puts the outer sheave marker line past the inner sheave marker line by about 100 degrees. So I could rotate the spider to the next tower position (120 degrees) and that would leave my marks off alignment by about 20 degrees. Would this be acceptable as far as balance goes? Keep in mind that if I do that, the X on the spider will no longer line up with the X on the outer sheave.....

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[bryceraisanen]

Pretty sure the spider needs to be machined in order to get proper belt/sheave clearance. I've found that u r not supposed to run them without a shim, so I guess put it back together and run with .030 belt clearance at least for this weekend

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[xc6rider]

Pretty sure the spider needs to be machined in order to get proper belt/sheave clearance. I've found that u r not supposed to run them without a shim, so I guess put it back together and run with .030 belt clearance at least for this weekend

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Yes, needs machined to achieve proper clearance, with the use of the big spacer. Don't know why polaris can't get that right, clearance is way out of spec, right out of the factory...

 

[bryceraisanen]

So I switched out the 140/330 for a 120/310. Was able to record a few runs and the playback looked spot on. Out of four runs, I hit 8600 rpms once at around 60 mph other than that everything was 8350-8550. This is on firmish ground with a couple inches of soft on top. I think in the deep, it may run 50-100 rpm less?

Does it make sense that it "feels" like I lost a teeny bit of "snappiness" or backshift?

Regarding my OP, I've made TWO conclusions.

ONE: Bad gas is what caused my sled to DET and go into limp mode. I did not have any DET during this last 1 hr rip session.

TWO: I musta been overrevving with the 140/330 spring before even though it wasn't showing it on the tach. If I'm running 8500 rpm with the new 310 finish rate, it would've surely been higher with the 330. Stock secondary setup. Mds flyweights at 71.3 grams, and I'm debating adding a half gram to the middle.

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[Fr8tdog]

I'm having some det issues, I really don't think its gas. This is the second round with det/limp mode 7-8 times on the ride out under low load on trails, it varied from 1/2 - full throttle then as low as 1/4 throttle 5600 rpm... Most of the det was occurring in the low 7000's I changed out to the ethanol plug and it triggered twice, first in less than 100 yards. I've switched plugs and the same fuel is being used by 4 other sleds, with 1 using the same exact kit I'm using, We're running the 13.6 domes he's having no issues while I am...

I believe the issues may be a faulty temp sensor sending bad info to the TPS. Outside air Temp is the last common denominator I didn't have issues riding in the low teens on down but had issues warmer than mid teens... Elevation is mid 6000' at base ops. The sled is going into the poo dealer next week for a diagnostic download, then tear down ... I am hoping the pistons are still ok but they looked dimpled with the bore scope..

 

[robadoodle]

rk drop in kit and det

has anyone with the drop in kit and det issues been able to remedy the problem?
my 12 pro has 500 miles on the kit has had det problems (full limp) since day one. tried race gas, added a fuel controller, plugged into digital wrench, tried different exhaust components (stock to stock), added weight (maybe i could go more but rpm's aint telling me that), even changed motor mounts. nothing seems to have cured it. hits det in inconsistent spots. some days a lot some days only a little. when its not in det it runs real nice. comp is currently at 130pto 132mag.
any ideas?

 

[BILTIT]

I'm having some det issues, I really don't think its gas. This is the second round with det/limp mode 7-8 times on the ride out under low load on trails, it varied from 1/2 - full throttle then as low as 1/4 throttle 5600 rpm... Most of the det was occurring in the low 7000's I changed out to the ethanol plug and it triggered twice, first in less than 100 yards. I've switched plugs and the same fuel is being used by 4 other sleds, with 1 using the same exact kit I'm using, We're running the 13.6 domes he's having no issues while I am...

I believe the issues may be a faulty temp sensor sending bad info to the TPS. Outside air Temp is the last common denominator I didn't have issues riding in the low teens on down but had issues warmer than mid teens... Elevation is mid 6000' at base ops. The sled is going into the poo dealer next week for a diagnostic download, then tear down ... I am hoping the pistons are still ok but they looked dimpled with the bore scope..

I would be running some race fuel at 6-7000 with 13.6 domes.

I run 20-30% at 2200' with mine (145psi compression).

 

[BILTIT]

has anyone with the drop in kit and det issues been able to remedy the problem?
my 12 pro has 500 miles on the kit has had det problems (full limp) since day one. tried race gas, added a fuel controller, plugged into digital wrench, tried different exhaust components (stock to stock), added weight (maybe i could go more but rpm's aint telling me that), even changed motor mounts. nothing seems to have cured it. hits det in inconsistent spots. some days a lot some days only a little. when its not in det it runs real nice. comp is currently at 130pto 132mag.
any ideas?

How much race fuel did you try?

I run 20-30% with 145psi compression.

 

[Rmk_RDR]

I've got 14.1 domes with my drop in kit and I mix 100:1 and one trip I forgot my measuring cup and put to much oil in 2 days in a row but couldn't be to much more than 50:1 and I DET right away in the morning so I took gas out and measured 100:1 with fresh gas problem solved so maybe you mix to much oil in?? Btw this is at 8-10000