Any welders out there???
- Thread starter anziconda
- Start date
0
06 RMK 900
Well-known member
Have welded for years, but mostly recreationally. Have a project that I'm working on and need suggestions for making a verticle weld...up to down or down to up and techniques would be appreciated. thanks in advance
Are you using an Arc welder or a wire feed?
Welding process and consumable dictate weld progression. What material are you welding, what process would you want to use?
A
anziconda
Well-known member
Sorry, Yes it is a mig welder and I'm doing vert joints on 2x6x3/8 material...Tried some of them single pass...no good. Did a root pass on others then tried a top pass. Tried top to bottom and could get a decent looking pass but it seems wierd to me cause all of a sudden I'd get a big drop of molten metal that would fall off ahead of me. Tried bottom to top and get a big build up in the middle...Have about 10 welds left(6" to 8" long) and need to make them pretty so I don't have to spend 4 hrs grinding, lol.
always vertical up. 50% of a welds strength is lost when doing a down weld. If your wire feeding and its puddling you probably have to much heat. I have found that holding the tourch at a 90 or slightly push the weld when going up works best, rember watch your puddle and eye. Arc welding, rod at a 90 to the steel, same with the heat just enough to keep the rod burning. May have to jump the rod up the hill and pull back down. Not to good with the tig yet no advice for that one.
A
anziconda
Well-known member
When you say puddling are you refering to the molten metal drops that are coming off my weld? Cause I only get them when I'm going top to bottom. When I go bottom to top, I seem to get a high spot in the middle which almost seems like too little heat or too much wire...I tried turning the wire speed down but weld completely went to **** after that and I feel like I'm at the max on the heat I should use...
With a wire feed the advice to run it uphill is good. Watch heat input and match wire speed, enough heat to get good fusion with the base material. Match wire speed to allow complete filling of fusion area. Puddle is molten metal your are working to make weld, avoid too large of a puddle or you risk losing it. No magical way to avoid some mistakes if you're just getting the feel for running uphill welds, practice will make you better at it.
The advice to only run uphill is completely false for reasons stated. 98% of pipelines crossing the US are run with welds in a downhill progression. Strength is obtained by more factors than weld progression. Base materials, heat input, welding consumable used, welding process all bear on final weld strength.
http://www.lincolnelectric.com/
http://www.esab.com/
http://www.millerwelds.com/
http://www.hobartwelders.com/
Those are all good links for welding info.
BTW, I know a bit about welding, I work as a AWS CWI for a living.
The advice to only run uphill is completely false for reasons stated. 98% of pipelines crossing the US are run with welds in a downhill progression. Strength is obtained by more factors than weld progression. Base materials, heat input, welding consumable used, welding process all bear on final weld strength.
http://www.lincolnelectric.com/
http://www.esab.com/
http://www.millerwelds.com/
http://www.hobartwelders.com/
Those are all good links for welding info.
BTW, I know a bit about welding, I work as a AWS CWI for a living.
If you're wire feed welding, and having trouble doing a verticle down, I gotta ask if you are using a shielded (flux core) wire.
Flux core wire torch manipulation should mimic stick welding. (vertical up)
I suggest getting some scrap of like thickness & practice while simulating position.
Watch your puddle & you will get a better handle on heat & feed speed settings, along with gun position awareness. (very common to start with gun in good position but simply rotating wrist often leaves gun in terrible position making it that much more difficult to obtain desireable bead appearance)
practice, practice, practice
Once you can repeat several good practice welds, then you are ready to do the real thing.
Flux core wire torch manipulation should mimic stick welding. (vertical up)
I suggest getting some scrap of like thickness & practice while simulating position.
Watch your puddle & you will get a better handle on heat & feed speed settings, along with gun position awareness. (very common to start with gun in good position but simply rotating wrist often leaves gun in terrible position making it that much more difficult to obtain desireable bead appearance)
practice, practice, practice
Once you can repeat several good practice welds, then you are ready to do the real thing.
If your getting turds when your going up one of two things is happening, to much heat and moving to slow or just moving to slow. The puddle is the red molten steel that move behind the weld. Do a flat weld and watch behind the area you are welding , there will be a puddle that will get bigger or smaller depending on how fast you go. You will get an eye on top of the puddle when the correct speed is reached. You want to basicly drag the puddle behind your tourch keeping it the same size all the time. When doing a up weld the concept is the same. Heat seams to be the biggest factor in the weld looking like a caterpillar or being nice and smooth. Practice take your time and make sure the metal is clean and dry. Sorry I can't post any pictures
A
anziconda
Well-known member
Its not flux core wire. I know practice makes perfect, but I'm trying to pick brains of those who do this all the time to give me some good tips so I'm not practicing the wrong way. Thanks mafesto
A
anziconda
Well-known member
Yeah, can get a killer weld flat, not that new...just haven't had to weld vert much...I'm working with 2x6x3/8 material, so practice is expensive, lol.
I am not welder by trade. But was told and taught by 2 friend that are pipe line welders that a down weld pulls all the impure crap out of the steel and puts it into the weld, makeing the weld weak or poris. If done with a arc welder you also have slag in the weld. Thats just the way I was taught.
G
Gimpster
Guest
Sounds like when your in the middle of the weld the metal is retaining more heat and not cooling as quick as when you are at the ends of the steel. As mentioned before, your going too slow in the middle with the retained heat of the metal.
----- Gimpster -----
----- Gimpster -----
Here's a quick guide for you. Making a sound MIG Weld.
Always a possibility of welding process pulling impurities out of base metal, regardless of welding process or weld progression. This is seldom a reason for rejection of a weld based on radiographic evaluation (something those pipeliners know well if they've been doing it long and I assume they have) Usually cause of porosity in a SMAW weld is either welder technique, or in certian instances with a low hydrogen type rod welding with improperly stored rods or welding inclement weather without proper protection of weld area. That last problem can also occur with any welding process that removes shielding gases from the weld area.
Slag trapped in weld is no fault but the welders. Failure to clean between weld passes is common cause.
Back to topic, the advice to practice is the best, without actually seeing the welding take place, all that can be given is generalized advice. Practice is the best way to improve technique that I know of.
Are you a welding inspector?
Your info is spot on, and your last paragraph pretty much sums it up.
A
anziconda
Well-known member
Perhaps I mislead some of you...I don't weld professionally, but I own a welder and have welded enough to see and recognize what the puddle is telling me, however, like I said the vert weld is proving to be hard for me to make pretty. I have a lot of ammo to try with now though, I'll let you know how it went tomorrow...Thanks for all the help
