A WSSA Board Member Responds
Full disclosure: I'm Matt Mead, a WSSA Board Member (Publicity Secretary). I'm speaking for myself and not representing WSSA, (beyond the fact I'm telling you I'm a board member anyway!)
the "Cheep skates" won out
Hmm, I guess I'm one of the cheapskates Dan is referring to.
I'm not a rich guy by any means
I chuckle everytime Dan says this... Anybody that knows Dan knows he's doing alright...
I have to say for all the people that wanted to increase fee's ect, very few people showed up, Myself and several others were very disappointed with the turn out.
I'm with Dan on this one... well, on the opposite side... Given the outcry after our meeting last March, not to mention the fact I've read the survey results/report, I was surprised there weren't more people at the meeting complaining and squashing the increases that were passed.
No matter which side of this issue you are on, you have to show up and make your case!
Dont get me wrong , I've always been a wssa supporter and they've done a lot for our sport
I know Dan does and I appreciate this. Folks need to remember this is only one issue WSSA is dealing with. WSSA's goal is to represent ALL snowmobilers, and like national politics, we all don't agree on issues and outcomes.
but trying to change the minds of some of these people is a real challenge. Many of them are still living in the year 2000, not 2012
Well, this may be true of some, but the WSSA Board members I've talked to just have a different vision; want to follow a different path to put our Snowmobile Program back on track.
now lets see if we can get it thru Olympia ??
In order to get anything through, people are going to need to step up. I'd suggest everyone who supports these increases show up at WSSA's Olympia Day and lobby. The registration increase is going to look like a 'tax increase' to legislators and nobody seems to want that attached to their legacy...
you want guys like me to pay more just cause some candy asses can ride a groomed trail!! BS! Looks like I wont buy tabs for my sled this year!
This is one reason I'm a supporter of a $40 sno-park permit. It's tough to enforce registered sleds... you have to catch them. It's a whole lot easier to to cruise through a sno-park and see if everyone has a current sticker in their window.
There are a bit more than 16,000 owners of all the registered snowmobiles in WA. My estimate is that 10,000 of these folks will buy a sno-park permit at $40. That will put $400,000 into the program. Doesn't fix it, but certainly improves the situation.
The sno-park permit fee will be easier on families as they only need to buy one... verses a significant registration increase that is on each and every sled. It also adds a bit of fairness, as some of us are already having to pay for a sno-park permit by way of a Discover Pass to use the DNR Winter Rec Sites.
Our lobbyists indicated a couple of years ago that this legislative action, (giving the Parks Commission the ability to set a sno-park permit fee), might be an easier political goal. I understood this to mean a couple of things. First, it would have less of an effect on our ability to get our full fuel tax rebate; a major WSSA goal/initiative. Second, it would be shifting the 'taxing' to the Parks Commission; the legislators would be giving them the tools, but wouldn't be the ones actually setting a fee.
Along with charging for the sno-park permit, State Parks needs to end reciprocity with Oregon on sno-park permits so Oregon residents will start contributing some funds to Washington's Snowmobile Program. (This is likely mostly an issue in the St. Helens & Mt. Adams area.) This issue is being worked, but was placed on the back burner when Gregoire issued a directive that stopped this type of action. (It wasn't directed at this item specifically, but was some cost-cutting issue that had the consequence of temporarily shutting it down.)
When was the last time ANYTHING stayed the same for 10 years? Do you make the same yearly income you did in 2000? Do you drive the same truck, ride the same sled
Hmm, I'm making 1/2 of what I made in 2000. And I'm still driving a '99 Ford F-250 and riding a '97 Summit.
The bottom line is that EVERYTHING in life goes up in price, the fact we have gone so long without an increase is amazing, and it's the whole reason it is feeling like such a 'shock' now.
I think most would agree that Snowmobile Program costs have legitimately increased and more funding is needed. But mentally, many can't wrap their heads around such large percentage increases. The $40 increase voted on in March was more than a 100% increase. Yowza! How would you feel if milk went from $2.50 to $5.00 a gallon? Gas from $4.00 to $8.00? A new sled from $11,000 to $22,000?!
For cripe's sake we are talking about increasing the fee for the entire year by the amount you spend on food and gas for your sled in 1 FREAKING DAY!!!!
While I understand the sentiment, I'd like to make a couple of points. First, families take a larger hit. People keep saying "it's only $40 more". At the Summer Meeting, I kept hearing "it's only $20" more. Well, we had already passed a motion seeking a $40 sno-park permit, so it was actually $60 more. But let's look at a family. For example, I've been registerng four sleds for my family. Last year I paid $120 (plus fees) to register them. With the sno-park permit fee, I'd be up to $160. Tack on the $10 registration fee increase from the first year, I'm up to $200. The next year $240. (It's worth noting at this time that the $120 I paid last year actually put $240+ into the program when you also factor in the current fuel tax refund. After the increases, I would put in $360+)
Why do you suppose there were only 28,000+ registered snomwobiles last year? I've heard some say it is because of the poor grooming. That may account for some. Snow conditions may also account for some. But I don't think anyone will argue the biggest reason for the decline is the economy. So while some have left the sport, (temporarily I would guess), others are right on the edge. They may only get out and ride once or twice a year at this point. It won't take much of an increase to price these folks out.
Consider too the passion for the sport. Obviously those posting to this thread are passionate. But I'm not so sure the average snowmobiler carries the same enthusiasm. Given the short season, how much do you think they are willing to spend? And consider other interests. For my family, we own ATVs, an (old) boat, a (not new) motorhome; we have other recreational activities that also cost a significant amount of money to enjoy.
The most important thought you need to come away with is:
For every snowmobile not registered, for whatever reason, our Program loses $60+.
Raising fees will cause some people to stop paying. The more they have to pay... and this is part of the mental aspect that needs to be considered... the more that will choose not to. So one person pulling $60 out of Program means one of the remaining sledders is going to be making up the difference. (This assumes the remaining sledder is paying his original $30, earning the $30 from the fuel tax, paying the additional $20 registration increase and buys the $40 sno-park permit.) So to actually put extra money in the program, it will take two snowmobilers, since the first one was needed to make up the loss of he one who walked away.
State Parks has confirmed when the non-motorized sno-park permit fees went into effect, some users walked away, at least temporarily. They said it was about three years before the numbers returned. How many more snowmobilers can we afford to walk away today... even if they come back in three years?
I'll probably cut the registration for all the sleds but my primary. There's no way I'm buying more than one parking pass either if I'm required to buy one with each sled registration. I used to register all my sleds even if the others were rarely used. Not anymore.
Of course you would only need to purchase as many sno-park permits as you need... and it would be nice to see them transferable... at a minimum between two vehicles like the Discover Pass. (This is not an issue being pursued at the moment though.)
But I find myself in a similar position. Although I've been registering four sleds, my family consists of three. My wife rides once a year, and sometimes under protest. My daughter rides a couple of times. I've been registering extra sleds to help the program and to have extra available, just in case. I'm not sure I'm going to keep doing this. I could easily cut two with no real impact on me... just the Snowmobile Program... I've talked to others who also register extra sleds jut because and they've indicated they probably won't anymore.
We are so over-taxed right now that anytime the gov't, any gov't, gets in my pocket it pizzs me off.
Bingo! This is where I'm at. As well as other WSSA Board members. This is the reason WSSA has been working our butt off in repealing the fuel tax cap. Dan, (and others, I'm not just picking on him), doesn't believe this is ever going to happen, and never seems to include this in the discussion when hammering on WSSA for not being quick to try to raise our fees. While some feel WSSA is doing nothing, the fact is we are working the legislature to get OUR money back. They give us approximately 24 cents, but are keeping 13 more we should be receiving. On 28,000 sled registrations, that is nearly $500,000. Is it going to happen? I say yes. No, I don't know for sure. But when you have the democrat leaders of the Transporation Committees supporting us, key democrats on those committees sponsoring our legislation, with leading republicans as co-sponsors, and a coalition of users (boaters, OHVers, hikers, bikers, etc. also supporting, the future looks pretty bright.
But there is a problem. While we've been working on this, sled registrations have dropped, and Program costs have continued to rise. So most of the WSSA Board agrees some... limited... fee increases are needed to make up the difference.
But we have a pay to play system right now that seems like it works pretty well but is under funded because less people are "playing". We need more "players" or more per player or we do with less.
And here is the true problem. We have less playing. Fix the economy, and we'll have more players. Until then, we should be doing with less.
Less players because the sport is expensive and the economy sucks. So why the hell make it more expensive for the few that remain. It is the fundamental question facing our country. We must toughen up and take care of our self. Times are tough and until things get better we need to be more self sufficient and "do with less" instead of punishing the few that remain by taxing the crap out of them. Just my 2cents.
BINGO, GIVE THIS MAN A PRIZE!
This is the point I've been trying to make. This is the position many WSSA Board members hold. You can't pile the deficit on the backs of the remaining snowmobilers. It's not fair, but beyond that, some of them can't and won't take it. If you want to fix the program, register more sleds. It's pretty simple really!
WSSA - I quit you!! Take me off your list and don't ask for one more cent from me until you get rid of these old-school idiots that are stuck in the 80's with user-fees!! You will get my formal request to take me off your list today.
I hope this 'old-school idiot' has explained my reasoning for voting the way I have. As I've said, most of the others who have voted the same way do it for the same reason. The point is we feel there is a lot more to consider than just the cost of the increase. We worry about the effects, and just as importantly, the root problem (less sled registrations.)
It should be noted too our lobbyists have warned us that if we fill our funding gap with fee increases, we'll likely never see the full fuel tax refund. Given that is free money, our money stolen from us, many of us aren't willing to let that go. (And I'm always surprised when I hear snowmobilers so quick to give it up - most of us are small government, fair goverment people!)
I did see your e-mail sent to the President asking to be removed. If you still feel that way, we can make it happen for you.
You want to boycott the one of the only voices for snowmobiling in Washington? In case you have not heard, greenies are working diligently on getting snowmobiles banned from as many areas as they possibly can. Yes these people may be old school and not perfect, but at least they care enough to be involved. Sadly, the same can't be said for most snowmobilers. would you give up your free time to attend the WSSA summer meetings? By boycotting WSSA do you really think that will help our sport?
Well said. It is important to look at everything WSSA does. While you may not agree on the fee issue, we are involved in land-use issues and other things that affect our sport. We are Expo, and I'm sure everyone enjoys that weekend. And we've been very successful in helping clubs with our Trail Grant Program, and we have a Scholarship Program.
WSSA needs new blood. And, to answer your question, I would give up time for more summer meetings if I thought I could make a difference but it's pointless.
I don't think there is a Board or Committee member in WSSA that doesn't agree with you 100%! We need new blood!
But I don't see you volunteering. Not many are. I've been the Publicity Secretray since 2004 and I've not heard from anyone who is interested in taking over. (It's an elected Board position, but I wouldn't run against anyone who wants it [assuming they really want to do the job to the best of their ability].) Fact is we have to twist arms to get people to represent the districts arond the state, not to mention to run for Pres/Vice Pres/Sec/Treas. We have a gap right now... we need a Chair or two for the 2014 Winter Rendezvous. And my wife would like to not be the Chair WSSA Awards anymore either. STEP UP!
I enjoy being a part of WSSA. I've learned A LOT. I've been able to travel all across he country, and even snowmobile in some new places in and out of state. But on the other hand, it takes a lot of my time. My spare time is consumed with working on WSSA projects and the Snoflyer. As for time for snowmobiling... I don't have much, unless it is associated with a WSSA event.
I'm not complaining. But I don't appreciate being degraded by somebody who isn't involved.
There is nothing stopping any of us from donating money or time to the grooming program. This is our snomobile program it's up to all of us to make it a success or not.
Ah, this brings me to the next thing... As pointed out by Dan, we aren't going to see any new money on the snow until the 2014/2015 winter, and that assumes the legislation passes.
But WSSA is offering you an opportunity to help the Program for this winter. A resolution was passed at the Summer Meeting to match your donations, up to $25,000, to the Snowmobile Program. What you need to do is write a check to WSSA, designate it for the Snowmobile Program, and we'll forward that amount, plus an equal amount, to State Parks. If you make a $50 donation, State Parks will receive $100.
So, no matter your opinion of WSSA, it's leadership, goals, or whatever, if you were going to make a donation, please funnel it through WSSA to receive the match.
I will be adding a registration to an additional sled this year.
And my final comment... Everyone should do this... because a snowmobile registered this season is funding next season's Program. We are talking the 2013/2014 winter. WSSA's fundraiser is for the 2012/2013 winter. Fee increases will help in the 2014/2015 winter. That leaves a gap for 2013/2014, which can be fllled by an increase of sled registrations this winter.
It's your Program.
