Reason oil pump is sticking on M8

[TREE_MAGNET_777]

Well I am having the sticking oil pump issue on my M8 and so I got a old pump from a buddy and tore it apart to see whats inside and this is what I have found. The oil pump is basicly a simple piston pump that increases oil displacment as the rotation is increased (rpm increase) but also has a set stroke for every revolution that is varied by the lever. It varies only from idle (least amount of oil) to about 1/3 of the lever travel (full stroke) and then any lever movment above that point does nothing to change the stroke. So if you fallow me so far the m8 is at full stroke and when the lever returns to idle the outer spring (the one you see) cannot overcome the pressure of the inner spring and the pump lever is stuck at about 1/3. You can move the lever to idle and the pressure you feel is the cam pushing on the inner spring along with the oil pushing against the banjo metering valves. Cure...Heavier spring or tying the lever together....Hope this helps someone....Garry

 

[montanasledder]

its a probelm i was going to look at also. I thought about another auxiallry spring and winding the one tighhter. Would tying the two arms together work as a permamnet fix? that would be very easy. Just dont want some adverse condition

 

[catfreak]

My 09 M1000 does the same thing.. What is the best way to access it?? I took the center belly pan off but it still looks like a real pain to get to the spring.

 

[TREE_MAGNET_777]

Remove hood,front air box, and intake pluem. Still a bitc to get to.

 

[backcountryislife]

A better "cure" in my opinion is to just lose the thing & premix. Then you know what you're getting & don't have to worry about the mechanical failure of the pump.

I've heard of 1 failure ever that might have been because of the delete, I've personally had 3 pump failures, and heard of a ton of others. I'd rather take my chances with a premix setup, plus you save weight & $$ on oil.

 

[WyoBoy1000]

BDX oil delete going to pay for itself in saved oil. and my sled runs better than it did before. I was averaging 28:1 with the pump now I'm at 40:1 for sure. Also if you mod your sled you have to add fuel or take away fuel but if you adjust to your fuel consumption then you wind up to fat on the bottom

 

[edgey]

What would be a good way of tying the to levers together My 09 almost used a tank of oil to a tank of gas the last day I rode it. Im putting a slp pipe and airbox on this weekend going to try to fix the oil pump while I have it tore apart.

 

[donaldej]

TREE_MAGNET_777
So when you adjust the oil pump does it just increase (or decrease) the stroke length. I just want to understand this, so if you adjust the oil pump it should only affect the first 1/3 throttle ( + or - if you adjust it)?

 

[montanasledder]

whats everyone premixing theres at when there using the bdx oil delete kit. Im thinking that might be there way to go

 

[backcountryislife]

Seems most are at 32 or 40 to 1.
I run 32.

I just don't see a point in turning in the pump, taking chances on where it'll run you light & where it'll run heavy, it's an inconsistent turd. If you get rid of it you lose weight & gain consistency. I've only heard of one failure that MAY have been because of the oil delete (not 100% sure either way) but I personally have witnessed a NUMBER of pump failures & heard of many more. I think it is the least reliable thing on the sled & for an extra 2 minutes each fillup you can get rid of it, and like stated above, you'll save the $25 or whatever in oil costs in 1/2 a season!

 

[TREE_MAGNET_777]

From Idle stop to about 1/3 lever operation the lever shorten's the stroke proportionatly to the lever position. The rpm of the engine also leans out the oil delivery. From about 1/3 up to full throttle the cam that shortens the stroke is not even touching the piston so rpm is the only factor that puts more oil in. As far as mixing fuel I respectfully dissagree with this as if you do not have a controller any oil in the fuel leans the motor down and the oil pump leans the motor at idle (oil rate) and increases the oil rate at full rpm. Most motors are set to be about 100-1 at idle and go to about 40-1 at full throttle if you mix you are stuck with what ever you mix at.Plus I am a lasy a$$ and hate to mix fuel.

Backcontry I have never seen a oil pump fail and not go to full stroke, please correct me if I am wrong, and my warr. would go away with my delete kit, But am wondering what you do to lube the center water pump gear???? Sorry for the Book.....Garry

 

[montanasledder]

anyone figure out the fix yet. can a guy just tie the arms together somehow? or what?

 

[snofake]

oil pump fix

wind a pen spring around the two arms, bend one end so it can't
unwind. 900 miles working great.
36 to 1 at 10,000, 50 to 1 at 800 ft.
uses less oil !
if you turned your pump back , it maybe to far after joining the arms!
mine took two turns, making the pump arm longer.
geo's idea.

 

[m8magicandmystery]

Seems most are at 32 or 40 to 1.
I run 32.

I just don't see a point in turning in the pump, taking chances on where it'll run you light & where it'll run heavy, it's an inconsistent turd. If you get rid of it you lose weight & gain consistency. I've only heard of one failure that MAY have been because of the oil delete (not 100% sure either way) but I personally have witnessed a NUMBER of pump failures & heard of many more. I think it is the least reliable thing on the sled & for an extra 2 minutes each fillup you can get rid of it, and like stated above, you'll save the $25 or whatever in oil costs in 1/2 a season!

i have the delete...but for the heck of it im going to pull my pan off and re-install the banjo in the potential problem area...the water pump/crank gear..with a capped long tube filled with oil...or possibly a grease whip hose adapted to the bottom..with a shot of lubriplate every 50 miles or so

 

[backcountryislife]

Backcontry I have never seen a oil pump fail and not go to full stroke, please correct me if I am wrong, and my warr. would go away with my delete kit, But am wondering what you do to lube the center water pump gear???? Sorry for the Book.....Garry

I've had 3 of them fail on my sleds, granted two were the pumps being disconnected (07 recall before it was recalled)

Yeah, warr thing is understandable, it would be pretty rare that the oil delete would be someones only mod so warranty is usually gone by then anyways.

I greased the gear from pump side & bottom before I put the delete in, I figure if there is enough fuel/oil getting in there to wash away the grease then there is enough to lube the shaft. I will grease it again this summer anyhow just to make myself feel safer, but that'll be over 2000 hard miles later!

 

[sledbilly]

here's how I fixed mine

http://www.hardcoresledder.com/forums/index.php?s=&showtopic=400091&view=findpost&p=4510421

 

[Frostbite]

I'd sure love to see a picture of the ball point pen spring idea Snofake. I think it sounds simple enough but, if there's a way to mess things up, I usually can find it. I do have a two year warranty but, I want to be using the correct amount of oil and not over oiling all the time.

I also read where someone had just zip tied the arms together.

So there are no Arctic Cat TSBs on this subject? You'd think they must know it's a problem and have a recommended fix?

 

[serge]

have you noticed the dot on the oil pump arm, that should be lined up with the coresponding mark on the oil pump at idle. If you are trying to line up the line that is below the dot, your oil pump is oiling at full capacity.