Helix Bolts, replacment ?

Rprecision · Sep 2, 2009

So I tore into the secondary on my 09 to put in a shift assist and rollers. Even with heat I tore up some of the bolts. I could probably put them back in but next time will be a real PIA if I dont replace them.

Can you use a full size allen cap screw (10-24) instead of those stupid torx ? My only worry is the screw heads will hit the DD when shifted all the way out ?

I cant be the first one to run into this

RickM · Sep 2, 2009

replace the screws

There has been several posts on this subject from last season. They recommend replacing the torx screws once you take them out with new ones. There has been several people comment on using aftermarket screws. Most dealers stock these torx screws. As i remember some one got screws at ace hardware and used them. The use of a Hammer Driver after heating screws really helps the initial loosing. Hope this helps.

Rprecision · Sep 2, 2009

RickM said:
There has been several posts on this subject from last season. They recommend replacing the torx screws once you take them out with new ones. There has been several people comment on using aftermarket screws. Most dealers stock these torx screws. As i remember some one got screws at ace hardware and used them. The use of a Hammer Driver after heating screws really helps the initial loosing. Hope this helps.

They are being replaced. I am going to go to Ace Hardware tomarrow and see if I can find grade 8 pan head allens. Should be about the same profile

furthur · Sep 2, 2009

I had to go to the local fastener specialty store to get mine (hex cap screws, which don't hit for me...)...forget what size they are, but they're not common, at least in grade 8. Since then I've just re-used mine, but I don't use that super locktite, just blue (gotta keep an eye on it, though). Those handheld hammer/drivers are the stuff for that, though.

Rprecision · Sep 2, 2009

furthur said:
I had to go to the local fastener specialty store to get mine (hex cap screws, which don't hit for me...)...forget what size they are, but they're not common, at least in grade 8. Since then I've just re-used mine, but I don't use that super locktite, just blue (gotta keep an eye on it, though). Those handheld hammer/drivers are the stuff for that, though.

They are 10-24. I would really like to do the full size cap type like:

http://www.boltdepot.com/product.aspx?cc=13&cs=71&cm=25&cd=1220

may have to settle for:

http://www.boltdepot.com/product.aspx?cc=13&cs=72&cm=25&cd=1220

killerrf · Sep 3, 2009

i also just use normal allen hex bolts. i checked and i would have to pretty much fully shifted out before they come close to touching the DD case. but i dont ever get close to full shift so i dont worry about it. those torx screws are pure ****. i dont know why cat just doesnt counter sink the holes in the sheave then use hex bolts. at least there is some meat to turn the screw. throw a little 242 blue on them and just ride.

hatchers · Sep 3, 2009

i went cheap and tried to use the same bolts when i changed a helix.....man was that a mistake!!!!

all the bolts broke except for 1 and made the sled have some crazy vibration...well the broken bolts stayed in the helix, so now i have a shiney paper weight.....moral to the story, replace them everytime or with a bolt that is better and stonger....and you have plenty of room to use a cap screw head bolt :beer;

montanasledder · Sep 3, 2009

i broke 3 trying to get them out with hammer punch, think im gonna end up buying another helix cause i cant get them out. When someone finds out the bolts size please post up.

thanks

Rprecision · Sep 3, 2009

its 10-24 by 1 1/4"

Has anyone ever seen them hit the DD drive or am I just parinoid

dunatyk · Sep 3, 2009

i used regular socket head cap screws on my 06 m7. much easier to get out

Rprecision · Sep 4, 2009

Ok,

I was thinking about this while eating dinner, this is stupid. The problem is not the bolts but how this whole thing was designed. They use slim pan head torx cap screws to avoind fliping the sheve over and adding 9 machining steps (Counterbore). This makes taking these out a PIA. So when its time to service this thing there are two options. Buy 9 more from cat or use a true all cap socket 10-24 x 1-1/4" screw. With the later you run the possibillity at full shift of hitting the DD case with the socket heads. This is the kind of thing one dosent need miles from the truck !

There has been a number of folks that have had to buy helixs, sheves, etc becuse of these stupid and hard to properly torque screws. The problem is not in the factory assembly, from what I have heard, its after you brake everything loose.

Problem solved. I sat down tonight and counterbored everything to use a standard (and very strong !) 10-24 x 1" grade 8 screw. These are commonly available everywhere and cheap. This alows a full height screw preventing all these problems with striped out heads, broken bolts and theres no chance of hitting the DD.

all of the counterbores are the exact same size preventing any balence issues. While this took some material out there is still plenty of strength left to support everything. The problems have always been shear not load. This still leaves .560" to support the distribution of helix.

I just cant stand when something isnt right, it really comes down to AC saving this step to save $

montanasledder · Sep 4, 2009

That seems to be the proper way that it should have been done from the factory.

furthur · Sep 4, 2009

nice fix...

killerrf · Sep 4, 2009

like i said... thats what cat should be doing and using them style bolts. lots of meat there to grab. i dont think you had to go that deep. even if the head of the bolt was sticking 1/4 way out.. that wouldnt hit the case at all. but nice job.
like the mag article i was reading today stated about costs.... this extra drilling would apply here... an extra $5 for the drilling x 20,000 sleds = alot of extra bucks to manufacture. but i would pay more to have quality parts and design.

Rprecision · Sep 4, 2009

killerrf said:
like i said... thats what cat should be doing and using them style bolts. lots of meat there to grab. i dont think you had to go that deep. even if the head of the bolt was sticking 1/4 way out.. that wouldnt hit the case at all. but nice job.
like the mag article i was reading today stated about costs.... this extra drilling would apply here... an extra $5 for the drilling x 20,000 sleds = alot of extra bucks to manufacture. but i would pay more to have quality parts and design.

Your right I didnt need to go that deep. Thing is the bolt length is held by what is drilled and tapped into the helix. Buy going the depth I did I can use standard 1" bolts and not bottom out. Rather then having to make my own.

sunbather1969 · Sep 4, 2009

not really

they could have incorporated it into the casting lots of stuff us snowesters can do to make the companies see the light

Search

Helix Bolts, replacment ?

Rprecision

Free Member

RickM

Well-known member

Rprecision

Free Member

furthur

Free Member

Rprecision

Free Member

killerrf

Well-known member

hatchers

Well-known member

montanasledder

Well-known member

Rprecision

Free Member

dunatyk

Well-known member

Rprecision

Free Member

montanasledder

Well-known member

furthur

Free Member

killerrf

Well-known member

Rprecision

Free Member

sunbather1969

Free Member

Similar threads