Why no groomed road up at gallager / lake ann areas?

[ruffryder]

Why isn't there a groomed road up further into these areas? There is a jeep trail that looks wide enough to get a groomer up? Is it due to the fact that at the beginning of the season there isn't enough road (wide enough) for the groomer?

Just curious as to what the reasons are. I don't know.. so I am asking. Also, I have never been in that area during the summer so I have no clue what it looks like without snow, though I thought there were roads up there?

Please inform me.

Thanks

 

[Powderboy]

Funding. All the money is being stockpiled to pay for Obamacare. J/K its a good question. Probably they only groom Forest Service roads? The final pull up into LK Ann they could never squeeze a groomer into, but the jeep trail maybe.

 

[Lake Cle Elum]

Take your Dirt Bike up the Jeep Trail in the summer. You'll have your answer..........

 

[ruffryder]

Take your Dirt Bike up the Jeep Trail in the summer. You'll have your answer..........

That isn't an answer, as I bet the jeep trail is easier to get up then the rock piles up to peanut hill on Mt. Baker.

It seemed to me that the trail was wide enough to get a groomer through or if not maybe do some clearing to account for the width needed?

Has anyone tried to increase the amount of grooming done? Do people not want easier access? I know sometimes the "cost" to get to an area is too much for people and it is a nice way to limit the amount of people that go into an area.

Just curious. I don't know the history of the area, so that is why I ask these questions. It just seems kind of odd when comparing the area to most of the other riding areas around Washington.

 

[diamonddave]

LCE is right. Because the groomer that operates up there is twice as wide as the jeep trails. I have a difficult time getting up there in my truck, I don't know how you'd expect a groomer to get up there. Not to mention, the Gallagher trail loves to Avy. Suprised there aren't more issues.

Why would you want to ride up there anyway...Graveler's trail passes are expensive.

 

[ruffryder]

LCE is right. Because the groomer that operates up there is twice as wide as the jeep trails. I have a difficult time getting up there in my truck, I don't know how you'd expect a groomer to get up there. Not to mention, the Gallagher trail loves to Avy. Suprised there aren't more issues.

True on the avy issue, but I think that is mostly on the main trail parts? Looks like that from what I have seen up there, which is limited.

Agreed that in the summer time it is not passable by a groomer, but in the winter it sure looks like there is room.

Do most people not want the thing groomed up there?

 

[diamonddave]

It seemed to me that the trail was wide enough to get a groomer through or if not maybe do some clearing to account for the width needed?

You already answered your own question.

As far as not wanting people up there...2-3 weeks ago 3-13-10 the sunny Saturday at 10:30 am we counted 182 rigs between Cooper and Sno-park. Criteria for counting rigs was truck either had to be towing a trailer or have a sled deck and this didn't include the rigs at French Cabin. Nothing else was counted ie trucks without decks or cars.

Had to ride FC

 

[ruffryder]

You already answered your own question.

that it is wide enough? or the reason why they don't make it wide enough?

Dang, that is a lot of people up there. Sounds pretty busy...

Remember just looking for information here.

Has this ever been tried before or looked into?

 

[Lake Cle Elum]

That isn't an answer.

Has anyone tried to increase the amount of grooming done? Do people not want easier access? I know sometimes the "cost" to get to an area is too much for people and it is a nice way to limit the amount of people that go into an area.

Just curious. I don't know the history of the area, so that is why I ask these questions. It just seems kind of odd when comparing the area to most of the other riding areas around Washington.

ok, maybe that was not an answer.....As DD sez, it's too damn narrow.....The Forest Service does not allow trees to be cut just to get a groomer into an area. Period........Those with the grooming contracts get paid by the mile/hour. Grooming routes are regulated by the land owers (Forest Service in this case); formal proposals must be made to change the routes.

I'm sure Boulder Creek would love to groom it. Maybe someday the jeep trail would be "logged"? Seems that would take care of the issue.......

 

[ruffryder]

ok, maybe that was not an answer.....As DD sez, it's too damn narrow.....The Forest Service does not allow trees to be cut just to get a groomer into an area. Period........

Has anyone asked? I only ask this question as my experience with the Forest Service up at Mt. Baker seems to be much more willing to work with snowmobile clubs as a partner.

Thanks for the good info everyone. I appreciate the effort. It sure is an amazing area. Tons of nooks and cranies, almost like a little Bear Paw.

 

[fassteddie]

the track on the groomer wont even fit. and why would you want to turn it into a stampede pass?

 

[rmk2112]

You already answered your own question.

As far as not wanting people up there...2-3 weeks ago 3-13-10 the sunny Saturday at 10:30 am we counted 182 rigs between Cooper and Sno-park. Criteria for counting rigs was truck either had to be towing a trailer or have a sled deck and this didn't include the rigs at French Cabin. Nothing else was counted ie trucks without decks or cars.

Had to ride FC

I hear ya!!
Its already a Gong Show up there on the weekends. Keep the good areas hard to get to.

 

[ruffryder]

Its already a Gong Show up there on the weekends. Keep the good areas hard to get to.

and why would you want to turn it into a stampede pass?

Good points.

 

[diamonddave]

the track on the groomer wont even fit. and why would you want to turn it into a stampede pass?

Unfortunately, it's already turned into stampede...

 

[JETJOHNSO]

ABSOLUTELY NO WAY TO GET A GROOMER UP THERE

Not beating a dead horse but I guess some of you forget how big a groomer is. there is no way they could get up the lake ann or galagher jeep trails. To sharp of turns and way to narrow. Also to add any additional grooming on forest service roads requires a full blown enviromental study, Either a "neepa" or "sepa" not sure what the correct name is but they are very costly and we'd have to pay for it. The FS will not. Anyways, the bumps and adventure are what keep us young and moving in our old age.

 

[ruffryder]

Not beating a dead horse but I guess some of you forget how big a groomer is.

Seems like just me...lol

Thanks for the info on the studies as well.

 

[Lake Cle Elum]

Ruffles.......If you think it's hard to get to now, you need to talk to the old timers that were heading up in the '70's.....Breaking trail started at the Last Resort as that's as far as the road was plowed......They would leap-frog and break trail for as long as fuel and energy allowed and then go back the next day and pick it up again. There was no culvert for Fortune creek, so they had to cut logs and lay tree branches across.........Heard of one time after a big dump, it took six days to get to Gallagher......All on little 250 and 340 cc with a smooth track......Maybe "GreensKeeper" will chime in here. He was a Gallagher Pioneer along with Don May, Sam Wolfe and others......

We have it pretty good these days......The bumps used to keep the riff-raff out; doesn't seem to do that anymore......

I enjoyed your pic's about the drop into Lake Ann....I learned the hard way once to be sure to put you goggles back on before heading down.....It's not fun when the eyes water and you can't see......Enjoy.....

 

[ruffryder]

Ruffles.......If you think it's hard to get to now

Cool information in your post. Pretty amazing story.

Just to be clear, I don't think it is TOO hard of a place to get into, it just seems so much different in comparison to all the other places I have been here in Washington.

Again, thanks for all the information, and I do agree that it can be good to have the trail in limiting the amount of people that will go there.

One thing that bothers me though, is that this area is the only one on the West side that offers rentals, but the area is way too challenging for beginners. I guess you have to go to the east side for that.

 

[Lushbomb]

just be glad they groom the 15 miles to the trail heads.. i like the adventure of all the single tracks getting to the goods.. l find it most enjoyable

 

[ruffryder]

just be glad they groom the 15 miles to the trail heads.. i like the adventure of all the single tracks getting to the goods.. l find it most enjoyable

No doubt it could be worse, and the single track is fun. Especially watching your buds go up and down an icy section a couple of times... You sure learn a lot about riding technique and line selection doing that.

I guess a majority of this questioning arises from the fact that the only rental place is located in this area. Kind of hard to take family members from back in the midwest out for a trip up into the mountains if they have to go through that.