What makes the Pro get up on the snow so well?

[Ace Freely]

Been mind f-ing this for a while. It seems that the Pro is underpowered compared to the Doo and Cat, yet it gets up on the snow easier than both....

I've come up with a few hypothesis....

1) Angle of attack

2) Belt Drive

3) Lower weight

Any thoughts on this? The reason why I ask is selfish...I have a T3 coming, and I have been going back and forth on a TKI belt drive. It loses 4 lb of static weight, AND 2.5 lbs of rotating weight. And I remember the old adage that a pound of rotating mass equals 7 hp.

... Thoughts, suggestions, and comments regarding how and why the Pro gets up on the snow as easily as it does!

Ace

 

[maurfello]

Magic

PRO RMK 800

 

[sled_guy]

Not the belt drive because even the chaincase ones are very good at getting up on the snow.

I'm going to say light weight and the Holz inspired rear coil over suspension. Since 2000 I've been stuffing Holz coil overs under sleds and without an exception their coil over would make the sled trench less and climb up on the snow many times better than stock.

As to your T3, don't worry, I've ridden one and they are a terrific sled. Doo did some rear suspension and chaincase changes that make that thing go through the snow super well.

sled_guy

 

[sledneck_03]

Not the belt drive because even the chaincase ones are very good at getting up on the snow.

I'm going to say light weight and the Holz inspired rear coil over suspension. Since 2000 I've been stuffing Holz coil overs under sleds and without an exception their coil over would make the sled trench less and climb up on the snow many times better than stock.

As to your T3, don't worry, I've ridden one and they are a terrific sled. Doo did some rear suspension and chaincase changes that make that thing go through the snow super well.

sled_guy

has to be the skid and the weight. My iq was an trenching anchor.

 

[Ace Freely]

Ahhh.... the rear skid and transfer! I forgot about that being a factor!

Ace

 

[Excalibur]

Magic and the overall package - weight/geometry/balance. The 2011 and 2012s got up on the snow excellent also. I had and 11 PRO 800. Currently have a 12 PRO 800 and a 12 RMK 600, a 13 PRO 800 and 600 model. The belt drive might be lighter and a bit more responsive, but it is not a game changer for the PRO, the chain case models are equally impressive, even the RMKs, 2012 on up. The sleds work very well, again Polaris got the "entire package" to create the magic! Not sure on the Doo if a belt drive is the best mod per dollar?

 

[Pro-8250]

If my memory serves me right my 2014 800 155" Pro is about 19-20 pounds lighter than my 2011 800 163" was. The 2014 just feels better. In addition to the belt drive I lost about 35 pounds so I am about 55 pounds lighter on the snow now. It's night and day because of the weight. So as others have said, weight has a lot to do with it. $.02

 

[WingNutRacing]

well

Ya gotta be good at something, right.....












that's just a big one

 

[Ace Freely]

Not sure on the Doo if a belt drive is the best mod per dollar?

... have the Diamond S hood and can already. That shaves 26ish pounds off the front. The next logical weight/performance mod would be a belt drive...

Between the 3 mods, I should be around 515ish lbs RTR... still 15 to 20 lbs off the Pro, but I also have the 3 inch and the etech.

... just wondering out loud if others thought the belt drive was the "IT" factor in the Pro...

Ace

 

[Sheetmetalfab]

I think not being as rider forward helps.

More rider neutral.

 

[Jaynelson]

Been mind f-ing this for a while. It seems that the Pro is underpowered compared to the Doo and Cat, yet it gets up on the snow easier than both....

I've come up with a few hypothesis....

1) Angle of attack

2) Belt Drive

3) Lower weight

4) The tears of Doo riders


lol...but ya, I think mostly attack angle, and rear ski geometry. It has a nice balance of transfer - enough to get grip, not so much that it wheelies/trenches. Also the soft stock track doesn't hurt with any of that IMO.

 

[KAWGRN]

4) The tears of Doo riders


lol...but ya, I think mostly attack angle, and rear ski geometry. It has a nice balance of transfer - enough to get grip, not so much that it wheelies/trenches. Also the soft stock track doesn't hurt with any of that IMO.

I agree the stock track works well in dry bottomless snow which is what I keep finding my self in, 2 years ago I tried a CE 2.5 and a Power claw both made my sled a trench monster and was stuck all the time tried every adjustment !! went back to stock and all is right with the world!!

 

[hillking]

I was out with a t3 163 and a stock 2013 pro 155 mine
It had snowed the night before nearly 30" on top of more pow
I thought the t3 was going to leave me badly doing fresh climbs

But I couldn't believe it I was right there with it .. I was amazed so was he
He did say he had some clutching to do ?
It seemed like the t3 was going alright then the skis pointed to the sky and it was stuck .
The pro stayed on top and kept going right up to where he was stuck ... And not even track poaching at all .

 

[Jaynelson]

The truth is, the stock track is no joke in powder conditions. In fact, I'm not convinced there is track on the market that is noticeably better in powder conditions, particularly at stock power levels. It is a compromise track - gives up hard pack performance for better powder performance.

But no one believes that because it's stock and doesn't have big mean looking lugs.

 

[Reg2view]

MHO - Combo of track and skid.

The 5.1 was inspired by the original Attack 20 - they took the concept and improved on some weaknesses, while keeping the key feature - snow packing under the lugs. This is the track's key strength. There are tradeoffs. The Holz look-a-like skid isn't a compliant ride like a torsion spring, but does a great job reducing attack angle when receiving torque, instead of going fully extended, ditchwitch mode.

Weight sure doesn't hurt, jump off the sled and see how well it pops up out of a hole. Still, 250lb'ders get them out of the snow almost as easy as 150lb'ders.

 

[rmscustom]

The truth is, the stock track is no joke in powder conditions. In fact, I'm not convinced there is track on the market that is noticeably better in powder conditions, particularly at stock power levels. It is a compromise track - gives up hard pack performance for better powder performance.

But no one believes that because it's stock and doesn't have big mean looking lugs.

Agree... Wonder if the new Pro will have a new trendy track and longer in fashion lugs to help with sales or if they will stick to what works??? Or maybe it'll be something really cool we don't even know about. lol

 

[takethebounce]

Just watch a Doo ride up a sled deck, then a Pro chassis. The Doo's suspension collapses, it is soft, the Pro is rigid, it wants to pop up rather than pull itself up.

I know that isn't apples to apples, but it allows you to see how they perform different. Doo needs to do away with their torsion springs and soft suspension on their mountain sleds. It makes for a great riding sled on the trail, but mountain sleds shouldn't be designed to be good on the trails.

The track, along with the suspension design and geometry give the RMK an advantage. I don't believe the weight is much of an issue. Stick both sleds in a hole, clear the snow away from the skis so all the weight rests on the skid and hit the throttle, the Pro will pop, the Doo will trench. I have been on Doo's forever. The Pro chassis has some good traits.

 

[AndrettiDog]

I have the TKI and love it. But...It does not weigh less than the stock Polaris QDS. Even Tom will tell you that it is a tad heavier. But it's more reliable, cheaper better belts and has a tensioner.

As for the Pro getting on the snow, I too think it has to do with the "borrowed" Holz style rear suspension. Lightweight is huge in contributing as well.

 

[hoov165x]

I think not being as rider forward helps.

More rider neutral.

Amen brother! Let's hope Polaris doesn't buy into the rider forward BS on their mountain sleds.......

Smoke and mirrors......and marketing hype. Funny how when Doo placed the rider forward, the fuel tank moved rearward. I NEVER saw a sled do an endo until the Rev's came out......

 

[hoov165x]

I was out with a t3 163 and a stock 2013 pro 155 mine
It had snowed the night before nearly 30" on top of more pow
I thought the t3 was going to leave me badly doing fresh climbs

But I couldn't believe it I was right there with it .. I was amazed so was he
He did say he had some clutching to do ?
It seemed like the t3 was going alright then the skis pointed to the sky and it was stuck .
The pro stayed on top and kept going right up to where he was stuck ... And not even track poaching at all .

If you have a Doo there is always "some clutching to do". I have never liked the TRA primary. That's why you will find kits to put a P85 on a Doo but not a TRA on a Polaris.