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WA state is stealing our money!

1fast68:

I don't think that these are "allegations" when I drive by the plower's house and see the plow sitting in the driveway because of no funding, or drive by the groomer's house and see the groomer sitting. They only started plowing and grooming around here in late DEC.....hmmm a little quick math....thats only 6-7 weeks and the budget is shot....something doesn't add up.

I personally haven't used a snopark this year, or even more than one stretch of groomed road about 2miles long, but for those of you that do, you should be hoppin' mad. I know it's not earth shattering news, but to me it's another way that this state bending recreational users over. Time to re-elect Rossi maybe..ha.ha.
 
Wow.
Our groomer up here, Baker, is also on a bid contract. In addition to grooming Baker he must aslo groom several of the outlying riding spots. The bad part is those other areas are not ridden frequently but still must be groomed. I know in his case when he won the contract diesel was about 40% less.
If you really think that grooming a trail with 4 foot of fresh doesn't cost more than you are a fool. My guess is he burns at least a 50 - 80 gallons of fuel in addition to what he would normally run. This is just at Baker. Remember he has 4 other areas to groom as well. So, if he burns an extra 300-400 gallons of fuel a week...............you do the match. Or pm me and I will do the math for you.

The easy way would be for the state to pay the private contractor a surcharge for the extreme conditions or just pay him an hourly rate once his contract is exhausted to continue thru the winter.
The ****ake will hit the fan when all of the skinny skiers can't even hike to the trail head as their Subarus will be parked 10 miles away as the raods won't be plowed and the trails won't be groomed. They will be the ones calling their "Seattle" congress men/women
 
In construction when you bid on something you usually figure in the cost of fuel ! sometimes you take a loss but that doesn't mean you don't uphold your end of the bargain. I would assume that this would apply here as well.
 
the contracts are bid in April,a long way from the grooming season. More snow means slower mileperhour plus time to cut drifts, ect... means less miles of grooming. Grooming 3feet of powder is not like cutting one foot woops out. the contract is a dollar amount when the money is gone do you expect him to work for free.
 
I guess my only comment would be to bid the job a little higher. You can't bid a job and not assume that you might run into situation's like we've had this year. When a person bid's a job they have to take everything into consideration ! Considering you can't look into the future and tell how much snow we are going to get any particular year . just my .02
 
You can't bid it for more money, because there is no more money in the pool,you can bid it at higher hourly rate but that just make less hours/miles on the snow(less grooming). Which is what a lot of the programs are starting to feel. I feel that this is going to get a lot worst over the next couple of seasons.
 
Granted the price of fuel is higher now, but it's higher for everyone. I still see a lot of construction/earthmoving, buses, semi's and other heavy equipment that run on diesel still going. If they can do it why can't the groomer? Because like freak58 said, they could see the writing on the wall and planned ahead to make ends meet. Does grooming money carry over from year to year? Last year they only groomed about 5 weeks all season around here, so where did the surplus money go?
 
The money doesn't carry over. Fuel ,parts, labor all goes up every year of course. BUT THE AMOUNT OF THE CONTRACT DOES NOT CHANGE. Trucking companys all have a fuel surcharge something that the contractors(groomer) did not get because there was no money. I don't no were the money went but I don't think it is being put on the snow.
 
The money doesn't carry over. Fuel ,parts, labor all goes up every year of course. BUT THE AMOUNT OF THE CONTRACT DOES NOT CHANGE. Trucking companys all have a fuel surcharge something that the contractors(groomer) did not get because there was no money. I don't no were the money went but I don't think it is being put on the snow.

I agree it's not all going to the snow. I heard we have paid more than $75,000 to enforcement this year and the tickets they write go to the general fund not grooming or park clearing. This is a FN scam!
 
Ready for more....and WORSE???

----- Original Message ----

Sent: Monday, February 11, 2008 4:41 AM
Subject: Fw: WA SAWS News: WA State Proposed Senate Bill SB6900 - Establishing vehicle engine displacement and emissions fees



----- Original Message -----
From: SAWS - North Washington
To: SAWS-WA@SnowmobileAlliance.org
Sent: Thursday, February 07, 2008 4:01 PM
Subject: WA SAWS News: WA State Proposed Senate Bill SB6900 - Establishing vehicle engine displacement and emissions fees


SAWS members,

And you thought my email prior to work this morning regarding lack of funds for sno-park removal might cost you some extra money down the road. Take a look at SB6900. This is just crazy.

One of the prime sponsors of SB6900 is no other than our OHV friend (not) Senator Adam Kline, the Senator that hates all forms of OHV use and users.

Recall the issue last year about this time during the state legislative session over his anti-OHV noise level bill SB5544? Well not only is SB5544 back again in this session, but now Senator Kline is one of the sponsors for another OHV unfriendly bill, an anti-large vehicle bill that will make you pay dearly for owning a larger liter/greater emissions engine that would cost us OHV users a heck of a lot of money for fees related to our tow vehicles, if not many of our other personal vehicles too.

Senator Kline's new bill SB6900:
http://apps.leg.wa.gov/billinfo/summary.aspx?bill=6900&year=2007

Senator Kline's previous and existing bill SB5544:
http://apps.leg.wa.gov/billinfo/summary.aspx?bill=5544&year=2007

Senator Kline's rude response to OHV users emails last year over emails from SB5544:
http://blog.seattletimes.nwsource.c...3/sen_kline_tells_offroaders_to_buzz_off.html

Sponsors: Senators Tom, Kohl-Welles, Pridemore, Keiser, Kline

2008 REGULAR SESSION
Feb 1 First reading, referred to Water, Energy & Telecommunications. (View Original Bill)
Feb 5 Executive action taken in the Senate Committee on Water and Energy & Telecommunications at 10:00 AM.
Feb 6 WET - Majority; without recommendation.
And refer to Transportation.
Minority; without recommendation.
Referred to Transportation.


http://apps.leg.wa.gov/documents/billdocs/2007-08/Pdf/Bills/Senate Bills/6900.pdf

You may wish to contact your WA State Senator and request that they oppose both of these two bills. You can look up your WA State Senator at this link: http://apps.leg.wa.gov/DistrictFinder/Default.aspx

Dave Hurwitz
Snowmobile Alliance of Western States

Copy of bill pasted below in plain text below.





SENATE BILL 6900




State of Washington 60th Legislature 2008 Regular Session

By Senators Tom, Kohl-Welles, Pridemore, Keiser, and Kline

Read first time 02/01/08. Referred to Committee on Water, Energy &

Telecommunications.

1 AN ACT Relating to establishing vehicle engine displacement and

2 emissions fees; adding new sections to chapter 46.17 RCW; providing

3 effective dates; and providing an expiration date.

4 BE IT ENACTED BY THE LEGISLATURE OF THE STATE OF WASHINGTON:

5 NEW SECTION. Sec. 1. A new section is added to chapter 46.17 RCW

6 to read as follows:

7 (1) A vehicle engine displacement fee must be paid and collected

8 annually for motor vehicles subject to the fee under RCW 46.16.0621,

9 except motor homes. The amount of the fee must be based upon the

10 vehicle engine size in liters, which is correlated with vehicle size

11 and vehicle emissions. The fee imposed under this section must be used

12 for transportation purposes, and may not be used for the general

13 support of state government. The vehicle engine displacement fee is

14 that portion of the fee, as reflected on the engine size in liters set

15 forth in the schedule provided in this section,that is in excess of

16 the fees imposed under RCW 46.16.0621 and 46.17.010. For vehicles

17 registered on or after January 1, 2009, the vehicle engine displacement

18 fee under this section is due at the time of initial vehicle

19 registration and any subsequent renewal of vehicle registration.



1 Engine Size (liters) Rate Schedule
2 Up to 1.9 $0
3 2.0 - 2.9 $70
4 3.0 - 3.9 $225
5 4.0 - 4.9 $275
6 5.0 - 5.9 $325
7 6.0 - 7.9 $400
8 8.0 or over $600




9 (2) For the purpose of administering this section, the department

10 shall rely on the vehicle engine size in liters as provided by vehicle

11 manufacturers, or other sources defined by the department, to determine

12 the engine size in liters of each vehicle. The department shall adopt

13 rules for determining engine size in liters for vehicles that do not

14 have a manufacturer-provided engine size in liters.

15 (3) The vehicle engine displacement fee under this section is

16 imposed to provide funds to mitigate the impact of vehicle loads on the

17 state roads and highways, as well as encourage the reduction of vehicle

18 emissions and is separate and distinct from other vehicle license fees.

19 (4) The vehicle engine displacement fee collected under this

20 section must be deposited into the multimodal transportation account.



21 NEW SECTION. Sec. 2. A new section is added to chapter 46.17 RCW

22 to read as follows:

23 (1) A vehicle emissions fee must be paid and collected annually for

24 motor vehicles subject to the fee under RCW 46.16.0621, except motor

25 homes. The amount of the fee must be based upon the grams of carbon

26 dioxide (CO2) emission per mile. Fees imposed under this section must

27 be used for transportation purposes, and may not be used for the

28 general support of state government. The vehicle emissions fee is that

29 portion of the fee, as reflected on the grams of carbon dioxide (CO2)

30 emission per mile set forth in the schedule provided in this section,

31 that is in excess of the fees imposed under RCW 46.16.0621 and



1 46.17.010. On or after January 1, 2012, the vehicle emissions fee

2 under this section is due at the time of initial vehicle registration

3 and any subsequent renewal of vehicle registration.



4 CO2 Emissions
(grams/mile) Rate Schedule
5 Up to 161 $0
6 162 - 193 $70
7 194 - 241 $225
8 242 - 266 $275
9 267 - 298 $325
10 299 - 362 $400
11 Over 362 $600




12 (2) For the purpose of administering this section, the department

13 shall rely on the grams of carbon dioxide (CO2) emission per mile as

14 provided by vehicle manufacturers, or other sources defined by the

15 department, to determine the grams of carbon dioxide (CO2) emission per

16 mile of each vehicle. The department shall adopt rules for determining

17 grams of carbon dioxide (CO2) emission per mile for vehicles without

18 manufacturer-provided information on grams of carbon dioxide (CO2)

19 emission per mile.

20 (3) The vehicle emissions fee under this section is imposed to

21 provide funds to mitigate the impact of vehicle loads on the state

22 roads and highways, as well as encourage the reduction of vehicle

23 emissions and is separate and distinct from other vehicle license fees.

24 (4) The vehicle emissions fee collected under this section must be

25 deposited into the multimodal transportation account.



26 NEW SECTION. Sec. 3. Section 1 of this act takes effect January

27 1, 2009.



28 NEW SECTION. Sec. 4. Section 2 of this act takes effect January

29 1, 2012.



30 NEW SECTION. Sec. 5. Section 1 of this act expires January 1,

2012.
 
OH BOY, looks like most of my policital friends on the west side:mad: are helping me out. NOT. Coming after my sleds and after we got tab fees dropped I could, pray that we don't, be seeing 700 bucks to get tabs for my pickup. preaching to the choir here, but we need more ppl to come on the offensive. Sleding here is too much fun and i don't want the guys in the subadod's and 100% bio-degradable clothes telling me how to go play.
 
Looks like there might be enough intelligent people on the Transportation committee to not allow this one the light of day in the full chamber so far........




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Bill Information > SB 6900 - 2007-08

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SB 6900 - 2007-08 (What is this?)

Establishing vehicle engine displacement and emissions fees.

Go to documents...


History of Bill
as of Saturday, February 23, 2008 8:22 AM


Sponsors: Senators Tom, Kohl-Welles, Pridemore, Keiser, Kline

2008 REGULAR SESSION
Feb 1 First reading, referred to Water, Energy & Telecommunications. (View Original Bill)
Feb 5 Executive action taken in the Senate Committee on Water and Energy & Telecommunications at 10:00 AM.
Feb 6 WET - Majority; without recommendation.
And refer to Transportation.
Minority; without recommendation.
Referred to Transportation.

Go to history...


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Last edited:
To try to avoid them stealing any more of it I would suggest using the Klines new bill link, and sending your senator and representatives your opinion on SB6900. I think I'm okay since all 3 of mine are republicans....but you never know
 
Last edited:
Let's see,

Diesel went up in Idaho also.
Same record snows in Idaho as Washington State.
Parking lots are all plowed. (although their having a hard time finding room for all the snow)
Trails are still getting groomed. (although the snow depth has caused lots of mechanical problems for the groomers)

And we pay a grand total of $35 to park and ride / sled, in Idaho. Must be something different.
 
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