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Top of the World access from Red Lodge side?

M
Jan 12, 2018
40
3
8
40
Hi. Planning a ride up at top of the world and heard that there is a way to run up 212 from red lodge and start a ride from there where the road ends.

Small suv and one place trailer. Is it possible to do that or does the road end too low and not enough snow?

Thanks for the help!
 

coolm7cat

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I've done it once. Wouldn't do it again. All I have to say is you better know how to ride if you want to go that way. Your better off going to pilot parking lot and heading in that way .
 

kbroderick

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As noted in the other thread, weather on the Pass gets real interesting, real fast. I was up there today, went as far as the mile marker 52 drift (this one:
patete6u.jpg
) and decided I didn't trust my side-hilling ability quite enough given the penalty for getting it wrong, plus I was only trying to ski Rock Creek Headwall (above the third switchback), and skinning the last half mile seemed a much safer choice.

I've seen it go from blue skies to 30 MPH wind and snowing in July in a matter of hours, and if you're on top and in the wrong place, you might not see the clouds approaching until they're within 15 minutes of hitting.

I've also sat out a thunderstorm in a snow cave because I misjudged how much time I had before it actually hit...I think that was July, or maybe August.

To your original question, the turn-out at the gate on this side is small enough that I'd be reluctant to park there overnight, even with a relatively small rig; if it gets snowed/blown in, the plow may be challenged to turn around, let alone clear the rest of the space. You could park down on Main Fork easily enough, and the snow coverage is decent now (road is sufficiently covered from the gate up to the third switchback, at least, although there's bare pavement in a few places and other spots where things are far deeper).

However, it's only two hours by road from Red Lodge to the Pilot Peak parking lot, and having your vehicle below you on the same side of the pass seems like a much safer plan than riding across unless—as noted—you know the terrain and nail the weather. The father of a coworker rode across from Red Lodge on Sunday (and back), said it took a couple of hours, but he's lived and played here for many years and knows the terrain.

FWIW, the snow up there right now is completely wind-f***ed, at least as far as I got today, and the top layer is super-reactive (I got propagating cracks in the 1/2"-ish windslab layer just trying to isolate a column to do an ECT). I'd be very wary of anything that's been loaded, even the lee side of the aforementioned MM 52 drift—if you slide down that way, you're either going to hang up on the guardrail or you're going to get down to the first switchback pretty darn quick, and there's a lot of big rocks still poking through down there).

Given the visible evidence of wind transport at the ridgeline, I'd assume it's even more wind-f***ed up top, but I don't know for sure.

Edit: and here's that MM52 drift yesterday, if you look real close you can see my sled parked on the far (Red Lodge) side:
cL2JtNY6Rikw1iJfkUYl-zAXc-S_qtaI-RPgip3UT29KYxI_L0IqI7yGNwV-Bk58wRIU0FZBgGjEBHHc9MPaeG7C-E35hoaXNcL9U3QzNYSdS2tRVdC89u0nXWC5PmJOi6oQnQSZ6P8fN_tg80eaM-tct8D8abPqfu3z2NEgwQLJt9SyXt7wJsLlP96a1Hr-UqlYdc13qchX0rPzY0C1Q4tY-Yc1aPtOA-m8w7uvAr-y4Xe7IFb6uiIlenshUEFl4O_N666UHRgyF618zUAdJfRMUM1GyNGHY_2XtLLB7Rn0ouLfC8LOaQdriJgtjGI8LUeXYLqdF-9Dz-IWiyuKNClJ8OApRWsj9zUkPk6XPG4Q6YUhlHaYsDwvPk4c7izTNh6mllZfpoMCqh3Z_CPJUySaXDy9yF51exzdKYcNYz29V5oJystHM7nKR4Kbc9YfB7jpx6eDm4I8y3WbJboBZ1n6le6cxGI7pfdEQX2ZOEYn5nqoQVZvGJcGKBgjJQ_oL5qanNQBp2moD5JN6lHQZxJI4qJAus8mviXPpHVyKQbTozYgIHgdQ_M_MgFx9fNc0SsP8ekV8OerdEWqemyt2U0Jf4FM_5QWjoxmPuutJ1pF-F3ajTlHArETcB0--_IEQ110chEqHqt4jbloSzGHJW0HTMvVT6go2g=w1440-h810-no


0pdyBERdGEwnE02uibgG5slR8YnfrC_6I-MmdK-QzIq04HbCx1iOYCM1hgHiXDjb86yEv82FmE3ZCMcPz5dyJL5AD6mzlgaZccnvfgItQ90_HbLXPn0G5WMM2OvMNqNcBKhs1deU83KQVXHNbQmZeyL9qBQ2I02WFtVYssJ6CjrZ1qg_U-FO2ADtZeYCqEyZcEaRaCgqzzJAaMunQuXYW12LSCX4Pi0w0b1ugWv0a75SLo9scj5amdana_EqubaULHfoIC_zpsopdTrJR3nH4lop57xIsLTu59Ef01We1fsAOVv7PsQVnQjmW94FHtehYgSDMB34HhuMFiLFU_KlqFyN5g5vmTj5hjFs6Iq_F4yK_Zm1FZyRHN-DL1EXtrbwCdLFCwd8Li4lp5mG4fY7mhIGNCjA1ZJYSEUMnNi5Pd_6BDNeOsJ49lD95ZIxfrxwy2CPPo3DRtCETB4j21hp8fTn6gu3zg8Z5oUwgbv4eenuYzBUVyDHpot7YmSzlWum8kJGJ1hhlssyiK5zPW2B_BOp2C25pwYT9Yj9IY33XkIzmY3Fg9AZ_DC9YqtTKEZqlKlcp8xONUYCB1FF0tU68naRH7yo9TyNQjDmsv3mzbnuNdwCAn8EBwnUxdVFWyPq7BxRVUdavNKF012O91GQhQ3rsdFtXYBszA=w1440-h810-no


Little bit of wind.
 
Last edited:

coolm7cat

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Dec 15, 2008
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Montana
As noted in the other thread, weather on the Pass gets real interesting, real fast. I was up there today, went as far as the mile marker 52 drift (this one:
patete6u.jpg
) and decided I didn't trust my side-hilling ability quite enough given the penalty for getting it wrong, plus I was only trying to ski Rock Creek Headwall (above the third switchback), and skinning the last half mile seemed a much safer choice.

I've seen it go from blue skies to 30 MPH wind and snowing in July in a matter of hours, and if you're on top and in the wrong place, you might not see the clouds approaching until they're within 15 minutes of hitting.

I've also sat out a thunderstorm in a snow cave because I misjudged how much time I had before it actually hit...I think that was July, or maybe August.

To your original question, the turn-out at the gate on this side is small enough that I'd be reluctant to park there overnight, even with a relatively small rig; if it gets snowed/blown in, the plow may be challenged to turn around, let alone clear the rest of the space. You could park down on Main Fork easily enough, and the snow coverage is decent now (road is sufficiently covered from the gate up to the third switchback, at least, although there's bare pavement in a few places and other spots where things are far deeper).

However, it's only two hours by road from Red Lodge to the Pilot Peak parking lot, and having your vehicle below you on the same side of the pass seems like a much safer plan than riding across unless—as noted—you know the terrain and nail the weather. The father of a coworker rode across from Red Lodge on Sunday (and back), said it took a couple of hours, but he's lived and played here for many years and knows the terrain.

FWIW, the snow up there right now is completely wind-f***ed, at least as far as I got today, and the top layer is super-reactive (I got propagating cracks in the 1/2"-ish windslab layer just trying to isolate a column to do an ECT). I'd be very wary of anything that's been loaded, even the lee side of the aforementioned MM 52 drift—if you slide down that way, you're either going to hang up on the guardrail or you're going to get down to the first switchback pretty darn quick, and there's a lot of big rocks still poking through down there).

Given the visible evidence of wind transport at the ridgeline, I'd assume it's even more wind-f***ed up top, but I don't know for sure.

Exactly!!
 
M
Jan 12, 2018
40
3
8
40
Thanks SO much for the advice you guys!

That was awesome info, and now I have a better picture of how that access is in reality.

Like I tell everyone I ride with: I am a more capable rider that my fear factor allows... the opposite problem of "Maverick" in top gun: "My ego is too ckicken-$=!+ to write checks that my body (abilities) could easily cash."

I see chickening out as an extremely high probability on that!

So I'll stick with pilot creek like I done have before! :biggrin1:
 
Last edited:
G
Dec 20, 2007
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Three Forks, MT
That looks like a better ride on snowbike then sled but I imagine it would be sketchy either way. I've driven it in the summer in my truck and i can definitely see how some spots would be interesting
 

kbroderick

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Just another photo of that lower Quad / mm52 drift, from Saturday:

aytwF4UUvDVoBrgGG7iHx0hTCZNqyd2fOXknwV0hXmQo9ATS4Pw8Xvxlfy-LX0yPwOrExkxrMEbxBP1gOZ_EQIRV2Jxn4dfhHgptxidGo7MYY3q1EgNa3yiTkj6cN4wFZvMSERZ_8xqFxV8R8NZKPF8f5vavNn6gtTvsA2pt4ivM-PCB7IvGmogRwUlmoyhjsrR2A9hpOTqVCoGmkv8LNViqNPQXWYUJNA0n63kd1oNbCM3riaE_9z6FAT8fQMtxNxHL2oXi24z5z7vYq40coM5KovdYHwOlGMIkXkTgnNupu-7-MRpScboJwLJ2gxIZ8zDTRXlbN8xMIWLnqE6JERwjT2hMNtrgvP_g7hDT47bqlVuO6kL0JSWq46BHA3FpnwB_aUHhKMGglPJ9iX5yhU3rveNO-t06XseTNpwmnqJ0x2b6pz6BgdpmN3xcnBMjCUMYeuKOCbrMwWvBZysiEpulr8__Wum_DxNB1-hFfIDL1Ftm7L2NXD74u2hgWPETIQ6Xe-0XpjI-Dn6aBXhbiZdxfAdTqDzp4yHj483NMmpmFQREzgpSeeRCq8iI_QWdL3y1uTs3d8grcBNKHlttKISEo_zRPu-brB-WJ9qywJiFoNSxkh3o8dkc1TL6OYumjLsm_BDrHbx2bg9G1H9u6eTc6H_IyVuBug=w3082-h2312-no


I skinned from there again, but there were three more sets of tracks turning around there when I got back to my sled. There were also a fair number of new wind drifts between there and the gate, pretty good testament to how quickly conditions can change.
 

papafinger1

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I know pictures don’t do it justice and I will more than likely get flamed for this but as good as machines have become as well as talented and risky aome riders are, I am fairly surprised no one has attempted to sidehill that.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

kbroderick

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I know pictures don’t do it justice and I will more than likely get flamed for this but as good as machines have become as well as talented and risky aome riders are, I am fairly surprised no one has attempted to sidehill that.

Looking at it from the top:
LUB5QtNSOBHukvlvYlt-HABkJRom6pFpW2iRefe7tBJTgTq-LXc_qPifhQtohYANV_HHDAF1ih_PZh1A-NUTOKuPO1vuTJ8rmYHVYPGAzEODjJisK8qOfvBBJW-0Mqr2Z2c3SYZt_jyKlZo77pLJYGX8IEK9Y7EZqlbA42VeGPUUj23CKCuhAXoBQAwMG46f9Q-xAgO9NJmJLcuhztoBqOyc8529cWzNBfJm0k5uE7SxmbpbT7d1qvzfeSs6MYGWkKBJ2JmDN87FPkAr_k0XftdNqLaPCi8Qd6lz9Kd2BOvMt6BFTyo0UwfcGMtddSI9wyVKy_NCvWKHAAkze4KUIm4iJ6RpM4Wb4CaCG-FCPESI1hEfjQhpJCjdMkGylAJuY51tz6SWDmSTkvGcaaZ48kc2gY3BVw9mtSBClvvgKY222skOJE6zkoFeAFLyEeEPvKH0iHxvQ_QSqKbXxxtAsXw1T3GlmiApmUWzHQgkJvXIh_Ag0EpRKfb1tMd2e3egzREsMgriZ1MV5Wq_X9LGOHfy6Zf6YiVvWIWb4IGtkMt3_RzkYvjY_a3a_aT-mSTOY4TwrXRTLYjhxEuQl_HxO9pWl9Q5BHbeKpIVEbtA4DbGdw1-DDOZrgums9ujgWNOVS6zg4d5zJLbIBlI4ZL4EVL0I8KMd1ukVA=w3302-h2476-no


That particular drift is completely doable given the right snow conditions, and I've seen sled tracks across it in the past. The catch is that if you screw up to the high side, you could easily find yourself in a 5-10 foot hole with a mountain on one side and a large snowdrift on the other; if you screw up to the low side, there are probably going to be expensive noises when the sled hits the guardrail (and more expensive noises if it doesn't stop there).

That said, I don't have the skill to be comfortable trying it by myself, given the penalties for screwing up (if I end up with my sled on the uphill side of that drift, I don't want to be the only one available to dig it out). And this is only about four miles from the gate...I'd assume there are other wind-created snow features further up the roadway to keep things interesting, plus the weather factor on the plateau.

It can be done, but getting up to the plateau starts stacking up a lot of risk that I'd want to mitigate before trying (i.e. group of experienced people with first aid, wilderness travel & rescue training, InReach or similar, etc.). Traveling into the backcountry with a motor makes it real easy to get a long distance from help if stuff goes sideways. I'd also guess that given the relatively short drive around to the other side, it's a lot easier to trailer to Pilot or near Top of the World rather than taking the run across the top.
 

freak485

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I know pictures don’t do it justice and I will more than likely get flamed for this but as good as machines have become as well as talented and risky aome riders are, I am fairly surprised no one has attempted to sidehill that.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Its not really even the side hill its the weather and wind up there change in a heartbeat it will snow up there and get shut down for a day even in the summer time its happened.
 

LoneViper

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We have tried to ride down a ways from the top, if you were to get by those lower drifts, you have another set of drifts up high to deal with. No thanks, nice pictures though. There should be some serious snow up there this year.
 

BeartoothBaron

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I've gone up to the top from the Red lodge side four or five years ago. Can't remember what year for sure, but it had to be a low-snow year because the drifts were much smaller in that spot. It was still a little hairy, but they weren't built up over the guardrail other than a few spots, so there was less concern about tumbling your sled and/or yourself down the hill. I'm guessing it's doable as it sits for a good rider, but even if that were me I wouldn't want to risk it. One small mistake and it's a long way down!
 
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