Timbersled Bearings ?
- Thread starter summitboy
- Start date
Im not going to bother with grease able bearings this year just replace then at the start of the season
I was amazed at how much water would weap out of the bearing when I greased it after every ride last year. I would grease them VERY SLOWLY while rotating the track and the grease would displace the water. Mine and my sons kits both made the season with the stock bearings and I saw some that didn't (with less hours) that failed. A word of warning if you change out your bearings....use heat to remove the bolt that goes into the shaft....it is red locktited in and have heard of some breaking the bolt off trying t remove it
R
relentless rider
Well-known member
I went though Motion Industries, gave them the bearing measurements, im petty sure the bearings I got were SKF .wish i could remember the part #, give them a call.(406) 542-4139
they were not greasable , but way better bearings
they were not greasable , but way better bearings
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They are just 6205-RS for the normal bearings. I was looking for a 6205 with the grease hole. Sounds like Timber gets them made specifically for them. I'm just gonna use a sealed SKF and fill with good grease.
Yup I broke the bottom bolt. I heated it and it came part way and then snapped. Not sure why TS uses so much red loctite, it was full. Kinda junky IMO !
Yup I broke the bottom bolt. I heated it and it came part way and then snapped. Not sure why TS uses so much red loctite, it was full. Kinda junky IMO !
over grease
You do not want to add grease to a sealed bearing, the more grease inside the more drag drag = heat the factory puts the right amount of grease and proper weight of grease in each bearing. Bearings are getting warm snow melts sucks water into bearing, just like your boat trailer tow it down the road put it into the water water goes right past the seal. There is a thrust load factor created by this design, Not floating one bearing n a series causes thrust load thrust load causes heat.
My 2 cents
You do not want to add grease to a sealed bearing, the more grease inside the more drag drag = heat the factory puts the right amount of grease and proper weight of grease in each bearing. Bearings are getting warm snow melts sucks water into bearing, just like your boat trailer tow it down the road put it into the water water goes right past the seal. There is a thrust load factor created by this design, Not floating one bearing n a series causes thrust load thrust load causes heat.
My 2 cents
I'm not sure i buy that. These bearings are made for electric motors not this type of application. In my sled I run a collared driveshaft bearing. If I run them without touching I get one season at best. If I pack with a good grease, and repack here and there they last 2-3 years. Good grease is key.
With bearings only costing $6-$10 each. And only 4 of them why not just replace once a year to be sure. $40. Or Long walk out of bush! Or a ride bitch with your buddy!
has a bearing on the subject
pumping tooo much grease in a good bearing under load can break the bearing race as the bearing turns and compresses the over greased bearing. Problem on heavy equipment, unlikely on the under stressed sno bikes.
None of the grease in the $25 and under bearings is of any particular quality, for sure not water resistant any more than margarine. Thorough mechanics setting up sleds and bikes for any long run competition start by cleaning out the bearings and putting in good quality water proof cold weather grease.
If your bearing on the snobike chit out, usually some misalignment most likely issue. Cheap and mediocre bearings out of box bearing will go several years of in snow service ingesting some water before water is an issue, 2 or 3000 miles easily. Especially on a 50hp light weight bike. Bearing problems ? ........you have an alignment issue/ and maybe a vibration issue. Not what you want to know. Uncomfortable thought.
The only bad sno bike bearing I looked at was not a lubrication issue, bearing came apart, cracked race and balls bunched up. Bearing just subjected to forces it was never designed to handle.
pumping tooo much grease in a good bearing under load can break the bearing race as the bearing turns and compresses the over greased bearing. Problem on heavy equipment, unlikely on the under stressed sno bikes.
None of the grease in the $25 and under bearings is of any particular quality, for sure not water resistant any more than margarine. Thorough mechanics setting up sleds and bikes for any long run competition start by cleaning out the bearings and putting in good quality water proof cold weather grease.
If your bearing on the snobike chit out, usually some misalignment most likely issue. Cheap and mediocre bearings out of box bearing will go several years of in snow service ingesting some water before water is an issue, 2 or 3000 miles easily. Especially on a 50hp light weight bike. Bearing problems ? ........you have an alignment issue/ and maybe a vibration issue. Not what you want to know. Uncomfortable thought.
The only bad sno bike bearing I looked at was not a lubrication issue, bearing came apart, cracked race and balls bunched up. Bearing just subjected to forces it was never designed to handle.
I replace the stock ones with sealed SKF bearings (best there is). Still replace them before each season. VERY low price to pay to be able to ride without troubles for the whole season and then replace in between before next season.
Lots of other stuff I do the same with. Chains etc. Having a breakdown during season is worst case scenario, since I wanna ride every second I can and my experience with pulling my kit out from where we ride is a real PAIN to do. Easy preventive money to pay therefore in my book.
load rating
Might want to check the load rating charts, Stainless carries less load than a standard deep groove bearing
Might want to check the load rating charts, Stainless carries less load than a standard deep groove bearing
C
Cpt.Ron
Well-known member
How about the..
How about using the Bearings that come with the Blue seals, they are specifically set up for winter and snow applications. I believe that they are manufactured by KML bearings, "All Balls Racing" markets them for sleds. they seem to work excellent on the sleds.
I believe that SKF has a similar product with Blue seals as well.
I am not buying a misalignment issue on the Factory produced Mountain Horse Snow bikes, ..unless it was subjected to a major crash or hit that caused such misalignment.
The 6205 series is a very economical bearing, used in thousands of light applications. It should be adequate in the Snow Bikes given the power and weights involved. The 2014 kits have grease-able versions of this same bearing.
Lack of grease and water contamination is likely the route cause for most of these bearing failures. Perhaps replace the bearings each season for piece of mind, or do as suggested, pop the seal, flush the bearing out with something like WD 40, then pack it with good grease. Seen this done many times and it works.
IMO
How about using the Bearings that come with the Blue seals, they are specifically set up for winter and snow applications. I believe that they are manufactured by KML bearings, "All Balls Racing" markets them for sleds. they seem to work excellent on the sleds.
I believe that SKF has a similar product with Blue seals as well.
I am not buying a misalignment issue on the Factory produced Mountain Horse Snow bikes, ..unless it was subjected to a major crash or hit that caused such misalignment.
The 6205 series is a very economical bearing, used in thousands of light applications. It should be adequate in the Snow Bikes given the power and weights involved. The 2014 kits have grease-able versions of this same bearing.
Lack of grease and water contamination is likely the route cause for most of these bearing failures. Perhaps replace the bearings each season for piece of mind, or do as suggested, pop the seal, flush the bearing out with something like WD 40, then pack it with good grease. Seen this done many times and it works.
IMO
Actually with all of these bearing failures I would have to agree that its misalignment and the way they are used. Water does little in the way of damage to these bearings in a short amount of time. Ball bearings are not meant to hold any size load of any real amount. If you flex the frame and are not aligned and get on the gas there is a great amount of distortion. If the bearings were failing do to water they would wear out and get loose races. Then fall apart, and this does not just happen quickly either. If they are loaded wrong or to much they will fail.
Also by misalignment im not saying there jigs are off and the frames come from TS this way. Im saying there are alot of forces going on and the way the bearings are mounted are every bit as important as a straight jig.
Just from an engineering standpoint.
Also I agree with getting better quality bearings.
NTN makes some of the best bearing out there and they make a special blue seal with cold weather grease that are nice and heavy. Hard to find though but I believe wahl bros carries them.
Also by misalignment im not saying there jigs are off and the frames come from TS this way. Im saying there are alot of forces going on and the way the bearings are mounted are every bit as important as a straight jig.
Just from an engineering standpoint.
Also I agree with getting better quality bearings.
NTN makes some of the best bearing out there and they make a special blue seal with cold weather grease that are nice and heavy. Hard to find though but I believe wahl bros carries them.
We haven't seen a single actual bearing failure. We have been seeing water damaged wear and tear causing the bearing to be less than trustworthy anymore.
I wouldn't go and over think the situtation here, we run these things in WATER (snow) all winter, then park them and let them warm up each night usually, do you seriously think that rust isn't a factor in a bearing wearing out??? I'm going to guess you've never taken the seals off a bearing from a kit which has been in service for a season.
Replace em, KML aren't good. SKF, NSK, KOYO all are.. The country of origin on a bearing is pretty much key to getting a good bearing. Japanese or German, or if you can find em, USA bearings simply use much better materials than Korean or Chinese bearings.
I wouldn't go and over think the situtation here, we run these things in WATER (snow) all winter, then park them and let them warm up each night usually, do you seriously think that rust isn't a factor in a bearing wearing out??? I'm going to guess you've never taken the seals off a bearing from a kit which has been in service for a season.
Replace em, KML aren't good. SKF, NSK, KOYO all are.. The country of origin on a bearing is pretty much key to getting a good bearing. Japanese or German, or if you can find em, USA bearings simply use much better materials than Korean or Chinese bearings.
I personally have not see these failure so I cannot really say what is wrong, but rusted bearings generally are not a problem in really short term use, a snow season in most places are not long. With that being said sitting over the summer or for weeks on end full of water is all bad news. Im kinda surprised the bearing seals are have such a hard time holding out the water. Ive had idler wheel bearings(exact same size 6205) last for 8 years and 4k miles on a sled I used to own. I was not easy on it at all, jumped it over 100+ ft in the fields, we would build a jump and hit it all day. I also used that same sled for water-cross and sunk it many times. Never had a failure and the idlers where hitting hard. Drive shaft never had an issue either. This is what leads me to thing something else besides water is the problem. Water can effect the bearing if it rust up badly(point of the seals) but I don't see why they are filling up so bad. Must be really bad bearing seals.
Has anyone tried putting good bearings in to see if they last a lot longer?
