Im ordering a 2016 MH and don't know what one i should get ST or LT. I have a 2015 KTM 500 weigh 180lb and ride in Maine. I'm interested in off trail boondocking and tree riding, I'm thinking LT. Any sugestions would be appreciated.
ST or LT
- Thread starter motodan
- Start date
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Rush44
Well-known member
You only want the LT if you are in deep bottomless powder a lot. If you spend a decent amount of time on the trail and you have fairly low snowpack the ST will be the best choice. Normally we get big snowfalls around here but this year the ST would have been a great choice. Didn't need the LT very often at all.
And yes, get the TSS for the 16.
And yes, get the TSS for the 16.
being that your in Maine, i would almost favor the St. your right around my "cutoff weight" for ST/LT
but I assume you dont have super deep champagne powder like some of the high mountains do, also your bike is gonna have a lot more power down at 1-3k' above sea level range so the ST will get you where you need to go and be more nimble.
but I assume you dont have super deep champagne powder like some of the high mountains do, also your bike is gonna have a lot more power down at 1-3k' above sea level range so the ST will get you where you need to go and be more nimble.
How much does rider weight factor a lot into the ST vs LT? I rode a LT for the first time and it didn't seem any less maneuverable than the ST but had a lot more traction.
for regular boondocking its not as big of a deal but for those of us who like to jump em around and try to ride them like the bike with wheels you will notice the extra length especially in the air.
Agreed! For a guy with a user name of "motodan" I'd definitely suggest the ST. LT's go anywhere with ease, but take some of the fun out of it for me.
When you want to wheelie the ski up over a log or something, or hit a jump you really notice the extra length keeping you planted.
I agree with shorter should be better but I was thinking more along the lines of rider weight. Timbersled mentions a 220 and up go LT, thinking the loss of flotation is worse than the loss of maneuverability?
Get a lighter bike? Part of why I am doing a cr500 for my snow bike, lighter than my yz, and more power. That and I will lose some weight.
I'm debating between SX and ST. LT would be cool if you had something with a ton of power and did a lot of steep and deep climbing. But I think I would prefer something more maneuverable, that I can launch with, and do what a snow bike does best with, rather than try to replicate what a sled does well at.
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Rush44
Well-known member
Look, the LT isn't really less maneuverable in the sense you can't pick as tight of lines or rip around in a creek bottom just like everyone else. As WHM said you really notice it in the air or when you try to wheelie out.... which frankly isn't something that's at the top of my list when I'm out there in the deep backcountry. The LT just allows you to pull that uphill slope at a steeper angle AND helps you breaking trail as first man into the back on a deep day. I still take just as tight of a line as the ST guy... I just keep pulling uphill when he might need to finesse it more.
The drawback is that in spring conditions you feel the hill a lot more than you do the ST. It's a little bit of a rougher ride and when you hook up sometimes you hook up too much. For me, on a normal year, it's a tradeoff I can live with for those deep days. Those deep days just need to come!
The drawback is that in spring conditions you feel the hill a lot more than you do the ST. It's a little bit of a rougher ride and when you hook up sometimes you hook up too much. For me, on a normal year, it's a tradeoff I can live with for those deep days. Those deep days just need to come!
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Blaser
Well-known member
With respect to the weight issue, maybe this will help.
In side by side testing of 3 equal bikes, 2 ST and one LT on a very deep fluffy early season day: ST throttle position would be 30% or more (higher) than the same bike with the LT. The LT floats better, and was on top of the snow where the ST was down in the snow; and in that situation, the LT required less throttle to maintain the same land speed as the ST. Both ST and LT made it to the same areas, the LT just did it with less throttle and effort.
The statement that LT's won't work unless you have a bike bigger than a 450 is incorrect. Many LT's have found their way onto 2 strokes, and they're equally happy on 450's or 500's. While we don't recommend it, you could run the LT on a 250F. I suspect it would be a lot like a Phazer with a long track... it would go anywhere, just not super fast.
We suggest the bigger (heavier) guys that ride deep powder go with the LT. Read Rush's post above, which explains well how the LT works.
You are correct that the loss of flotation is a bigger factor than the loss of maneuverability. It could be argued that older LT's were definitely less maneuverable than older ST's. Older LT's also had slower top speeds. 2015 changed all that; and 2016 takes it even farther.
Now with the new Convex 2.5 track and suspension, the 2016 LT is really a force to be reckoned with. The 2016 LT is very close in handling and maneuverability to the ST. Closer than ever. The one thing that still remains constant is track drive vs. ski bite. That relationship is basically the same as 2015.
Both ST and LT are equally strong; so weight is not a factor there.
At 180, you could go ST or LT and either will work really well. Based on my limited knowledge of your area, my assumption is tight woods, rolling hills, and not the 4' deep dumps we get out West. For that terrain the ST is going to really work well, and wouldn't disappoint; and the ST will feel more at home for you on the trail; though there are some here at TS that will argue the LT is now better on the trail.
What does "better" mean, anyway?
-Blaser
That's great info, thanks Blaser! When I bought my first kit(never even saw a snowbike in person) I was told the ST was like a 146 and the LT a 162... I don't think that's really the case, going 250# geared up the LT works better for me than the ST in almost all snow conditions. It seems rider weight has a big impact, where on a sled I went everywhere and then some on my 146, where my ST trenches and the LT is faster and more maneuverable due to being on top of the snow instead of down in it...
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Blaser
Well-known member
Sounds like you've made your decision- and at 250 all geared up- the LT is the easy choice.
One other thing we've noticed, is rider size/weight brings consistent comments about which kit is best. We've tracked opinions, and the trend is that the smaller or lighter riders comment they feel or notice the length differences, while the bigger or heavier riders don't notice the LT length as a hindrance to maneuverability.
I ride with a big guy that prefers an LT, and I've yet to see him get out maneuvered by a little guy on an SX. Even though I'd like to say I beat him all the time... which I do
motodan, fellow mainer here. We have been riding 2-2014 ST for 2 years now and the only time we needed a LT was this past February when it snowed like hell and f-in cold. We don't get 4' champagne powder like we had very often and just had to put a little more effort into it but was still a blast. The new 2016 ST will be all you need around here, especially with all the improvements. The only thing you will need besides the snowbike is new riding partners! Where are you located? We could use some more people to ride with.
500xcw
some good replies on here, one thing no one has mentioned that i think is worth noting, i ride a 500 xcw with an lt and weigh about 180, i think the 500 motor works better with an lt, it doesnt rev as fast or high as a 450 so the big track helps it to get up on the snow quicker, if i was riding a 450 i would run an st, but i think the lt helps the 500's power get to the snow better. what do you guys think about that?
some good replies on here, one thing no one has mentioned that i think is worth noting, i ride a 500 xcw with an lt and weigh about 180, i think the 500 motor works better with an lt, it doesnt rev as fast or high as a 450 so the big track helps it to get up on the snow quicker, if i was riding a 450 i would run an st, but i think the lt helps the 500's power get to the snow better. what do you guys think about that?
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Hunters Recreational Products
Active member
Maineiac, I don't want to jack this thread but next year we should put some snowbike rides together in Maine. I just rode jackman this weekend on a 2016 MH LT, and the only problem was having to stop frequently to help dig out the lap traffic (sleds)! I'm a Timbersled dealer in CT and it's safe to say the snowbike population in New England will be exponentially higher next season, including motodan and his crew. I kept saying to myself... "I can't wait until we all have these"
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