questions from a twoskier

[PalousePoo]

How hard does a standard mh kit work a bikes eng mtn riding the idaho hills? Are you often running near the rev limiter?

In a straight up hill climb, with a 450 motorcrosser and a std MH kit, what sled would it compare too? I understand you can get up most anything sidehilling, but who has run a bike off against an older sled and beaten it?

Can you run all day with a standard tank size and the 3.1 gal spare gas can?

 

[Ausm7499]

How hard does a standard mh kit work a bikes eng mtn riding the idaho hills? Are you often running near the rev limiter?

In a straight up hill climb, with a 450 motorcrosser and a std MH kit, what sled would it compare too? I understand you can get up most anything sidehilling, but who has run a bike off against an older sled and beaten it?

Can you run all day with a standard tank size and the 3.1 gal spare gas can?

I will try to answer some of your questions.

- What I have found with the MH kit is that the amount of work your bike has to do has a lot to do with how your kit is setup. If you have your kit setup well then you don't have to work your bike that hard. A well setup MH kit should climb up on top of the snow and not require full throttle to keep it going. It also has a lot to do with snow conditions just like a sled. Running a MH kit on a bike definitely works the engine a lot harder than you could ever work it on the dirt but I don't think the engine is getting over worked.

- I have only rode with sled's once while on my snobike so I don't really have an answer as to what sled would be comparable in a hillclimb. I would say the snobike might be able to hang with an Arctic Cat M5. The thing is though that you won't be wanting to hillclimb with your MH kit because it's just to much fun playing in the tree's.

- As for fuel consumption you won't have any problem playing all day on 5 gallons of fuel.

 

[suva]

My friend who rides an older RMK 600 136" rode a KTM 525 with a Timbersled kit said it climbed about as well as his sled in deep snow.

 

[Mtn. Muncher]

On a snow bike you do run the engine harder than on dirt but I think it is easier on it then on dirt.
1st it does not run as hot on the water or oil temps
2nd it is not exposed to dirt
3rd you get much better oil flow at higher RPM’s
4th I have never seen any premature engine failures on any bikes due to the snow bike kit.
5th You can put a lot more miles on in one day of back country snow bike riding then on dirt (I do anyway).

As for how powerful they are a 450cc bike will pull about a 30mph track speed. An 800cc sled will pull and hold a 40mph track speed. A 500cc sled will pull a 25 to 30mph track speed. Also keep in mind that a snow bike only weighs 330lbs with gas and gear and does not have any parts to high center on. A sled ways 500 to 600lbs with gas and gear and has a lot more parts dragging through the snow.

 

[teal_210]

I rode with a summit 670 for two days in McCall last weekend, saturday the snow was somewhat powdery, the mtn. Horses seemed to be out climbing him. Sunday was slushy and close to 60°, he seemed to go a little better in those conditions.
Both the bikes and the 670 were climbing out of Wong's bowl without much trouble.

As others have said, I haven't seen any motor related problems. I usually burn 3.5 to 4 gallons per day.

 

[Rush44]

The only thing I've noticed take a hit since snowbiking was my plastics. All the tight tree riding really scratches, cracks, and just generally hammers them. It's a small price to pay for the huge amount of fun they are. When I pick up my KX450 I'm going to run a set of plastics for the winter and separate set for the summer... but I'm just picky about how my bike looks. Most people probably won't care.

 

[retired motoman]

Does not answer your question....but

If your a motorcycle person and ride sleds just to get the handle bar fix, through the winter.....the snowbike is like coming home!! REALLY!

If your not a bike guy then stick with your sled.

Snowbikes are the best thing ever, for the bike people, mabey not so much for the sled guys. The learning curve can be steep if your not a bike rider. If you decide to make the jump to snowbike and put the time into learning how to ride. You will not go back to a 2 ski until you are old!

 

[dirtyoz]

The way I look at it, a snowbike compared to a sled is kind of like a standup jetski compared to a 3 seat couch.
Most sled guys (I just sold my M1000) kind of snub the whole snowbike idea until they ride one. They dont realize that it isnt about highmarking, it's about feeling free to lay it right over and drag the bars, its about its natural ability to sidehill, its about boondocking in the tight trees, its about taking a totally different line to get where you want to go. its about riding down a steep powder hill and then turn and work your way back up without ever going to the bottom and taking another stab at it. Its about wearing yer azz out riding all day and only burning 3-5 gallons of fuel as opposed to 15-20. There is no excuse for a oneskier to not have fresh tracks all day long when the sleds have to ride on the cut up crap.
You will never know until you ride one for a day.

 

[Rush44]

The way I look at it, a snowbike compared to a sled is kind of like a standup jetski compared to a 3 seat couch.
Most sled guys (I just sold my M1000) kind of snub the whole snowbike idea until they ride one. They dont realize that it isnt about highmarking, it's about feeling free to lay it right over and drag the bars, its about its natural ability to sidehill, its about boondocking in the tight trees, its about taking a totally different line to get where you want to go. its about riding down a steep powder hill and then turn and work your way back up without ever going to the bottom and taking another stab at it. Its about wearing yer azz out riding all day and only burning 3-5 gallons of fuel as opposed to 15-20. There is no excuse for a oneskier to not have fresh tracks all day long when the sleds have to ride on the cut up crap.
You will never know until you ride one for a day.

Couldn't have said it better myself. I sold my M1000 to get started too! My old snowmobiling crew thinks I'm a damn fool and that the bike can't do anything fun. How fun it is to disprove them.

Snowbikes are the best thing ever, for the bike people, mabey not so much for the sled guys. The learning curve can be steep if your not a bike rider. If you decide to make the jump to snowbike and put the time into learning how to ride. You will not go back to a 2 ski until you are old!

Not sure I agree with you motoman. I hadn't ridden a dirt bike in over 10 years (and before that it was a couple years on a CR250) and I didn't think the learning curve was steep at all. Sure, that first day SUCKED mostly due to the snow conditions I was learning in, but after that it's just been a breeze to get into. When I look back at all the years it took me to get as good as I was and to progress on a sled.... man, the bike seems like a walk in the park.

 

[Mtn. Muncher]

I take out many first time riders on demo rides. To date I have not found anyone that is unable to ride it like a snow bike should be. The bikes make all the hard stuff easy and you also feel like you are in control all the time while doing it. Our big sell with the snow bikes are to people that have ridden sleds for years and they are peaked out on the capabilities. They go out on a snow bike for one full day and they can tree ride and side hill like Chris Burandt. That is a good feeling if you have never experienced it before and have only seen it on a video to now that it is possible.

 

[TLKDPROD]

...
As for how powerful they are a 450cc bike will pull about a 30mph track speed. An 800cc sled will pull and hold a 40mph track speed. A 500cc sled will pull a 25 to 30mph track speed. Also keep in mind that a snow bike only weighs 330lbs with gas and gear and does not have any parts to high center on. A sled ways 500 to 600lbs with gas and gear and has a lot more parts dragging through the snow.

No big deal here but I feel like I need to add something. "Track speed" is one thing, "how powerful" a machine is, is another thing : the narrower, shorter and less lug of a track you have, the easier it is to be spun fast (and the less likely it is to be able to shovel a considerable amount of snow and create "real ground travelling speed"). It's all good since the machine is lighter and doesn't need as much shoveling action as the heavier sleds. But, eh, I think if we really wanted to speak track speed the proper way we'd have to fit a 12-1/4" wide x 120" long x 2" lug track underneath an 800 and 500 sled and go for a ride with them (or go the other way around and fit a 15" x 154" x 2.25" track on a 450F snowbike). I beleive a fine tuned 800 sled would spin the MH specific track faster than 40 MPH as stated above. It might just end up trenching down to China but the high track speed number would be there anyways! So that sure doesn't say who's gonna get to the top of the hill first either ! Because of this I beleive that everything that's "trackspeed" related should be taken with a grain of salt, especially with such different machines and track sizes.

So as I'm at it I might as well answer the original question you asked PaloosePoo: according to me, "powerwise" a stock 450F Snow-Bike would sit a notch or two below a stock 500cc fan cooled sled or Snow-Hawk. Hope it helps.

Cheers !

 

[PalousePoo]

good input everyone, thanks. A notch or two below the performance of a 500 fan cooled doesn't sound to exciting! Grown up riding bikes, currently ride a 08 yz250f, and a 2011 pro 163. Can't get the snowbike temptation off my mind though.

 

[more snow]

You really can't think in terms of comparing overall performance of the MH snowbike to a 500cc fan cooled sled. In the overall picture, the MH is worlds beyond a 500cc sled. For mountain riding and off trail playing they are phenomenal.

I have been riding sleds for 25years and snowbikes for 2 years. The MH snowbike is very liberating and always and adventure! Just take a chance and get one. You will not be dissapointed.

 

[Robster]

good input everyone, thanks. A notch or two below the performance of a 500 fan cooled doesn't sound to exciting! Grown up riding bikes, currently ride a 08 yz250f, and a 2011 pro 163. Can't get the snowbike temptation off my mind though.

I felt the way you feel 1 1/2 year ago and therefore bought a 2Moto kit. I will NEVER go back to a sled again when counting the fun factor! I love boondocking in the trees and finding a new way from A to B in untracked territory and even with the 2Moto the smile is around the head all the time. As most here knows, the 2Moto is nowhere close to the MH, but I still will never wanna change back to a sled. Looking hard for a buyer for my 2Moto though, to get the MH kit instead. SUPERfun with snowbikes and I have til this day never met a sledguy that dont want a snowbike kit instead after trying it out for an hour or more!

Just my 2 cents

Rob

 

[tomk]

I had to help my dad winterize his sleds today, All that I could think about was, dont have to do this to my bike!!! they are old turd sleds, 92 indy 500 and 96 mxz670, I think i threw my back out turning the stupid things around in the garage, I have a sore arm from pulling the things over to drain the carbs, and I almost suffocated from the smoke! 2 skis suck!

 

[the gman]

hello poo, havent rode with you for a few years. I WAS not a biker, in the dirt anyway, and thought the snow bikes were a fad for some Old Guys up at Priest...Sorry motoman. Anyway I caught the bug and now have two in my Family. They won't replace my m8 but I will always have my bike (530ktm) close.

AS for your ? I cant climb straight up with the sleds, nor would I want to,to much fun zig-zaging up the hill. I have the 121 track on my bike. The 137 track climbs better in the deep but after the snow sets up I don't think it handles as well (fun).

I pack a 2.5 with me and have never ran out of gas. Came close but made it back to the truck

trail manners of these things SUCK, I have Allens mod on a gen two, but off trail makes up for it....next year with Allen new ski may help I hope.

The kit comes with the gen one ski and for me it was a waste as It was too narrow. I was over the bars more than a few times so I would figure on the bigger ski. My Opinion.....

Anyway if you want to try one PM me and you can ride with us and try it out....g......feller

 

[PalousePoo]

Hi Garry, Am at Priest right now! Didn't bring the sled though, too warm and rainy. Just R and R ing and planning summer street bike trips.

 

[more snow]

Regarding the original question about fuel consuption, I am running an 07 WR450 with the Mountain Horse kit. Typically burn a total of 2.5-2.8 gallons on most full day rides. On really deep days 3.5 gallons total. I really love the low cost of operation (no belts, no expensive 2-stroke oil, no major depreciation, very few repairs).

 

[tomk]

Regarding the original question about fuel consuption, I am running an 07 WR450 with the Mountain Horse kit. Typically burn a total of 2.5-2.8 gallons on most full day rides. On really deep days 3.5 gallons total. I really love the low cost of operation (no belts, no expensive 2-stroke oil, no major depreciation, very few repairs).

agreed on the low cost, plus you dont have 10k just sitting in your garage for 6-8 months not being used, if you have a bike already its a no brainer, at most it will cost as much a used sled to buy a kit, if you dont like it you can sell it for no less than 400 less than what you paid, but you wont!

less to fix, bikes are 100 times more durable than sleds