Question on clutching with SLP Pipe Kit on 09 M8 SP 153

[XFIRE800]

Ive got plenty of clutch weights ha that shouldn't be a problem. I might end up just gettting a set of cutler adjustables to make things easier too. Thanks for the help ill try out the stock helix on my first trip and see how i like it. This sled has only been to the mountains once at the end of last year and that was only like 4-7000' and the clutching seemed pretty good. Thanks for the help.

 

[RickM]

Still need 100 RPM and cant get it.

Well Im still trying to get about 100 more RPM. recap, with the cat 68 weights,speedwerx 122/340 primary H5 spring, shift assist,and 40/36 helix and slp pipe kit on 09 M8 sp 153.

I can pull 8000 on hard pack, or in the powder. Im NOT getting the drive belt to go clear to the top on my primary clutch, (Belt is fairly new). Works good boondocking and climbing, just cant get 8100 or 8200. I want to keep the heavier weights (68) to make it pull hard at 11000 feet. When I ran the 64 cat weights, it didnt pull as hard and lost track speed.

Im wondering now if a little more compression on the driven clutch spring would help gain the RPM.

I need input from you clutching gurus. RickM

 

[skidooboy]

rick, you are generally better off to gain or lose rpms with the primary, rather than change the secondary. you are robbing peter to pay paul. you will be giving up performance somewhere in the clutch curve (upshift or downshift) if you free the secondary, or hold the shift back.

i would find a primary spring, with more total force. if you could find a 120-130'ish start and a 350-360ish total force should give you your rpms you are looking for. or you could grind away alittle off the backside of the tip of the 68 gram weight to make them, say 67 grams.

custom grinding blocks are available to trim the arms and then you just weigh them on the gram scale to get them all equal. ski

 

[Frostbite]

Rick, I'm certainly no guru but..................since you are using the highest total force sping I can think of (yet, I swore I saw a 360 finish rate). Let me get my chart.............

Oh yes, I see Super Torquer sells a 170/360 spring. Pretty high engagement.
Goodwin sells a 140/360. That might be a GREAT spring.
Aaen sells a 150/380. Wow! I bet you could throw clutch weight at that spring!


You can also use spring shims. They were really made for bumping up your engagement RPM a bit but, they also will give you a little more RPM on top. On Yamahas they specify a maximum of three shims can be used. That is because you don't want to create coil bind by stuffing more material into the area the spring is designed to compress into than will fit.

This is my own recommendation. There are probably better ideas out there but, I have also been able to pull more RPM by tightening up the torsion of my secondary springs. You may be able to do that also with a stiffer non torsional secondary spring. I know someone will say "tune your shift speed with the primary clutch" but, when you just need a few more RPM, I'll take them where I can find them.

Also of note:

I gained RPM by going to Blue Marble oil in my wife's 99 phazer (300 RPM). Go figure?

I also gained RPM by porting the track on my RX-1M (200 RPM), spins easier, I guess). It also now will coast down a hill where before it wouldn't move on a slope.

I hope this helps.

 

[edgey]

Confused

I'm running a 09 M8 153 std with the slp pipe kit with slp blue/pink (140/340) primary spring 65g cat weights in the sec stock orange spring shift asst. 42/36 helix with rock rollers at 11,000 only pulling 78-7900 rpm.

Picked up some 63g cat weights I'm going to try this weekend but what I don't get is that it seems your pulling more weight than me Rick with about the same setup???? I would like to run some adjustable weights and not put any weight in the tip because I think a weight with a lite tip would work great in these M's

 

[iluv2fly]

My performance package on my 09 M8 continually impresses me. At 9K the other day I was pulling 8200rpm with 74gram MTX which are like a cat 70 and 160/310 primary spring. With the slp porting I can pull 2-3 more grams of weight over just the slp pipe at a higher rpm. The thing runs great.

 

[RickM]

Edgey------Iluv2fly

Edgey setup
" 09 M8 153 std with the slp pipe kit with slp blue/pink (140/340) primary spring 65g cat weights in the sec stock orange spring shift asst. 42/36 helix with rock rollers at 11,000 only pulling 78-7900 rpm."

RickM setup
09 M8 153 sp with slp pipe kit, speedwerx white./red ( 125/340 H5) primaryspring, 68 cat weights. stk orange spring with shift asst, 40/36 helix with rock rollers at 11000, pulling 8000 in powder or on hard pack road.

Iluv2fly setup
160/310 primary spring, 74 Mtx , 8200 Rpm 9000 feet, but running slp porting.

Iluv2fly may be running the best performance, but i chose not to shim spider for mtx weights. and not port cylinders to have to run control box.

I test ran cat 65 weights and lost track speed, edgey and I are almost identical in setup, I weigh ready to ride at 200 lbs. slp measures their springs different than cat & speedwerx do. that may be the difference in RPM for edgey. I may have to drop to a 67 cat weight to gain the 100 RPM or take a little off the tip of the 68's. i just like to load the motor as hard as i can. my M8 is running really well but I would like to see what it really can do at the RPM SLP says to run it at. Trying to split hairs right now. Thanks for the help
RickM

 

[edgey]

I'm going to try the 63's first see how they work and them I'm going to start changing primary springs. I'll post my findings after the weekend. I luv the sled but getting mad that I can't get my clutching dialed in I had it working pretty good last spring but then I put the shift asst in and that made me lose some rpm been chasing it ever since can you put the secendary together wrong???

 

[RickM]

put together wrong --NOT

dont know of any way to put together wrong. when i put my shift assist in i removed one black nylon spacer, tried to keep same spring compression rates. When did you change the helix angle? at same time or not.
Your running a 44/36 i think, im running a 40/36,
man we are really close on setups, so let me know your outcome. Mine is running like a rocket, just want more, ha. RickM

 

[tm8]

i can not pull 68gr wts at 9 to 10000 ft let alone 11000ft and i have tried every spring under the sun it seems now granted i can make it hit target rpms but it will not sustain through the whole climb it bounce around a couple hundred rpm depending on load hitting old tracks etc. And from my testing a 44 degree helix is to steep 40 is pretty good on a stock sled with the pipe. Edgy try a little less spring and see what happens i would think that 65gr wts would get you very close to your target maybe the spring is fighting you and for what its worth im not to big of a fan of the shift assist bearing either i dont belive they are needed.

 

[edgey]

Mine's a 42-36 not 44 but I think your right I think the primary spring is some of the problem.

 

[Icedog]

I'm finding that I seem to be able to pull alot more primary weight than most guys are posting in their set-ups. After I installed my SLP kit I ended up with the SLP 140/300 and 73.75g weights and this held 8000 RPM on the trail and climbing at 4500-8000'. I'm just going to drop down to 72.25g weights now and see if that gets me to 8100 RPM. I'm also running my RKT secondary 1 hole from the softest setting.

 

[Marble]

I ride my 09 M8 153, SLP single pipe only at 500-2800ft with no fuel box. My plug is brown/tan, just perfectly, I don't take a constant RPM at midrange (6200-6800rpm) more that 3 sec. It's save! I run with 77g with stock clutch (yellow/white, Orange, 44/40degree)

 

[RickM]

Icedog

after reading your post, and spending time yesterday talking clutching with a guy that really knows clutching, I decided to throw in my set of cat 70 gr. weights along with the 122/340 speedwerx spring and give it a shot.

I have been testing different weights and springs, was happy with the cat 68's and speedwerx spring last weekend, was pulling 8k at 11k feet. they all say throw more weight at it, so ill try it and see how the M8 with slp pipe kit likes it. The fellow yesterday told me not to try and run the belt clear to the top of the primary clutch. Ill see what happens. RickM

 

[Gvrunyn]

I would like to post my two cents on here if people don't mind. I am running and 08 M8 162 with the Power Claw trk. Full SLP pipe setup and a high flow airhorn in the airbox.. I tried all the Cat weight setups 70's 68's ground down the 70's ground down some 72's trying the whole time to find the best setup. In the end i visited with SLP tech dept. and they talked me into the MTX weights. When first installed with the old belt the belt to sheave clearance was good but after a blown belt and the need for a new one i had to shim the spider. Don't be fooled it does take some work but with a little time you will be able to achieve an awesome setup. The Shift curve of the weight makes it that much better than a cat weight. Pulls hard like the heavier cat weights on the bottom but still allows for the desired peak rpms we are all looking for. I am running a team green (140-330) spring in the primary with a gold D&D (110-320) spring in the secondary shift assist and rock rollers. Stock 36 helix. This setup has proved to be very good for me. Alot of tuning and i am finally happy. I ride at 7-11,000 feet

 

[Icedog]

after reading your post, and spending time yesterday talking clutching with a guy that really knows clutching, I decided to throw in my set of cat 70 gr. weights along with the 122/340 speedwerx spring and give it a shot.

I have been testing different weights and springs, was happy with the cat 68's and speedwerx spring last weekend, was pulling 8k at 11k feet. they all say throw more weight at it, so ill try it and see how the M8 with slp pipe kit likes it. The fellow yesterday told me not to try and run the belt clear to the top of the primary clutch. Ill see what happens. RickM

Let me know how it works. Mine seemed to pull RPM with the lighter weights, I just wasn't really going anywhere. Now it actually pulls RPM, and gains track speed while I'm climbing.

 

[RickM]

Gvrunyn --- Icedog

thanks for both of your posts, I bought the set of MTX 71 gr. weights from slp when i did the pipe kit, just been trying to tune with cat weights so id didnt have to shim spider, if i dont get happy results trying to tune with cat weights, ill have to shim and use the MTX.

Gvrunyn-- what weight MTX and rivets are u running at hight elevation?
thanks RickM

 

[Icedog]

I just grind and balance cat weights. Not too interested in shimming my spider either.

 

[Gvrunyn]

RickM I am using the 71g weights with a 2g rivet in the hole closest to the heel! Like i said before it doesn't matter how much you grind on the stock cat weights you still cannot change the profile(Shift curve) of the weight!

 

[Icedog]

Like i said before it doesn't matter how much you grind on the stock cat weights you still cannot change the profile(Shift curve) of the weight!

Yep; that is a fact. I do think that the optimum SLP weight set up would likely be a bit better than the optimum cat weight set up. But I had a bunch of sets of weights in my tool box, and a bunch of time to kill. I'm sure that there is a bunch of us, all running different set-ups, that would end up swapping marks all day long.