pricing getting a little outmof control ?

[WaterKid]

Does anyone else think timbersled pricing is getting a bit high ! I understand supply and demand but that can be controled. 6k for something with no motor is getting to a robbery pricing.

Also. There just isnt that much material or design to justify that price. Are we paying for poor business management or just fat wallets.

Sure wish a big player would get into the market and get the costs down and fast.

This sport can be explosive but it cant be controled by one and only company for the sport to really take off and inovation run wild.... its just too bad they make such a good product.

Anybody else have an alternative before i eat crap (from my wife) for.a year for dumping 6k+ ?

 

[Uncle si]

I'd rather pay Timbersled $6k than Snowest $15.

It is worth it. Will a new bike be $8k for everything in ten years? Maybe. I am really grateful to everyone at timbersled that made these kits happen, and I hope my hard-earned money is helping to make them rich.

lot of folks pay much more for a snowmobile that does not perform well in the mountains.

 

[MURFDOG]

Totally agree with Uncle Si, you should reap the rewards of your time and ingenuity.
If I want something that I can't or don't want to build myself, I'll pay the price.

 

[capulin overdrive]

Yes they're too darned high, just like most everything else.



40 to 60k pickups, 8 to 11k bikes, etc. etc.

 

[Tride]

So, how many hours (including r&d) and testing do you think it takes to make a TS? Or a KTM 500 XCW? If I had all the parts in hand (and was a professional welder) I can't see it taking less than 10 hours to fabricate the kit. Even with "mass" production (750 kits last year, right?) Is it going to be 1/2 that? Then parts. Then overhead. Then R&D and testing. I'm sure they get insurance for free.

Even your $10,000 KTM and $12,000 sled are low-margin items. If you can figure out how to make any of these items for significantly less (even 5%), let us know. You'll be a rich man.

Edit-- looking at the kit and the inches of weld, my hour numbers are way low.

 

[M5-]

Yep no doubt they are expensive. For a hard part IMO there is currently a good margin in the product but I don't begrudge them their profit as they did all the work to develop the product. From a manufacturing standpoint they could be made for 1/3 the price in China and sold accordingly but where does that leave everyone? With a cheap purchase price with no warranty or service.

Just in general everything is getting outrageous, I had an arborist come out to my house and trim some big tall trees yesterday, it cost a grand for 6 hours but he had a truck and a chipper, workers he had to climb the trees etc etc. I was thinking the whole time that doesn't look too hard, but reality by the time I rented a chipper blah blah blah I wouldn't have saved a cent plus I helped keep somebody working so think of the TS purchase as your own personal stimulus program. LOL

M5

 

[Rush44]

One thing I've noticed that the used market is starting to drop in price a little. Sure, you see people listing 14 ST's for $4700, but it doesn't seem like they are moving as much. As more people get into the sport and more kits are turned over I think it will become a little more affordable to buy used and upgrade parts if need be.

USA company, USA assembly and fab, USA support, employing Americans, R&D, free demos, extending warranty support past the original 1 year declaration, a company that actually PICKS UP THE PHONE... these are the things that are worth paying for. Is the kit expensive? Yea, I would think so... but truthfully with a bike it's the same cost as buying a new sled these days unless you go all out on a $10,000 KTM (and I'm sorry, but no dirt bike should cost $10,000). There are ALWAYS holdovers available somewhere in the Western states where you can save a couple grand at least if new is important to you.

If Timbersled didn't make an awesome product they wouldn't be able to sell it.

 

[wwillf01]

At the end of the day something is worth what someone will pay..... I think a company that gives good support and has a good rep has the ability to charge a premium.... Look at any company out there Nike, Apple and so on... I know if you are not making 30 to 40 percent on a product it's not worth having a business...


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

 

[Mtn. Muncher]

Thank You to all that help plead our case.

I won't take this as a insult but as a great opportunity to explain the short version of how this works. I will assume most who are commenting on how expensive this sport is do not own businesses and do not ride snowmobiles.

Timbersled products are 100% made in the USA using US made equipment and US and Canadian materials and parts. We build year round without stopping, with a complete staff that all make respectable US wages with good benefits. We R and D year round and are making fantastic improvements to our product line every year. Yes, we continue to cut manufacturing costs with added volume but we also continue to add more and more standard options and custom features to our kits that you the customer would normally have to go buy. The part you do not see is how much up front money we spend to do this. We have been able to grow each year all while continuing to evolve our products that helps our customers have a better riding experience. At the end of the year we are lucky to have made a small profit that Uncle Sam then takes 50% of. If it was any easier than that, everyone would be doing it. Many have tried and many have failed. Any one that has ever been to our manufacturing facility will understand this and will know just how understated my words are.

The best and most unfair thing we have is not that we have a money tree out back. LOL. But simply that, "this is our job and it’s the best dam job I could ever think of having".

Cheers.... and hope to see more of the growing snow biking family on the snow next year.

Allen at Timbersled

 

[snowbikekits.com]

If you don't want to buy a new kit a used kit is an excellent option. They may not be the latest and greatest but they are still a lot of fun!

Much better value than a $60k truck! lol

 

[Hawkster]

It's called what the market will bear , plain and simple . Suck it up , maybe your donkeys will be able to keep up with a race horse some day.

 

[more snow]

The fact that Timbersled continues to improve and innovate even when they dont face any significant competition is really quite impressive! Keep the great pproducts coming. I love snowbiking.

 

[Jimb]

Want to play you have to pay, if TS continues to develop the product I'm ok with the 6k, they've put a lot of work into building something that actually does what they say... That can't be said for much of the aftermarket.

 

[Blaser]

I'd like to thank all of you who've stepped up in defense of Timbersled on this topic.
Thank you.

Our facilities are always open for tours, for any who would like to come get a taste of what it takes to build our products to the level of quality we strive for. We have an incredible team of hard working Idahoans who take extreme pride in every weld, every cut, every bend- and it takes a lot more to build these kits than one would think.

We also build everything in-house that we possibly can, and locally outsource only what we cannot do ourselves. We do this for 2 main reasons- to absolutely control the quality of our products, and to keep and create more local jobs. Even our new injection molding partner is local.

We are also continually looking for ways to lower prices and increase value. If you analyze retail prices for the last 3 seasons you'll see what I mean. I encourage any with questions to estimate the cost of each upgrade listed on our Year to Year Changes page and compare that to the retail price for each year.

When those that Snow Checked or bought a new 2015 kit actually see their kits, and then ride them- they'll quickly realize we upgraded them even more than what we advertised. This is a fact we are very proud of.
We did increase the price this year by $100, but we included a $135 gas can, built in rack, and our new ratcheting strap. I could go on and on about the other additional costs of upgrades that we did not pass on.

We're also working hard to lower the cost of riding. Through economies of scale we are able to manufacture and source at lower costs. We are passing this on to our customers- rather than taking the additional profits. Over the next few months you'll see costs cut in half on some parts- like spindles, chain case covers or our new ski skaggs. Skaggs were $100 each, now they're only $50. Or the new bearing update kit- for $150 you'll get a slew of parts including a new drive shaft (which normally retails for alone for $170.

We also encourage all your feedback- both good and bad; because we feel that challenges provide opportunity for growth and change.
Keep it coming!
Blaser

 

[the gman]

The cost of the kit isn't as bad as the cost of the donuts I have to buy every time I show up. you also have to realize how much longer the season is now. I would have had my sled put away in the middle of March, and we are still riding, and enjoying it on the bikes. Hay blaser, Canada, this Friday, Saturday. The 3hundy is a kick!!! Keep up the good work

 

[WaterKid]

Talk price and everyone has input

First of all there is no question that TS is the best product out there.

With that said, Regarding keeping the costs down I am disappointed that they sell out every year. That says to me that they may not be focusing on production methods as well as they are on the technology.

There business model needs to change from a development company into a production company.

Most companies want a JIT production scheduling with limited inventory but that is hard to do when you have a developing customer base and you need to get them in as many hands as possible, thus growing the sport. Until another player with deeper pockets come in then we are subject to price fixing and/ or controlling the supply part of the 'supply and demand'.

Small runs cost more, as I said they are the best out there so far so keeping the inventory moving shouldn't be a problem as long as they are available and have a cost that everyone should be able to afford. Dropping the price by just $1500 would open the door to a whole lot more people, imo.

 

[CATSLEDMAN1]

oh so cheap

the last three springs this subject came up I posted:

nobody is getting rich building these tings

after dan and I have built our last three bikes, call it very low production, materials/welding/machine work and cheap tracks, the cost is higher than one would guess, hate to say it, nobody making big money in sandpoint.

scares me alittle to think one small company is respondsible for the sport, MH goes down, sports over for awhile for most.

makes Alan worth a lot more alive than..........well you know the alternative.

 

[Jimb]

I'd rather pay Timbersled $6k than Snowest $15.

Seriously are you that stupid?

 

[WaterKid]

Agree, Only one decent player

You hit the nail on the head. Sport being dependent on only one small company is not a good thing.

If I were them (big fantasy). I would think much bigger... licence part of the business to a large cycle manufacturer to to get these produced in masses. Keeping the development end locked in so they have some control over the direction of the sport. It takes money to make money.

Some times its best to farm out production to those that can take it to the next level. OR even better yet invite the original owners of husaberg or other successful manufacturing start ups how to grow faster.

 

[lonespin]

TB sled all terrain wheel kit

Awesome product,but remember,you didn’t build that!

Can’t believe you can stay in business with the fraud in chief you have.

TB sleds are easily worth the asking price,just don’t know how you can do it in America ,mega taxes,EPA,etc,,

I love my TB sled,it’s changed everything about riding in the mountains,love love love it.