New Timbersled kit owner, looking for the right bike.

[SlickO]

Hello, Im new on here. I just got a used 15 timbersled LT kit with KTM fit kit, and now looking for the right bike. I have never been on a snowbike but from riding the sled last year I figured out that fighting a heavy sled on a steep sidehill is not my style.

I have been reading a lot on bike selection and have searched craigslist for a bike. I ride St Helens 3-8K feet most of the time so all kinds of snow from 3' powder to wet and heavy, mostly wet and heavy.

I have it narrowed down to a few models and would like to ask for input on any.

My perfect bike wold be a new KTM 500, unfortunately I cant justify spending 10K on a bike right now.

Used KTM/Husky 450 sxf 2013-2015 I found around 5k asking price. I like that it has electric start injected and a close ratio transmission, what concerns me is does it have enough power for a LT kit in wet heavy snow, and how is the stator for lights and accessories.

Used YZ450F 2010-2013 found for around 4k asking price. No electric start, enough power? Intake packing with snow?

Used KX450F Same as the yamaha, 2013 and up has the air forks are they usable or must be changed for snow?

Used KTM 500/525/505 carbed models 2000-2012 found a few around the 3.5-4k. My main concern with it is that I would not like the carb and would be selling it in a season or two. How does it compare powerwise to injected 450.

Thank you, I have learned a lot from this forum.

 

[wwillf01]

If it was me I would go any of your fuel injected options... Newest and in the best condition you can afford... Any will have enough power to push it... I would freshen the top end on anything you get... I am all about e start and am looking forward to it this year


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[Rush44]

All of those bikes will run an LT just fine so don't worry about that.

The really good YZ's start at 2014 and the 2013 can be modified to run like a 14 but you'll have some work to do (and some coin to spend, nullifying any savings by buying an older bike). The 2013-2015 KTMs are great years with not a lot of modifications that need to be made. The KX's are great bikes too and the air forks can work if you don't slack on monitoring your air pressure between big temperature changes.

Pretty much buy any of the FI bikes for a good price and you'll have a great winter. None of those FI's will leave you at the bottom of the hill while your friends stomp you. The differences between them aren't that drastic. More personal preference and guys trying to squeeze every HP out of them.

 

[SlickO]

Thank you for your replies.

Rush, I see your bike is 15 FC450, what are the must have mods on it? Thermostat, intake mods? How do you have it set up and is there anything not to do on that bike. I have been watching one for a while we just cant agree on a price.

 

[XP_posterchild]

I got a 15' LT kit last season, first time on a snowbike. I put the kit on a 13' CRF 450. Plenty of power to turn that LT and I've brought it all the way up to around 12k feet in Colorado pow. No issues running wise. Cold starts are a bugger though. Takes many many kicks in the am when it sits out in 10 degree or less outside over night. I've been searching for a block heater or some way to warm up the engine. I used a mapgas torch on the pipe and engine and that worked great though. (A trick I figured out on getting an etec engine started when it was -30 out). E-start would be wonderful! Pretty pumped the 17' CRF's will have E-start on the RX and optional on the R. I've always rode red but was really thinking about a KTM because of E-start. Definitely prefer FI over carbed.

 

[wwillf01]

I got a 15' LT kit last season, first time on a snowbike. I put the kit on a 13' CRF 450. Plenty of power to turn that LT and I've brought it all the way up to around 12k feet in Colorado pow. No issues running wise. Cold starts are a bugger though. Takes many many kicks in the am when it sits out in 10 degree or less outside over night. I've been searching for a block heater or some way to warm up the engine. I used a mapgas torch on the pipe and engine and that worked great though. (A trick I figured out on getting an etec engine started when it was -30 out). E-start would be wonderful! Pretty pumped the 17' CRF's will have E-start on the RX and optional on the R. I've always rode red but was really thinking about a KTM because of E-start. Definitely prefer FI over carbed.

I am going to try this from Arctic cat.... It looks like the ticket


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[XP_posterchild]

I am going to try this from Arctic cat.... It looks like the ticket


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Nice!!! I might have to try that! Fist time I've seen that.

 

[wwillf01]

Even thinking of adding a plug to the back of my truck for the long cold drives... Cheaper than a heated trailer but o have the same issue with my bikes staying outside in a carport...


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[Rush44]

Thank you for your replies.

Rush, I see your bike is 15 FC450, what are the must have mods on it? Thermostat, intake mods? How do you have it set up and is there anything not to do on that bike. I have been watching one for a while we just cant agree on a price.

Must haves are going to differ from person to person based on comfort level.... but I think must haves are bark busters, thermostat (thermobob is great), some type of skid plate, bar risers if you are over 6ft tall, upgraded fork springs/valving, and some light intake mods like gutting the airbox so snow can fall out or doing the TSS style intake. On the KTM/Husky bikes you need to re-route the crankcase breather so it doesn't shoot into your airbox anymore... just disconnect it from the box and hang it up high with a zip tie to the frame with the tube pointed down to the ground.

Nice things to have that aren't mandatory are footpegs, Cyclops LED headlight, engine cover like the PST Engine Jacket or SXS sideplate (sometimes mandatory depending on climate and snowfall), fuel controller, heated grips, seat upgrade.

Like with any snowmobile, the list can be endless if your pockets are deep. As long as you get the must-haves done your season will rock. Shred it!

 

[GlennRMK]

The 450s have more power then the 500 and a longer rev range.

The 500 is a lot easier to ride and more mellow on the trail. The 500 is probably the best combo dirt/snow bike.

Nothing is better then a moto 450 on snow but nothing is worse on technical trails either

 

[AZ800]

Rush, curious what sets apart the '14 yz450s. Noticeable more hp?
Just asking as I have a '11 model and everything seems pretty spot on and I don't keep up with all the new bike specs.
To the op, fuel injected for sure and in my limited experience, stick with a 450 track bike for the close ratio trans.
I'm used to riding dry snow save for the lat couple years and I'm amazed how on a bike which has way less power than any real sled, how much the wet snow sucks the power out of my bike. Feels like I loose a whole gear with what the bike will pull between a super wet snow day and lighter snow.
Never had it in good champagne powder. Only various compressive strengths of cascade concrete! Lol
E start is a luxury I'd like to have, but on a budget there would be several other things I'd prioritize before Estart.
With a efi bike, 9 of 10 times it starts with a couple kicks. Plus lighter weight is better right?
Must haves for me were a skid plate, good spare fuel tank, storage bag, 1 ice scratcher (had one spare laying around and it works as good as 2, haha), thermostat and hand guards.
Haven't used the skid plate yet, it's there to keep Murphy's law from catching up! I've banged the crap out of the chain case and my feet, so a rock is destined for the crank case some day....

 

[1Pete]

I hope it's not rude to jump in here. I just sold my sled and plan on snowbike this winter. I'm 67, good shape, long time dirt bike rider. Looking at the new KTM 500 EXC-F and 120 TS. Still like summer trail riding and wondering if the 350 EXC-F has enough power for Snowbike, seems like it might make a better trail bike. I know from sledding about horsepower and deep Cascade snow. Thanks for any helpful suggestions.

 

[Rush44]

Rush, curious what sets apart the '14 yz450s. Noticeable more hp?
Just asking as I have a '11 model and everything seems pretty spot on and I don't keep up with all the new bike specs.
To the op, fuel injected for sure and in my limited experience, stick with a 450 track bike for the close ratio trans.
I'm used to riding dry snow save for the lat couple years and I'm amazed how on a bike which has way less power than any real sled, how much the wet snow sucks the power out of my bike. Feels like I loose a whole gear with what the bike will pull between a super wet snow day and lighter snow.
Never had it in good champagne powder. Only various compressive strengths of cascade concrete! Lol
E start is a luxury I'd like to have, but on a budget there would be several other things I'd prioritize before Estart.
With a efi bike, 9 of 10 times it starts with a couple kicks. Plus lighter weight is better right?
Must haves for me were a skid plate, good spare fuel tank, storage bag, 1 ice scratcher (had one spare laying around and it works as good as 2, haha), thermostat and hand guards.
Haven't used the skid plate yet, it's there to keep Murphy's law from catching up! I've banged the crap out of the chain case and my feet, so a rock is destined for the crank case some day....

MXA does a good job of telling you the differences between 2013 and 2014 on the YZ450F. Take a read and you'll see it was almost a brand new bike for 2014.

http://motocrossactionmag.com/bike-tests/mxas-2014-yamaha-yz450f-motocross-test-when-yamaha-first-went-backwards-they-got-it-backwards-but-now-they-are-straightening-it-out

 

[n16ht5]

I hope it's not rude to jump in here. I just sold my sled and plan on snowbike this winter. I'm 67, good shape, long time dirt bike rider. Looking at the new KTM 500 EXC-F and 120 TS. Still like summer trail riding and wondering if the 350 EXC-F has enough power for Snowbike, seems like it might make a better trail bike. I know from sledding about horsepower and deep Cascade snow. Thanks for any helpful suggestions.

I live in WA ride the cascade concrete. friend ran a 350 for one season and got a 450 ktm next. not enough power. shoot me a PM if yiu want

 

[RMKcowboy]

I ran a 2012 KX450 with a 15 ST kit last winter, no complaints. 2012 was the last year for the conventional springs forks for the KX FYI, that was a nice setup. Sold the KX and running a 16 YZ 450FX on the same kit this year.

 

[SlickO]

So, still looking, did not realize that it would take this long. Found a 2012 YZ450F, everything seemed good but the stator is weak and did not find any options to upgrade.

Now I narrowed it down to ether ktm/husky/berg 500 wide ratio or 450 sxf. Read a few reviews and most people say that the 450 is a better option for a snow bike. I know this is beating a dead horse but how much of a difference is there between the two when pushing a LT? Is the stator on the 450 strong enough for lights and street legal kit? Found a 500 xcw that has almost everything that I need but reading the comparisons people are saying that its slow vs the 450. Also have a line on husky 450, but its completely stock and the price is almost identical. Another thing is making it street legal would be a big plus for me, but ultimately snow performance is key.

Its getting close, I can see snow on the mountain

 

[Norma Stitz]

I toiled a bit over the stator output issue for a while but it seems that you could go external battery for any lighting or glove needs if that was a deal breaker. Almost easier anyway. But, I've never ridden a snow bike so I am not in a position to give advice.

 

[dirtrebel]

So, still looking, did not realize that it would take this long. Found a 2012 YZ450F, everything seemed good but the stator is weak and did not find any options to upgrade.

Now I narrowed it down to ether ktm/husky/berg 500 wide ratio or 450 sxf. Read a few reviews and most people say that the 450 is a better option for a snow bike. I know this is beating a dead horse but how much of a difference is there between the two when pushing a LT? Is the stator on the 450 strong enough for lights and street legal kit? Found a 500 xcw that has almost everything that I need but reading the comparisons people are saying that its slow vs the 450. Also have a line on husky 450, but its completely stock and the price is almost identical. Another thing is making it street legal would be a big plus for me, but ultimately snow performance is key.

Its getting close, I can see snow on the mountain

The fuel injected yz stator puts out 135 watts, thats way more power than a fuel injected ktm / husky. Ive run a '12 yz for 3 seasons and can run hotgrips (the cheap power hungry ones) and a cyclops 630 light no problem, both at the same time if needed. I cant find the spec right now but I remember seeing it when I got my bike. The ktm 450 sx-f only really makes enough juice for the fuel pump, and it trickle charges the battery for restarting, that's why guys running grips and stuff right off the battery always kill the battery. The 500 and w models are better because they have a lighting circuit stock. I'm not saying the yz is the best but as far as electrical output goes they rule.

 

[wwillf01]

The fuel injected yz stator puts out 135 watts, thats way more power than a fuel injected ktm / husky. Ive run a '12 yz for 3 seasons and can run hotgrips (the cheap power hungry ones) and a cyclops 630 light no problem, both at the same time if needed. I cant find the spec right now but I remember seeing it when I got my bike. The ktm only really makes enough juice for the fuel pump, and it trickle charges the battery for restarting, that's why guys running grips and stuff right off the battery always kill the battery. I'm not saying the yz is the best but as far as electrical output goes they rule.

I know for a 14 sxf the most I could get was 70 watt from trail tech


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[SlickO]

dirtrebel, thanks. Now this puts the yz back into the mix. Do you know if it is possible to add a street legal kit, its hard to get a definite answer on some forums I read that there is no way of upgrading the stator and that it uses all the power for the fuel pump and injection.