New Pro: Replace pistons now or later

[skibreeze]

I just got my '12 back together today with RK Tec's pistons and head. I jumped on my cousin's '11 Pro and it really is amazing how much different the 2 sleds feel at idle. I can't wait to get it on the snow. There will be some pics later.

 

[black swan]

I just got my '12 back together today with RK Tec's pistons and head. I jumped on my cousin's '11 Pro and it really is amazing how much different the 2 sleds feel at idle. I can't wait to get it on the snow. There will be some pics later.

mmm....yeh, that's what all us conspiracy-types are saying........those piston are crazy light and go figure they actually fit the jugs....


.....

since there's nothing wrong w/ the oem pistons, who wants to buy ours??

free shipping?

 

[skibreeze]

Yeah, 2 brand new take out pistons for sale! I have some more seasoned ones if someone's interested. With only 2,000 miles, I'm sure somebody will say that they are good for another 2-3,000 easy. Who's the first to put their money where their mouth is?

 

[knifedge]

There are so many Pro's that have had "ZERO" problems.

Come on guys, why can't you just ride the sled until the warranty is up and then tear down the engine. Let Polaris deal with the worn out parts during the warranty.

I have been riding Poo for 15 years now and have never had to do anything to any engine besides freshing up the top ends. On my trail sleds - every 5K miles. On my Mountain sleds - every 2.5K miles.

I own a 2012 with 3000 miles. I tore into the topend and found that the pistons were sloppy and rings were shot. Replaced with some top notch pistons with the proper fit and Wha-La, I'm good to go for another long tour.

I'm huge into the maintenance of sleds and where you store them. Out of these engine failures, do we know what maintenance was done and where they were stored? Was there proper summer storage maintenance done? Storage prep, I believe plays a huge part in well running sled. If one bearing has a small spot of rust, well you will find out soon what happens. Rust only spreads.

My pistons out of the 12 were the worst I have ever seen. I do believe Poo could do much better engineering, but I think they are making the engine on the sloppy end for a reason. How many riders "Really Take Care" of the sled like they should. I have seen a lot of used sled that look like they went to war. Does everyone do proper warm-ups, no. Do people worry about the "Cold Shock", no. Why do you think these engines are on the sloppy end? They need to look at who is riding them!!

All of my sleds look brand new, even with 12K miles on them. If the outside (including engine compartment) is clean like the day it was new, I bet the inside of the engine looks the same. The owner takes care of his equipment and spends many of hours in the garage with the sled.

If you were wondering, here is a picture of my pistons. Does anyone else have pistons with 3K miles on them looking like this? I bet you do, but there was still not failure.

The one on the left is from the 2012 Poo.

--With that much blowby, pistons look like they have 10k hard miles on them. It must be Polaris version of EGR emissions -- exhaust gas recirculation

 

[beamslayer]

Well pj8556 I hope you can make heads or tails out of all this because I sure can not. Some do some don't . Yous your gut feelings .
Oregonsledder I was just busting your chops it is hard to show sarcasim on a key board .
I am waiting on my cylinders and looking forward to getting it back together and hope it snows alot .

 

[briand]

The question I keep asking myself is should I replace my brand new perfectly fine pistons (but may not be after a season) now with the RKtek pistons that are said to be more durable, increasing reliability and produce more power with less weight and improved porting.

Or, run the stock pistons, turn up oiler, add oil to fuel. For added performance: put on an aftermarket cheater head, can and some clutching (team tied with carls clutch kit) and retain my warranty. Monitor compression and performance, check pistons and cylinders best I can through exhaust ports, and replace, if necessary, at the end of this season (all the while retaining my warranty in case something does go wrong, but also risking losing a piston and/or a cylinder and causing more secondary severe/expensive damage.

We do not know the extent of the changes to the '13 motor (thicker cylinder skirts, better crank, other changes that we may not know of, although pistons and clearances are said to be unchanged) or if they will make a difference. I am hoping they will. I do think the problems with the pistons have been blown out of proportion a bit, but that is not to say that I dont recognize there is a problem.

The question is, tear down a brand new motor under warranty without even riding it yet. Or wait it out, see what happens, risk it, save time and money now, and re-evaluate and possibly upgrade later...

Advice, ideas, comments, plans all appreciated

Since your sled is new why not just ride it. If you are worried about it maybe every few rides check the compression in your cylinders and write down the numbers and see if it starts to drop or very somewhat. If they do start to drop or very then this might be a good time to think about taking it in or do the tear down yourself. I bought mine 12 last year in Feb and when brand new, I was concerned with all the failures that were happening so this is what i did. When my machine was brought home I did compression test before I had made a mile on the sled and my readings were about 122 in both cylinders. After 2 rides and about 200 miles i check my compression again this fall and it was 120 in one and 109 in the other so i decided to tear mine apart and found flaking rings. Now compresion test don't always reveal this but it can help. I am one that had a failure but my dealer has sold lots of 11 and 12 pros and has had only 2 with mine with problems and i think he has sold nearly 300 so take it for what its worth. It sure feels sh**y to have a sled go down and I know you can get caught up believing that there can be a high failure rate. Now as more miles get put on there could be a increase but I guess we'll just have to wait and see.

 

[Old Scud-doo]

I know I said it earlier and so did many others but I'll do it again. The 2012 didn't show much failure because of low snow. They didn't get ridden like the 2011's did. Sorry, but I would guess that 50% of all the untouched Pro's will need at least pistons and rings by season's end. Never saw or heard of anyone in my area that lost a skirt. Most I spoke too had flaking rings and bad pistons.

Great chassis, unfortunetly it has an unreliable motor.

BTW: I had 1100+ on my 11 and it was half way in into last season before I figured out what my problem was. 2 months of trying "inexpensive" things. I would guess a lot of 12's will start showing problems around January.

Don't you think you should be able to get 3000 miles out of an engine? I sure do! I love my dealer and the chassis so I won't ride yellow or green but if either of them come up with something that handles like a Pro, it would start to get tough to choose.

 

[jeepin270]

I know I said it earlier and so did many others but I'll do it again. The 2012 didn't show much failure because of low snow. They didn't get ridden like the 2011's did. Sorry, but I would guess that 50% of all the untouched Pro's will need at least pistons and rings by season's end. Never saw or heard of anyone in my area that lost a skirt. Most I spoke too had flaking rings and bad pistons.

Great chassis, unfortunetly it has an unreliable motor.

BTW: I had 1100+ on my 11 and it was half way in into last season before I figured out what my problem was. 2 months of trying "inexpensive" things. I would guess a lot of 12's will start showing problems around January.

Don't you think you should be able to get 3000 miles out of an engine? I sure do! I love my dealer and the chassis so I won't ride yellow or green but if either of them come up with something that handles like a Pro, it would start to get tough to choose.

^^well said^^

 

[knifedge]

--Why put any more miles on your motor? You know you have poor quality parts installed, why beat your cylinders to heck and get poor performance along the way?

 

[rydningen]

Polaris pistons were they belong!

 

[Draxxus]

That's why Polaris is coming down on dealers 2 top ends under warranty with turbo common. I know that pro motor has some issues but I know of no pros going down that were left stock mod them and look out. I hope polaris gets tougher with warranty claims when there is mods on the sleds.

I had 2 go on me bone stock

 

[FireDog14]

Hey guys I am a bit of a newbie to this site but I do read a lot of threads, just not a big poster. I am not brand loyal even though I did spring order a 13 XM. I really was torn between the PRO and the new XM. I came off a 06 Summit 800 and before that had 05 RMK 900. I guess the sub-conscience memory of the RMK 900 might have had a little to do with my decision to go with the Doo again.

I really like the PRO overall and sometimes I still waffle a little about not going with it. One thing that I never have been a fan of on the PRO is only having a single heat exchanger. I know the goal is to make a MTN sled as light as possible but I wonder if that is 16lbs lost at a higher potential cost for motor durability. I hear guys say they never have had any major problems and they just put ice scratchers on or throw some snow in the rear skid for hard pack commute to the Powder. Do you think having antifreeze a few degrees cooler circulating would help with the cylinder and piston skirt issue? It seems cylinder cooling is a bit of an issue in the 800 motor and this may just compound the problem. Overheating an engine is never a good thing. I think a guy should be able to get 4000-5000 miles on a motor before it needs anything other than a set of piston & rings at 2000-2500 miles. Having cylinder and piston skirt issues on a motor regardless of brand without malice from the user is unacceptable in my opinion.

Just a thought I know Cat has a single heat exchanger on the Hill Climb sleds now too for weight loss. Like I said, I'm not brand loyal and not bashing Polaris just wondering if a few degrees of cooler antifreeze would help the longevity of these motors or any motor for that matter. As bulletproof as the Cat 800 motor has been maybe there could have been more issues with it too if they went with a single heat exchanger on the M8??

 

[tdblakes]

I think its more about temperature consistancy than "cooler" temperatures overall. I think the extra cooling capacity on the standard RMKs helps maintain a more consistant temperature as the snow conditions change which in turn makes for a happier motor. jmo tho

 

[FireDog14]

I think its more about temperature consistancy than "cooler" temperatures overall. I think the extra cooling capacity on the standard RMKs helps maintain a more consistant temperature as the snow conditions change which in turn makes for a happier motor. jmo tho

That is a better way of stating what I basically mean. A more consistent cooler temperature could be achieved. A single heat exchanger may work really well in alot of cases but a few times of overheating that might not even show up as overheating could really add to the problem.

 

[maxitout77]

I think its more about temperature consistancy than "cooler" temperatures overall. I think the extra cooling capacity on the standard RMKs helps maintain a more consistant temperature as the snow conditions change which in turn makes for a happier motor. jmo tho

Exactly why I bought a standard RMK over a Pro. Money was not a factor, it was the cooler that sold me. Regardless my sled is getting Kelseys drop in pistons, should be here shortly!

 

[pj8556]

"Those mods will void the warranty."
Cheater head, remove the can, my dealer will make it happen.

 

[pj8556]

I'm gonna hold off on the pistons for now, go this season stock (or close to it) w/ warranty and re-evaluate things next summer.

Thanks for all the posts!

 

[RKT]

Exactly why I bought a standard RMK over a Pro. Money was not a factor, it was the cooler that sold me. Regardless my sled is getting Kelseys drop in pistons, should be here shortly!

We, also, have had both the standard RMK and the Pro.. The Standard does run cooler...
I,too, do not understand the reasoning behind the cooler deletion.. I supsect it is just weight,, but I would prefer the Pro have the added cooler as well..

 

[Murph]

Yeah, 2 brand new take out pistons for sale! I have some more seasoned ones if someone's interested. With only 2,000 miles, I'm sure somebody will say that they are good for another 2-3,000 easy. Who's the first to put their money where their mouth is?

Also black swan or anybody else that has new Polaris piston/ rings...

Measure them out--I'd be interested in buying them and keeping my warranty.

New Polaris piston and rings-- send me the measurements and your price.

Thanks,
Murph

 

[maxitout77]

I just finished installing RKTeks direct replacement pistons. Its amazing how much better the motor feels over stock. At idle and under throttle there is signifgantly less vibration, and it definitely revs quicker and MUCH smoother. Money well spent. Very impressed