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If you ride at Togwotee you may want to read this!!

sledstormed

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Dec 13, 2007
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Found this article in the Jackson Hole News & Guide.... Worth reading

Groups want feds to manage snowmobiles
On national forests, a lack of requirements harms skiers and other winter users, they say.

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By Angus M. Thuermer Jr., Jackson Hole, Wyo.
September 22, 2010

A coalition of conservation groups is pushing to change U.S. Forest Service rules so the federal agency regulates snowmobiles on national forest lands in the same manner it treats other off-road vehicles.

The groups, including six with interests in Teton County, are circulating a petition and are scheduled to meet with federal officials to ask that snowmobiles no longer be exempt from rules that regulate off-road vehicles. Snowmobiles were excluded from a 2005 rule, a move that contradicts a 1972 presidential order, the groups contend.

As a result, national forests in snowbelt states and people who recreate there are being unfairly affected by snowmobiles, the groups say. The goal is not to eliminate snowmobiling, said Forrest McCarthy, public lands director with the Winter Wildlands Alliance in Jackson, but to control their use as envisioned by law to protect resources, skiers, snowshoers and hikers.

“Technology has changed,” McCarthy said Tuesday. “Snowmobiles go places today nobody imagined they could go. People have concerns about wildlife, recreation. Today it is much more of an issue.”

A snowmobile advocacy group is opposed to the effort said Greg Mumm, executive director of the Blue Ribbon Coalition in Pocatello, Idaho. Adequate regulations exist to govern snowmobiles, he said.

“This is just another effort on the part of extremists groups to take another bite at the apple to try and get closures, to exclude any kind of motorized use,” he said in a telephone interview. “We just don’t think it’s necessary at all to even consider this.”

McCarthy’s group is one of the petitioners and he pointed to conflicts he said exist on Togwotee Pass between snowmobilers and backcountry skiers. There, skiers’ powder stashes have been churned up by motorized riders and the ambiance disturbed by noisy engines, he said.

“Historically, it has been a backcountry ski destination long before snowmobiles ever arrived there,” he said. “The ski community would like to have an accessible nonmotorized recreation area on Togwotee Pass.”

Two areas the Togwotee Pass Backcountry Alliance has been advocating that snowmobiles be excluded from are Breccia and Two Ocean peaks, he said.

Snowmobiles and other over-snow vehicles “are indistinguishable from other classes of [off-road-vehicles] in terms of impacts,” the petition states. Federal agencies have “a legal and ethical obligation to apply the same set of management standards to [over-snow vehicles] as to other classes of [off-road-vehicles] in order to protect and preserve America’s National Forest System resources, including clean air and water, quiet, wildlife, soils, vegetation, and nonmotorized recreationists, from the substantial adverse impacts of [over-snow-vehicle] use.”

Mumm rejected contentions in the 33-page petition.

Snowmobiles are entirely different from other off-road-vehicles in that they run on the snow, Mumm said; “They don’t actually travel on the ground.”

“We think they’re being managed responsibly the way they are,” he said. “The intent of the travel rule is to manage unmannered motorized recreation. Snowmobiles are well-managed already. This was looked at years ago, in 2005 and the years prior to that when they were developing the [off-road-vehicle] rule.”

One example of existing regulation might be on the Bridger-Teton National Forest on Teton Pass, where snowmobiles are not allowed on the Old Pass Road or south of Highway 22, where skiers frequent. Nearby, however, on Edelweiss Bowl and on Mount Glory, also popular backcountry ski areas, snowmobiles are allowed on popular ski runs.

While some restrictions govern snowmobiling, no regulations require snowmobile management, the conservation groups contend. The petition requests that national forest managers be required to go through a process that brings forest users to the table to set standards for snowmobiling areas and designate where machines are appropriate or inappropriate.

McCarthy dismissed the notion that the petition is an attempt to ban snowmobiling or “lock out” citizens from public lands.

“Our opposition is trying to paint it that we’re trying to close all national forests,” he said. A winter travel plan would designate snowmobile trails, unrestricted “play areas,” and closed areas.

“It is the same process we went through very successfully for the summer travel plan,” McCarthy said. That summer plan governs where four-wheelers are allowed in the Bridger-Teton. Among the suggestions contained in the petition are rules that would establish minimum snow depths for snowmobiling and “preserve quiet as a landscape characteristic.”

Member organizations with local interests that are signatories of the petition include the Greater Yellowstone Coalition, Jackson Hole Conservation Alliance, Sierra Club, Togwotee Pass Backcountry Alliance, Wyoming Conservation Voters, Wyoming Wilderness Association and Winter Wildlands Alliance.
 
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Boonpub

Member
Aug 31, 2010
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It goes well beyond Togwotee.

This is something these groups are asking the FS to implement nationwide.

Good time to send a little support out to your state associations - they have spent a lot of time working on building relationships with the officials who will ultimately be making these decisions.
 
K
Sep 8, 2008
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Lander/Laramie WY
Togwotee

I have rode togwotee for the last two years almost every weekend of the season and probably saw under 10 back country skiers. Almost every skier was on a snowmobile to get to there ski spot. So why do they want to restrict snowmobiles to certain areas when they use them to.
 
E
Dec 2, 2007
20
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Wisconsin
Follow the money trail

Boonpub is right on.. All you have to do is follow the money trail for these groups to find out how big an issue this is to our continued use of OUR public lands. Please guys do one thing...get involved, join SAWS.

The original post brought up Winter Wildlands Alliance, go to their site, you will see that they are behind removing snowmachines from exempt status, this exemption is what allows off trail use in the NF. Don't stop there...

Go on Gore-Tex website, go to sponsorships, you will see (if they don't remove it) that they sponsor the Conservation Alliance, go to the Conservation Alliance site and if you dig through their site a bit you will see that they have granted over $100k to the Winter Wildlands Allince over the last few years. Just dig around on all these sites, it will make you sick! You guys/gals can draw your own conclusions on Gore, time to stand up and be heard or we will have no place in the west to ride in ten years!
 

rmk727

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Oct 3, 2008
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SO.DAK
Quote ( while some restrictions govern snowmobile, no regulations manage them) are you kidding me ? Is that not a direct contridiction? Have they looked at a forest service map and seen the no snowmobiling areas and wildlife management areas. Question; what if we got all the sleders together and all at once joined these groups one at a time and voted our folks in to run them and then voted to spend their money on pizza and beer or something else? It's this kind of stupidity that warrents us to take back all federal lands into the states jurisdiction.
 
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