How I interpereted Obama in the town hall meeting

[Sidehiller]

Did anyone else see the moron at the end asking the last question? Something about when the stimulis was going to help him?
Obama said "You work at McDonalds so you don't have insurance. We will provide health care."
TRANSLATION: "Let's see, there is a guy in Colorado named Dan - he pays for insurance for himself and his kids - he can start taking care of your medical bills too."
Then he said "We will help pay for your education."
TRANSLATION: "Dan's already paying for three kids to get through college, one more won't hurt him."

Am I the only one that takes this crap personal? It's not the "government" or the "taxpayers" paying for this, it's me and you!

 

[nor-cal]

I thought the best part was when Obama said that government was the only way this problem could be solved

 

[Ollie]

OH didn't you know?
Government controled health care is going to stimulate the economy.
It must, it's in the stimulus bill.
Of cource they libs know that is the ONLY way they could get it thru.
People just don't realize how BAD this bill is.

 

[ruffryder]

Why do people not see the difference between government controlled health care and government subsidized insurance?

The difference is huge and I would think would be clear and easy to see...

 

[Sidehiller]

Who cares?

Why do people not see the difference between government controlled health care and government subsidized insurance?

The difference is huge and I would think would be clear and easy to see...

I know the difference between the two. I agree, big difference. It's the similarity that concerns me - the word "government" - translates to "Dan in Colorado will pay for yours"

By the way, I am tired of your condesending "any idiot should be able to see the difference" attitude. I don't understand why someone sitting under a toadstool thinks he can look down on anyone.

 

[V-Man]

Why do people not see the difference between government controlled health care and government subsidized insurance?

The difference is huge and I would think would be clear and easy to see...

The trouble is government subsidized insurance simply drives up the cost even more for the people that pay taxes. They need a fix to the problem, not a band-aid which only increases the burdon on hard working Americans.

I say we move to private insurance which is not provided by your employer, just like car insurance. The insurance companies would have incentive to help you be healthy so you will make fewer claims. They could give people breaks on premiums if they loose weight, quit smoking, etc. Based on your deductible you could have lower premiums too. Heck, with a high deductible, which basically only covers major medical, everyone could probably afford it.

A key part of this is to enforce no insurance, no care. The transition would be tough, but that would lower rates dramatically. I bet people could get major medical for less than they pay for cable TV.

 

[ruffryder]

The trouble is government subsidized insurance simply drives up the cost even more for the people that pay taxes. They need a fix to the problem, not a band-aid which only increases the burdon on hard working Americans.

True, kind of. I mean aren't all people that have insurance now, paying for those that don't have it anyways, in the form of higher rates and higher premiums, when those that don't have insurance don't pay? I would think the hospitals pass the buck by charging more for their services.

Seems to me the hard working American is already paying for it, this might be a way to decrease the burdon, or maybe it would be a zero sum game...

 

[V-Man]

True, kind of. I mean aren't all people that have insurance now, paying for those that don't have it anyways, in the form of higher rates and higher premiums, when those that don't have insurance don't pay? I would think the hospitals pass the buck by charging more for their services.

Seems to me the hard working American is already paying for it, this might be a way to decrease the burdon, or maybe it would be a zero sum game...

You nailed it 100%. Hard working Americans are paying for it now and it will only get worse in my opinion. That is where not providing care to the uninsured comes in. I have no idea how you make that transition smoothly.

 

[ruffryder]

I have no idea how you make that transition smoothly.

yah, but that is a big judgment / morality call. Whose responsibility is it to ensure a healthy society, a healthy workforce...

Right now it seems it is the businesses, which I don't think it is right. Personal responsibility only goes so far when it comes to health, as there are things / circumstances that are out of our direct control.

I like the idea that if you work full time, you get health care. You don't work, you don't get any coverage / services.

 

[Rubi]

Right now, the government health care plans underpay the healthcare providers, so they soak private insurance companies to make up the difference. Since millions more people are going to get government health insurance through the expansion of the SCHIP program, once again, private health insurance will go up to cover the underpayment from the government plans. Once enough people are added to the government plans, private insurance will be so expensive that nobody will be able to afford it. Soon it will be fait accompli for the liberals, because even people with private insurance will have to demand socialized medicine.

 

[Ollie]

yah, but that is a big judgment / morality call. Whose responsibility is it to ensure a healthy society, a healthy workforce...

Right now it seems it is the businesses, which I don't think it is right. Personal responsibility only goes so far when it comes to health, as there are things / circumstances that are out of our direct control.

I like the idea that if you work full time, you get health care. You don't work, you don't get any coverage / services.

Show me anywhere in the bill or rights or the constitution where it says it is the governments job to be the morality police? This isn't Iran.

The problem with work and get health coverage/ don't work and you won't is that it WON"T WORK. Obama and the libs won't allow it. It wouldn't be nice to the 42% of americans who take handouts and don't pay anything in. You remember that 42%. Those are the hard core liberal voters.

Of cource medical coverage is a buisness. If you think handing the whole package over to the government is a good idea, just look at medicaid and medicare. Look what government control has done to those programs.

Anytime you hand a special interest group major control the first thing they do is abuse it. Look at porkzilla passing with lightning speed thru the house and senate.

 

[ruffryder]

Show me anywhere in the bill or rights or the constitution where it says it is the governments job to be the morality police? This isn't Iran.

Society controls the government and societies beliefs are then carried out by the government. If society believes that everyone should have universal health care coverage (this is different then government run health care) then it will do it. As I said it is a morality question as to what you think societies roles are.

Of cource medical coverage is a buisness. If you think handing the whole package over to the government is a good idea, just look at medicaid and medicare. Look what government control has done to those programs.

Who said anything about handing everything over to the government?

 

[Ollie]

Society controls the government and societies beliefs are then carried out by the government. If society believes that everyone should have universal health care coverage (this is different then government run health care) then it will do it. As I said it is a morality question as to what you think societies roles are.



Who said anything about handing everything over to the government?

um, the language in the stimulus bill did.
It creates an entirely new government department that deals strictly with health care. It will create a massive government controled data base with EVERYONE in it. This is the first step in Obama's universal health care plan. He has openly stated it is the governments job to provide universal health care. Now he has it.

oh, and society DOESN"T believe the government should provide universal health care. We did this the last time we had liberals in the white house. Remember?
Hillary, behind closed door deals, all that. It went down in FLAMES because try as the libs might they couldn't force it thru.
So now, Palosi and Reid go behind closed doors and do it.

If we are going to embark on taking over a massive new government control system, it should be put to the voters to decide. I don't need big daddy government patting me on the head and telling me what to do and it's for my own good non-sence.

 

[V-Man]

Society controls the government and societies beliefs are then carried out by the government.

If this were only true, we'd be in a very different place right now. We are being duped right now, big time. This spending bill makes me sick and it is a complete abuse of power by the governement. They are not doing what the people want. Smaller goverment, working for the people is what this country was founded on, not big goverment doing things for the people, that's socialism and those beleifs come directly from our fearless leader. He believes only government will get us out of this mess. I've heard him say it 100 times.

Personally (and I've said this before) I think voting should happen on April 15, when you submit your tax return. Only tax payers should be able to make a decision on how their money is spent.

 

[V-Man]

I read a really interesting book recently with a good point about health care in America. Our insurance companies have no motivation to encourage you to be healthy. Because our employers provide benefits, and most people change jobs every 4-7 years, if they invest in making you healthier their competitors will reap the rewards (you make less claims if you are healthy) when you switch jobs. People should be able to pick the insurance they want and have their rates based of their needs. Employer run plans look at the weakest link in the chain and base their rates for the whole company on them, not you individually.

 

[Rubi]

Society controls the government and societies beliefs are then carried out by the government.

I'm not familiar with that type of government. I see a government that is ramming an $800 Billion stimulus package down the peoples' throats even though 67% of Americans no longer support this bill!

 

[SAWYER]

Personally (and I've said this before) I think voting should happen on April 15, when you submit your tax return. Only tax payers should be able to make a decision on how their money is spent.[/QUOTE]



Couldn't agree more

 

[Ollie]

Society controls the government and societies beliefs are then carried out by the government.

One other thing.
That's not really true anymore.
The media TELLS society what to think and then gets the results they want.
Any bad info about OBama was surpressed by the media while they hunted for bad things about conservatives (I don't think McCain is a conservative by the way).

The media got Obama elected. Figure that in with the fact that with 680 million dollars, the entire media behind him and all of (most of) Hollywood rooting for him, he still JUST got into office with 52% of the vote. He needs to remember that that means 48% don't want him there. Maybe deflate his ego a bit.

As for the porkzilla winging it's way thru the process, NOBODY has read the darn thing. They took a bunch of wish list items from different people and tossed them into a single bill. There are 800 pages to this thing and no-one, not even the **** from california has a clue what all is in it. Other than She will get her 30 million dollar pet project.