Helix and spring question

[THRILL_SEEKER]

So if I understand things correctly, on a 2015 RMK 800, the shallower the finish angle on a helix the more belt squeeze? And the higher the finish spring weight the more belt squeeze?

ie: 58/38 .36 helix would have slightly more belt squeeze then a 58/40 .36 with all things else being the same, and a black/purple (160-240) will have more belt squeeze then a stock black (155-222) with all things else being the same, are these correct statements?

If so would the stock black (155-222) and a 58/38 .36 helix be pretty close to a black/purple (160-260) with a 58/40 .36 helix?

If not what would be approximately the difference in the two set ups as far as back shifting is concerned, all things else staying the same?

 

[winter brew]

I have a side force calculator from Team but it's not on my home computer.
I will try to remember to put in those numbers this coming weekend and it will tell you exactly how much side force is exerted for a given horsepower, spring and helix angle at any point in the shift pattern.

 

[BILTIT]

This one?

 

[stormrider3]

The shallower angle creates a slower up-shift. Pressure is determined by the spring rate.

 

[geo]

Helix angle has more belt pressure effect at higher torque #'s (closer you get to full throttle).
Spring pressure has more belt pressure effect at lower torque #'s ( part throttle input).

Too high-a belt pressure (total of helix and spring #'s) will raise rpm and slow upshift and lower peak sustained mph. because of excessive (only need so much lol.) pressure.
Too low-a total belt pressure will increase rpm, quicken upshift and lower peak sustained mph because of not enough (but you need enough lol) pressure.

Somewhere in between the two above scenarios is where you want to be.

Seems simple eh.

 

[Kcjepperson]

Do they have a clutch calculator like that for the primary clutch?

That is pretty cool? Be nice to see with a spring and a certain weight in the promary if you could the pressure close onthe calculator and then try it in the real world.

 

[geo]

It would be a lot more complicated to do this simple Excell program for the primary.

Many weight profiles out there. They change the balance point of the mass. I would think that is like throwing in a diameter change in the helix during the shift.
You got to throw in rpm too.

I've been playing with the Kitchener side pressure calculator for a few years lol. It creates lots of head scratching when comparing some recommended set-ups to what you may be using.
Neat to see the different set-ups you may be trying at different throttle inputs (torque #) too.

Trouble is, what is the correct pressure to apply? Is 400 the magic # at 1 to 1,,, or is it 390,,, or is it 410. If you try to apply Aaen's golden secondary ratio of 2 to 1 (2 times more pressure needed in low ratio compared to full shift) you get REALLY weird set-ups (and they don't work in a Team from my experience lol).

So,, back to "get rid of the heat" in the field. Dang nothin' for nothin' again lol.

Fun to play with but it is still " heavier spring adds pressure and steeper helix takes some away".

 

[TRS]

Do they have a clutch calculator like that for the primary clutch?

That is pretty cool? Be nice to see with a spring and a certain weight in the promary if you could the pressure close onthe calculator and then try it in the real world.

Yamaha does, and it is pretty cool. They have a tremendous amount of different profiles available for their primary.

 

[Kcjepperson]

After playing with the calculator, I am going to try some different combo very very helpful. Thanks guys for the info!