Cannot get support from Boondocker....please help!!

[snowchaser]

2009 Polaris Dragon 800 W/ new top end and 2010 flash
Riding elevation 3500-6000 Ft.
Fuel 50/50 Non oxygenated 92 / Trick 114 (100 Octane)
Pump gas turbo kit with EBC (Rev AAD) and Push to pass
Boost 8lbs / 10 on button
Boondocker Fuel box (5B220802)

EBC settings:
Set HP +10 @ 4000 ft
Alt comp +12
+ HP btn +10
PT/CAL +68 (0 boost on fuel box)

Boondocker fuel box settings: (simple tuner w/ ADA)
3000 LO -01 MID -03 HI -06
5000 LO 00 MID -03 HI -07
Pressure LO 38 MID 48 HI 58
RPM 8450
Max EGT 1254 deg both cylinders
Plugs PTO dark tan MAG slightly darker

OK, now with all that said. The sled runs at 4500 ft like a scolded dog……still a bit fat as I cannot get above 1250 deg (target from Boondocker was 1300 deg). Plugs verified at this fuel and egt setting, about a pinky finger nail of piston wash. These fuel numbers seem very extreme and lean compared to the Boondocker recommended starting numbers of 00 @ (3000, 5000 LO, MID, HI)? I kept removing fuel from the recommended setting until the top end bog stopped and I ended up at the above settings. Now, when returning to the truck and dropping below 3500 ft the sled has the bad on/off bog again at full throttle, but runs great at lo to mid throttle positions? I thought it may be det….but the light on the dash does not flash when this happens…..plugs and pistons show no sign of det. Can you give me some much needed insight?

Also am I correct in thinking the 3000 RPM setting is for no/lo load situations and the 5000 RPM is for mid to hi load? Trying to get my head around this. Please advise.

Dave

 

[theshadowrider]

Try pm snowjw he knows his stuff and is pretty helpful

 

[akula]

i found that lowering the psi numbers made the biggest change.my psi numbers for 0 4000 ft 38-42-38 egts around 1100 short bursts for now.starting psi numbers were 42-50-60

 

[wsellars]

I was under the impression that the 09 flash was the best one to run. Dont know if the 10' flash could be causing any of your problems or not, just a thought.

 

[Mag]

I was under the impression that the 09 flash was the best one to run. Dont know if the 10' flash could be causing any of your problems or not, just a thought.

Mines definitely worse after the 2010 flash, I'd love to go back to the 09 but the dealer wont do it. Running 100% trick 110 and the det sensor still goes off even with the EBC all the way to zero.

 

[Jkinzer]

Mines definitely worse after the 2010 flash, I'd love to go back to the 09 but the dealer wont do it. Running 100% trick 110 and the det sensor still goes off even with the EBC all the way to zero.

the superceded january 09 flash is by far the best flash to run on the 08's and 09's. as far as your dealer not being willing to flash your sled back is the dumbest thing i've heard in a long time. do you have any other dealers in your area? it seriously takes 15 minutes and is an easy half hour (most shops min. shop labor time) for any service shop. if we werent so far away i'd offer for you to send me your ecu and i'd flash it for ya

 

[Mag]

the superceded january 09 flash is by far the best flash to run on the 08's and 09's. as far as your dealer not being willing to flash your sled back is the dumbest thing i've heard in a long time. do you have any other dealers in your area? it seriously takes 15 minutes and is an easy half hour (most shops min. shop labor time) for any service shop. if we werent so far away i'd offer for you to send me your ecu and i'd flash it for ya

You got the flash #, I can go 100 miles in 2 directions to different dealers. I'd of brought it with me last week but you weren't there when I stopped by.

 

[SNOW JW]

2009 Superceded flashes are (Jkinzer's old post)
Blue-4012706
Red-4012705
Yellow-4012707


If you want a performance minded flash and not a EPA flash the 09 is the best way to go.

I sent you a PM Snowchaser call me Wends leave a message if I don't pick up I will get back to you and we can go over your sled in detail

 

[F-Bomb]

Dave your story reads that you went lean as you were dropping in alt. Try to avoid the concept that a certain egt temp is what you are after based on someone elses experience. Even from the manufacturer because that is not how things work. When your sled ran great at full throttle 1250ish at 4500 ft (you kind of need to know the air conditions as well to really break this down because simple altitude is not the only factor) that is the indicator of a temp that you should be looking for at that throttle position and duration. Your plugs tell you every single thing you need to know by a complete read for that given duration of RPM heat. It's like an instant reader board as things happen. If you want to know your state of tune you have to have those numbers and then each plug read at that absolute time. Things change every 1/20th of a second on your egt and a plug burn is inconsistant after about 3 seconds of variation and throws out unreliable results. You know from experience that 1250ish at full throttle for a certain duration is a good result. If you could get your sled to clean up and run out while lean then you would most likely see temps riding above those numbers. This is the challenge with the CFI and running egt's. Compensation is going on that doesn't allow them time to read a consistant response because you are getting a random spark and fuel explosion that wont registar to your instrument in a normal manner. This messes people up with egt reads.."my sled hesitates and runs poorly but my egts didn't go through the roof or read lean like a traditional carb'd setup".

I'm betting that your threashold of performance for that setting was pretty much right on for 4500/air condition for that time and became too lean below or as there was more oxygen in the air. The motor laying down, hesitating, bobbling and sputtering like a bog is a pretty consistant indicator of a lean condition and the stock ecu attempting to compensate at full asking. The code that is written into your ecu program gives parameters of voltage for certain aspects of performance so that it can compensate as a stock system. All of these reprograms are just readjusting the parameters and settings.

 

[snowchaser]

F-Bomb,

All great information. Here is where it begins to get interesting....... I tried to run the Boondockers numbers of 3000 RPM / LO 00 / MID 00 / HI 00 and 5000 RPM / LO 00 / MID 00 / HI 00 PSI 38 / 48 / 58. Started out at 2800 ft all the way up to 4500 ft + Ran like a turd at WOT. 1/3 & 2/3 throttle position was good. Then tried 3000 RPM / LO 00 / MID 02 / HI 00 and 5000 RPM / LO 02 / MID 02 / HI 00 PSI 42 / 50 / 60...same result pulsing bog @ WOT......but no appearance of det. Sled only ran on WOT when I started drastically messing with HI fuel numbers. I guess it is back to the drawing board and possibly a reflash back to 09? Could the 10 flash be causing this mess? Not whipped yet, just getting started. Thanks for your help.

Dave

 

[ridgeclimber]

BD turbo Tuning

I have the 08 800 BD PG dragon with the mini cooler. The numbers I have been running are 3000 RPM Lo -2, mid 2, hi 0, 5000 rpm Lo 2, mid 2, hi 0, psi Lo 39, mid 47, hi 52. With my wires plugged in for premium fuel. My egts are at 1250 to 1280. Mine is still sputters a bit at low elevation but clears up around 2500 3000 ft. I lowered the 3000 lo # to -2 to help clean up the idle and try to help with hard starting when hot. The rest of the rpm #'s I would leave at the recommended #'s. That is the fuel for those rpm. If you are on boost you are usually above those rpm #'s. With your boost controller turned all the way down, start with your lo or partial throttle. Adjust you psi #'s only, until you get the throttle response and egt's were you want them. Then go to the mid throttle and then do the same, then wot. Do it in that order. Wot is the easiest to tune. Try to do this on a wide open area, good steady load with some good powder. After that is working good try increasing the boost and try that.That is what we did with some help from a friend that has built lot's of these turboed sled. Yes elevation, weather conditions seems to effect it abit but I found these numbers work pretty good for me. Good luck.

 

[mod03rmk800]

might want to take a peek at your pistons and see if they are toast on the skirts exhaust side. Doesn't take long to 'smear' them under these situations(first hand experience).

 

[600rmk]

someone can correct me if i am wrong, but i understand the lo mid hi settings ot be related to the signal from the tps. At 3000 rpm, lo mid hi refers to the throttle position. same as at 5000. changing these settings without changing all 3 can create some strange fueling situations. go bac to the starting numbers, and then adjust only the psi numbers. lo for idle to mid for mid and hi for hi. if it is fat reduce the number by 1 and try again.you will be amazed at how quick and easy. this is.in your first post with your first numbers, you said it was okay except for full throttle. so reduce the high psi number by 1 or2 and try again.

 

[turbo800rmk]

2009 Polaris Dragon 800 W/ new top end and 2010 flash
Riding elevation 3500-6000 Ft.
Fuel 50/50 Non oxygenated 92 / Trick 114 (100 Octane)
Pump gas turbo kit with EBC (Rev AAD) and Push to pass
Boost 8lbs / 10 on button
Boondocker Fuel box (5B220802)

EBC settings:
Set HP +10 @ 4000 ft
Alt comp +12
+ HP btn +10
PT/CAL +68 (0 boost on fuel box)

Boondocker fuel box settings: (simple tuner w/ ADA)
3000 LO -01 MID -03 HI -06
5000 LO 00 MID -03 HI -07
Pressure LO 38 MID 48 HI 58
RPM 8450
Max EGT 1254 deg both cylinders
Plugs PTO dark tan MAG slightly darker

OK, now with all that said. The sled runs at 4500 ft like a scolded dog……still a bit fat as I cannot get above 1250 deg (target from Boondocker was 1300 deg). Plugs verified at this fuel and egt setting, about a pinky finger nail of piston wash. These fuel numbers seem very extreme and lean compared to the Boondocker recommended starting numbers of 00 @ (3000, 5000 LO, MID, HI)? I kept removing fuel from the recommended setting until the top end bog stopped and I ended up at the above settings. Now, when returning to the truck and dropping below 3500 ft the sled has the bad on/off bog again at full throttle, but runs great at lo to mid throttle positions? I thought it may be det….but the light on the dash does not flash when this happens…..plugs and pistons show no sign of det. Can you give me some much needed insight?

Also am I correct in thinking the 3000 RPM setting is for no/lo load situations and the 5000 RPM is for mid to hi load? Trying to get my head around this. Please advise.

Dave

DAVE I HAVE EXACT SAME SLED WITH EXACT SAME PROBLEM.......THE KICKER....I SELL FOR BOONDOCKER...THEY DONT RESPOND TO MY QUESTIONS EITHER.......PLEASE KEEP ME UP TO SPEED AS TO HOW YOU FIXED IT. THANKS CODY

 

[mountainhorse]

I feel for you if you have not recieved help on your sled.

Sincere question... Did you try to call Boondockers and ask for Jared directly or did you email them to their general email address?

 

[Arcteryx]

Strange

I keep seeing this post pop up and find it STRANGE. BD has always been great with support from my experience. That being said I paid Tri City to install my turbo and always used them as my first line of support. They were great as well.
Some of my buddies did their own installs and I know it took them longer to get things dialed in but they did. Tri City and BD took great care of them too.

The 800 in our group had similar problems at one point. Turned out he had a bad flash and a small tare in the TB boot. The problem really only presented itself at higher throttle positions because that is when the pressure really made the tare open up. This seemed to be enough to make the sled bog.

New boot and the correct flash solved all his problems. Might not be the same for you but something to maybe look for. Just a thought.

 

[snowchaser]

ttt

 

[Arcteryx]

Just so I am clear. Is this a new kit purchased from Boondockers?? Is it a new kit purchased from a dealer?? A used kit purchased from someone??

I travel to Idaho Falls every week for work and stop by Boondockers about once a month to see what's new. I try to hit SLP, Klim, and most recently Fire n Ice as well.

PM me your personal information, name etc and the details on when and where you purchased your kit. I will talk to my contacts there and see if there is anything I can do to get you some help.

 

[njj427cobra]

Had the same problem with my 08 D8 BD Race Gas turbo when I first bought the sled two winters ago. Got all sorts of advice from BD, but never told to check the trottle body boots. Took me most of the first year to find the problem until I burnt a piston. Definatley check your TB boots and get the reinforcement plate/adapter for the boot. Running the adapter for the last 1500 miles and boots are still intact. 10 to 14 PSI. Sled still runs like crap on bottom and mid, scalded dog on top!