Can you say No ?????????

[high time]

Think about it. There's a big event or all your buddies are going out. There's avy danger, but you haven't seen any. Will you say naw, I'll hang out in town. I'll read or soak in the hot tub.
It takes ba11s to be the only one in your group to do this. You alfa males need to show yourselves when it realy counts. Not just on a gutzy climb.

Owen

 

[snowmanx]

I might now....or at I hope I would. Before REvy...NO, i was supposed to be up there and I can say with some certainty that I would have been right in the mix. I'd probably still go out, just stay in the trees and the meadows.

I am buying a avalanche bag, something 2 weeks ago I thought I had absolutley no use for. I know it's not a fail safe, and I still need to assess the conditions, but I won't stop climbing, and anytime you climb, or are even in the mountains, I think there is a risk.

I believe that, caught in an avy, a bag MAY save your life. I love sledding, but I DON'T WANT TO DIE DOING IT!!!!

 

[SnowBigDeal]

I think your post is the key! Beacons, shovels, probes, Airbags, etc are for after a mistake has already been made.

Having the knowledge of when to say no and then having the courage to say no when the conditions aren't right. That is when lives will be saved.

 

[backcountryislife]

I think there's a difference between saying no, I'm not riding at all today, and just being smart about WHERE you ride. I think one thing that would help a lot of groups would be to talk early on in the day about the fact that today is NOT the day to be playing on the big hills, let's keep it to smaller hills or to lower angle.
I ride every day, & I set off slides pretty often, but on day I'm gonna set off slides, I'm hitting little baby hills where I can learn from the snow dropping, and the likelihood of it catching or hurting me is VERY low. Where I ride there are MANY days where I just don't touch the big hills at all.

I think like many things in this world people have to see it in black & white, when the reality is moderation is the key.

 

[Insaneboltrounder/sjohns]

Heres what we were riding in the day of the avey. Does it look fun? This is in the same mtn range as boulder. You dont have to say no , you have to say no to danger zones.

 

[av8er]

ALL MOUNTAIN RIDERS SHOULD HAVE, BEACON, PROBE, SHOVEL, AND ROPE AS MINIMUM EQUIP.

DONT LEAVE HOME WITHOUT IT, THE LIFE YOU SAVE COULD BE YOUR OWN!!

 

[CatWoman]

I'm fortunate in that I don't have a long drive to ride (there will most likely be sometime in my future though that I do travel to ride someplace else).

That said....I have gotten to the parking area, only to discover things not to be conducive to riding. If I'm taking the groomed trail a ways to get to where we hop off trail, this trail system has a hillsides that can (and do) slide into the trail at times....I judge by what I see. Once I never even made it out of the parking lot. I stayed there all morning, along with the FS Snow Rangers, warning peeps of the conditions (a lot of slides across the trail were reported to me by a reliable peep). I told folks it was totally their choice, but they were looking at some high danger out there. We got about half to turn around (and some had traveled here to ride, so were on vacation time). I also had avy brochures to hand out. I send them out to anyone for free to anyone whom PM's me with their name & address to send to, carry them in backpack to hand out, put them up in a few places.

There have been a few other times that we have left, only to discover many slides, and thus turned around and went back home. While we don't have the long drive.......loading sleds/gear/everything associated with it, then to turn around to do the reverse. PITA.......yeah, but worth our lives. We chose to just go home and be around to ride another day.

Most places we ride, the trail/path has a mountainside next to it is various spots......so to just get to the safer areas at times, that part of the ride isn't always safe.

 

[winter brew]

And if you choose to stay home and your buddies die, how will it feel to think you might have been able to stop them or rescue them if you HAD gone riding that day?

 

[Maclintock]

I like the Pics in the meadow. Go, but hang out in the safe areas. When their are high to Extreme conditions for weeks and the you get 80cm or more in a few days that dropped on top of Hoar frost YIKES!!!!! Stay off of slopes and play in the trees.
Do your homework if you are going somewhere you do not ride in all the time. Then make your decision whether or not to even go.

 

[backcountryislife]

DONT LEAVE HOME WITHOUT IT, THE LIFE YOU SAVE COULD BE YOUR OWN!!

The one problem I see lately is that folks are prepared, but then don't use any judgement once they get to the riding area.

People need to be equipped to save a life, but ride like the only thing that will save them is THEIR BRAIN.

The fact that we keep seeing multiple burials means POOOOOOOOR decisions are being made. (over & over & over again...)

 

[TIM]

And if you choose to stay home and your buddies die, how will it feel to think you might have been able to stop them or rescue them if you HAD gone riding that day?

you feel like the dumb shets should have listened to you and went to taft with you. instead they got to bring a body out.

been there done that did it. You feel, you where smart. especailly when they died of trauma being strained thru the so called safe trees.

 

[high time]

I noticed that you all agree......

Yes, I don't think going home is a necessity. A safe ride should be possible in spite of avy danger in most locales. This is the sort of thing that should be part of avy training.

Let's discuss where to ride when avy danger is high. How to cross below a possibe slide area? Where is the runout? Why is there no trees here?

I think most mountain riders now know they should have the equipment and know how to use it. All of the guys I ride with do, But the trick is to never have to use it.

Owen

 

[EagleRiverDee]

We don't stay home, but if it's a high avy risk day, we stay in the flat lands or foothills where there are lots of anchors (trees) to keep the snow in place and boondock it. I can have plenty of fun just carving powder and boondocking- I don't need to climb to get a rush from riding.

 

[high time]

I think I was getting over the climb only mentality before these avys.

Just squaring up to the mountain and mashing the throttle was starting to get old. Bad for me is that the 1000 mod King was good at that but, not that good for boondocking and sidehills. I'll make the change. Maybe a M-800.

Owen

 

[TIM]

I still climb, i just am a little smarter. You don't have to stop riding. just ride smarter.

 

[cowboysedge]

And if you choose to stay home and your buddies die, how will it feel to think you might have been able to stop them or rescue them if you HAD gone riding that day?

I beat myself up for a while last year over this very thing. I was at work and didn't have the choice of going that day. Still I thought what if???? Fact is I wasn't there!

I thought to myself maybe if I were there I could have changed the way things happened. After all I am avy trained, maybe I could have pointed out the avy danger, maybe made sure only one person was on a the slope at a time, maybe even saved my friends when they were buried.

After a while I really thought about it and the fact is. Maybe the snow condition was so great that I would have been excited and over looked the avy dangers, (the avy danger was moderate that day) maybe I would have been the one that triggered the avy, maybe I would have been buried in the avy, maybe I would have never came home.

I am so sorry for the loss of my friends, the heart ache that there families are still going through. God Bless them!

I take this memory with me every time I ride. It has been hard to change the way I ride, but I just ride by alot of hills I loved to scatch on. It is just not worth the chance.

Ride safe, Ride to ride again!

 

[cowboysedge]

Think about it. There's a big event or all your buddies are going out. There's avy danger, but you haven't seen any. Will you say naw, I'll hang out in town. I'll read or soak in the hot tub.
It takes ba11s to be the only one in your group to do this. You alfa males need to show yourselves when it realy counts. Not just on a gutzy climb.

Owen

Think about this, the avy danger has been High to Considerable for the last 4 months in our area, dropping to Moderate only a hand full of time all winter. Did we put our sleds away? NO! We rode 2-3 times a week all winter. You just have to ride smarter! Ride safe areas! Watch out for your group and make group decisions! Ride with Avy awareness trained people! There is a good time to be had even when the dangers are high. Just because the avy danger is high don't mean you have to put your group in the middle of danger!