Camso fit to 2008 KTM 300 XCW.

[Misha Subo]

Everything in the install has gone perfectly so far. Only one issue and it is a major one...while fitting the top of the strut rod end to the top shock attachment point I have found the misalignment of the top of the strut rod end is about 1-2 inches too far to the left side of the bike. I had to loosen the bottom strut bolt and pull the top of the strut really hard to align the 1-2 inches back to the top mounting point. Now the bottom bolt is too hard to tighten with the strut attached at the top.

The online manual states to use strut "configuration #1" while the paper install manual that comes with the kit states to use the strut "configuration #2", however I don't see either configuration making a difference from left to right as it is only a difference of where the aluminium spacer goes (top or bottom). In the end, the strut is still pulled to far left.

An added problem is the swing arm t-bushing configuration aligns the counter shaft sprocket well with the Camso drive sprocket, but with this t-bushing configuration the whole kit is aligned about 10 mm left off centre. Is this normal? The photos attached show the kit frame gap is different on the left compared to the smaller gap on the right side.

I'm fighting the clock at this point as I'm hoping to use the kit this weekend. Anyone with experience fitting to the older model KTMs?

 

[Ben 500RR-S]

95 views but no one knows. I think your only play is to email the Camso customer service and see what they have to say.

I'll agree, and had written the guy at Camso to let them know of all the errors I had found in both their online manuals and the printed manuals sent to the owners and he said they'd look into them and correct them.

I suspect you have the PDS suspension and that because of that, the upper shock mount(the entire shock itself) is offset and not centered as it is with most (dirt) bikes, and that is why the strut rod and its mount in the tunnel are off.

I'm surprised there is no bushing to account for the upper shock mount offset. I also can't imagine them having you bolt it up with the strut rod canted-over to the upper shock mount on the bike.



As for the track/tunnel/countershaft alignment, when I put the tunnel in, the C/S sprocket lined up perfectly with the primary sprocket on the DTS, and with that, everything else was perfect and I didn't even notice any gap or offset in the tunnel itself. I had figured that the most important thing was for the C/S to line up with the primary sprocket and everything else would fall into place and it did.

I hope you can get in touch with Camso and get a solution quickly.

 

[Misha Subo]

I wrote an email to Camso about this late yesterday. Hopefully they will respond today.

Ben, you are correct...the KTM PDS top shock mount is quite offset (to the right). It is way out of centre but Camso's same kit number (9025-29-0528 - according to their fit guide) is supposed to work for all 250/300 EXC/XC/XCWs and even some 4Ts and 450s from 2006-2015. It is their most common kit part number. This makes me doubt the accuracy of Camso's fit chart since I know there is lots of dimensional variation between PDS/link 4T etc. I wonder, could this lower strut rubber mount suit so many different configurations or are they trying to make it too universal?

I had the same problem you mentioned in an earlier post, the manual stating to use strut config #1 or #2 depending on the online vs. the paper version.

I could get a little more right movement if I made new tee bushings and flip the drive sprocket around. This would bring the frame in centre while still keeping the C/S aligned with the drive sprocket. It would also cause less angle to pull the strut in line with the upper mounting point. But with our trip looming just two days away, I do not have the time to measure and lathe three new spacers which would still not get back the roughly 1-1/2 inches of strut offset.

 

[Ben 500RR-S]

Hopefully it is just a simple matter of Camso having missed sending you a spacer for the top shock mount as that is the only way I can see the top of the strut rod being mated to the top shock mount on the bike.

The only other way that it could have worked would have been for Camso to have designed the spot where the lower strut rod mount installs in-line with the top strut mount.

I do know that it totally sucks to see it printed "Bolt and go, plug and play, no drilling or modifications required . . . " and then there you are, with a kit that simply does not fit. Hopefully the C/S rep at Camso will send you a message soon. I also think it sucks that there is no phone number to call and we have to wait and play the email-game to get help.

Lastly, the proofreader at Camso sucks pretty bad at their job. I did their proofreading for them along with all the figures that were included that did not belong where they were in the manuals. It would not surprise me that there are other errors in things based on the errors I had seen in the manuals. How places can send out instructions with errors in them is beyond me as it is 2018.

 

[M5-]

For sure that isn't ideal but as is it will likely still work. I have to ask this but you are certain the swing arm bushings are in correctly. Have you put a straight edge on the chain vs eyeball?

So long as your drive chain is lined up you should never have an issue with the swing arm mount deforming or any other issues down there. It kind of blows that its like that but I'm not sure it will appreciably weaken the system it just looks wrong. You could figure the shear/deflection out with the math but in the meantime while you are waiting for Camso I'd move the strut rod as far left as possible maybe just washer up the right side and try it. It will probably work fine. I have one of those bikes and my old TS strut rod didn't sit straight either.

M5

 

[Ben 500RR-S]

For sure that isn't ideal but as is it will likely still work. I have to ask this but you are certain the swing arm bushings are in correctly. Have you put a straight edge on the chain vs eyeball?

So long as your drive chain is lined up you should never have an issue with the swing arm mount deforming or any other issues down there. It kind of blows that its like that but I'm not sure it will appreciably weaken the system it just looks wrong. You could figure the shear/deflection out with the math but in the meantime while you are waiting for Camso I'd move the strut rod as far left as possible maybe just washer up the right side and try it. It will probably work fine. I have one of those bikes and my old TS strut rod didn't sit straight either.

M5

It could be why they put the heim joint on the top of the strut rod. They also beefed up/increased the diameter of the strut rod for 2018. I'll also bet it is why there are the big rubber washers/dampeners on the bottom of the strut rod.

 

[Misha Subo]

Ben, as you I and so many others know, who have worked in industry (me in something very similar to Camso's industry), we can all picture where something can go wrong in the organization and turn out to be a big deal to the customer in the end. Case in point - try changing the spark plugs on a Volkswagen Beetle (over 30 million made)...seems close to impossible for the first time.

I could probably pull the top strut hard enough to get it in line with the top mount but this would put significant strain on my frame, given there would induce a lateral force from the angle of the strut, not to mention the rubber dampers at the bottom would be compressed excessively.

Either way, I could come up with a fitting solution but afraid to be told it voids warranty. Other than this, I am completely happy with both the Camso fit and design.

I will continue to wait for Camso's response, or anyone else of the over 30 users registered on this site with 300 2Ts, whom have experienced the elegant solution to this misalignment issue. Otherwise my plan to enjoy these ponies during our trip to winter wonderland is off. I'll have to resort to eating and drinking instead.

 

[Misha Subo]

I also think it would be OK to pull the top of the strut over to align the heim joint, defeating the bottom rubbers in the process. Camso does ship the top spacer which does work as intended but having to pull the strut so far is suspicious.

Yes, I checked the sprocket alignment with a straight edge - it's perfect, so the tee bushings are right. However, the whole kit frame is placed about 10mm too far left, as you can see in my photos (clearance to RH/LH foot pegs). I think this could be corrected by making new spacers and flipping the Camso sprocket around so the boss on the sprocket makes up the off set difference, keeping it in line with the C/S sprocket. I can do this in the off season to lessen the stress up top but still curious what Camso has to say. I cannot be the first to have this issue. It's the third most used snow bike platform out there right now.

If worse comes to worse I'll have to force it together for this weekend.

 

[Vincenthdfan]

If you're tired of waiting for an E-Mail response, you can call Camso Customer Service at:

1-819-539-2220

Be advised, the phone message is in French when the automated answer begins (being a French Canadian Company), but if you wait through the prompts, there's an English option (#9).

Make sure you have your DTS Serial Number handy because they will always ask for it right up front.

I've dealt with them a few times on warranty issues and they're very nice folks to deal with.

 

[byeatts]

95 views but no one knows. I think your only play is to email the Camso customer service and see what they have to say.

I'll agree, and had written the guy at Camso to let them know of all the errors I had found in both their online manuals and the printed manuals sent to the owners and he said they'd look into them and correct them.

I suspect you have the PDS suspension and that because of that, the upper shock mount(the entire shock itself) is offset and not centered as it is with most (dirt) bikes, and that is why the strut rod and its mount in the tunnel are off.

I'm surprised there is no bushing to account for the upper shock mount offset. I also can't imagine them having you bolt it up with the strut rod canted-over to the upper shock mount on the bike.



As for the track/tunnel/countershaft alignment, when I put the tunnel in, the C/S sprocket lined up perfectly with the primary sprocket on the DTS, and with that, everything else was perfect and I didn't even notice any gap or offset in the tunnel itself. I had figured that the most important thing was for the C/S to line up with the primary sprocket and everything else would fall into place and it did.

I hope you can get in touch with Camso and get a solution quickly.

just make an offset strut .pretty simple fix to get up and running

 

[Misha Subo]

Well I think I can get up and running with the stock strut now...just in from my unheated Garaj Mahal and with a little silcone lube managed to tighten the bottom bolt to more or less force the strut rubbers in place with the top heim joint in its place first. This means it could be a multi step process to adjust the track height and subsequent chain tension with the heim rod end adjuster but at least it keeps me moving forward to my goal for this weekend.

You can see the right leaning angle on the strut in the photo (about 1.5" off set from bottom to top). I'm forcing the rubbers quite a bit but I think the joint is going to handle the off centred load - seems more than strong enough with all the gusseting around the frame. Not an ideal situation though.

 

[Vincenthdfan]

I hate pre-loading anything with stress, but I guess sometimes ya gotta do what ya gotta do.

I think this is the same reason Camso's side panels crack around the front corners...because they're pre-loaded with stress at the 90 degree corners.

If you look at them,they should be shimmed so that when tightened they don't bend beyond their 90 degree bend.

I know these are all just teething pain issues that they'll get sorted out eventually, because they seem like a pretty pro-active company.

 

[Misha Subo]

I'm not sure where you mean that the Camso side panels tend to crack? If you mean at the attachment points, I have noticed that they are held by just a bolt and washer alone, in six places, and not a flanged spacer. I'm going to drill the plastic panels out at all six attachment points and use some proper tee-bushing style of washer to prevent the clamping force of just the bolt and washer alone. Perhaps this will solve the problem you're referring to?

On another note, I just reefed the strut together, adjusted the primary and secondary chains, track height and et voila...first ride in front of my house down the street in the ditches, a multi-point turn at the end and back. Quite impressed with the smoothness of the Camso. This is only my second ride ever on a snow bike but the Camso feels like it turns better than the Yeti did (which was my first and only ride on a rental day in Revelstoke last February).

 

[chumbilly1]

So Camso now owns Yeti, therefore owns the pds offset spacer that yeti provides with RRS or Softstrut. Personally I would be asking for that piece plus a deal on the 2018 Yeti softstrut. Camso has dropped the ball this year with the yeti line as well. Missing parts, late delivery, etc... I am not familiar with DTS , but all rigid struts I have been around use a heim on each end. Your just fighting the rubber.

 

[Vincenthdfan]

I'm not sure where you mean that the Camso side panels tend to crack?

These are the crack areas that multiple people have experienced (pics are of mine before I submitted my warranty claim). Side panel, forward, upper corners.

Left alone, these cracks can progress quite a ways, I've seen some nasty pics. It is after all, just aluminum.

 

[Misha Subo]

How can one avoid this crack?

 

[Vincenthdfan]

In my opinion, when you look down at the angle of the side panel...it looks like its been folded down further than 90 degrees by tightening the bolt.

Its as though they should have shimmed the side panel underneath instead of pre-loading it with tension on the top mount bolt.

This is on my 2017, if you have an 18 it may not have as much tension on it??

Someone also said that the company beefed up the 18 main frame so it doesn't flex as much, theorizing that's what cracked the side panels...

I have a new, warranted 18 frame siting next to my old cracked 17 main frame and it is indeed beefier....will it keep side panels from cracking? If its pre-loaded with stress at the corners (a big no-no in the aircraft industry I came from)...I doubt it.

Worth having a look anyway, no matter what year kit you own.