Broken Heim Joint

[pylon]

the 08 and 09 s have a mounting tab for the tie rod ball joint that is placed further towords the out side of the spindle . skinz doesnt offer a tie rod to compensate for this . so there is very little thread in the tie rods , kinda worries me

 

[bholmlate]

Hey Pylon
I have read somewhere, i think over on TY that if you flip the spindles from the left to right you can get the tie rods to work a little better on the 08's. This would move the mounting tabs to the inside and shortening the distance. If i am not mistaken the mounting tab is the only difference in the spindles. You would have to make sure all the clearances from lock to lock are all correct.
I am curious if this is true or not since if i buy the kit someday i will have to add the price of the 09 spindles to a kit that already is a little overpriced in my opinion. obviously the perfomance benefits are there.

 

[otis]

I didn't need to run the Skinz front end to formulate my opinion. It was pretty easy once they started snapping off. When a friend and i had the opportunity to look at them up close we saw the major design flaw, something that we had the misfortune to experience on a friend of mines front end that he fabricated. Didn't need to relive something we already knew ! Look back on some of the threads and you will catch it !

I love how you call a guy out LOL !

I was at the airport last night and looked out at the plane I was supposed to fly in. I knew right away by just looking at it something was wrong. I didn't need to fly the actual plane to formulate my opinion. It was pretty easy to decide when I saw the maintenance crew working on a problem. When a friend and I boarded the plane and had a chance to look at it up close we saw the the major design flaw. It was something we had the misfortune to experience on a friend of mines plane that he fabricated. Didn't need to re-live something we already knew!

Here is an example of when someone formulates an opinion on something that that they know little about. Sounds pretty silly doesn't it? I don't own a plane nor do I have any good knowledge about one. I don't go about making comments about planes when I look at one or fly in one. If I did indeed own a plane and fly one on a regular basis I might be qualified to comment about issues regarding that plane.

Summitboy you don't own a nytro nor do you own the skinz concept front end and you certainly are not an engineer. You are neither qualified or experienced in matters regarding this subject. Please keep your opinions to yourself and stop bashing Skinz.

Skinz has single handedly revolutionized the handling of the Nytro. Their design and geometry will be copied by many late-comers, but they will remain THE company which changed the way we ride a Nytro. The critical members here seem to forget what they have received from Skinz. They took a sled that handled like junk and turned it into a gem of a sled. All new revolutionary products don't come without some growing pains and at a price. Think about the hours spent in developing this product. Think about the risk and liability for a small company to take in giving us such a radically new product.

Yes the heim joints have failed and Skinz was quick to try and remedy the issue with a new 1/2" joint they believed would work. They sent out new joints to everyone who didn't want to send in the front end for the updated 5/8" joints. They didn't want riders to lose a week or two of riding by sending in the front end to be changed to the 5/8" joint. The 1/2" new joint has also proven not to be adequate in certain situations.

We all agree the first batch of a-arms need the 5/8" update. If my sled had 1/2" joints I would immediately send them in for the updated 5/8" joints. This is free. Remember we were given the choice to try the updated 1/2" joints or send the a-arms in and get the updated 5/8" joints. There was no intent or lack or R&D which lead to this discovery. The initial riders of this front end were told to smash and hit anything in front of them to test the strength. They did so without any failures. The computed tensile strength would indicate the 1/2" joints were strong enough and the test riders had no failures even when they tried to destroy them. This has proven wrong in the hands of the riders here. A $5 part fixes the problem and Skinz is probably happy the issue has been identified and fixed without any major injuries.

Another post bashing Skinz about the 1/2" heim joints is just plain destructive. We post on this forum to be critical and constructive not destructive. I was happy to learn from the experience of others that we needed an update. That is what the spirit of the forum is for. My sled had the 5/8" update and my sledding trip last weekend was amazing. No issues with the joints and a completely new sled with handling on par or better than anything on the snow. That happened because a small company like Skinz made that happen. Get the new joints and ride on!

Otis

 

[christopher]

Very Nicely said Otis.

While I have some additional lengthy comments about Skinz Protective Gear that I plan on posting in a different thread next week, i will make this one comment here.

Not only am I very happy with my Skinz Concept A-Arms and all the other products that I have purchased from them, (in spite of the failure that I had), but I am satisfied enough with their design and engineering that I plan on buying a SECOND set of SPG Concept A-Arms and installing them on my 2nd Nytro as well.

If you own a Yamaha Nytro and are riding with the stock factory front suspension you are doing yourself a dis-service.! Chances are you are only doing so because you have not yet ridden one with this new front suspension installed!

Not only will I CONTINUE riding their front end next year, but I just got a set of Raptor Shocks built up for their A-Arms to replace my Float EVOLs.

==================

 

[BOOSTIN-BAYOU]

just wondering did they all just snap or were they over tightened against the locknut and was the nut even tight all have been fresh breaks what is there alignment set at how many things did they hit before they broke there are so many things that could have helped it to break i got the front end on my sled with the old heim joints no problem how many were sold everything you might purchase in this market isnt going to have the r/d that it needs its the chance we take i still have never found anyone that can tell me how much FUN COSTS right now its priceless

 

[summitboy]

Very well said Otis !

When you formed your opinion, someone else brought forward your concerns and the engineers were there to fix the problem before you got on that airplane. Good thing they didn't send you on your merry way before the part/problem caused you some undue harm.

I do the same. When i show up at an airplane with a issue/design flaw i not only make the appropriate call, i don't get on it !

Good on Skinz for fixing the issue ! I commend them.

However they didn't invent this front end, they didn't invent using heim joints on front suspensions, they chose to use 1/2 heims. They put out a product that had issues. Thats not opinion or my fault, thats fact, thats why they have 5/8 joints now.

When the product came to market and people formed their OPINIONS (heaven forbid someone in this free democratic society we live in can have an opinion) people posted them in a forum which was invented for this purpose ! Before the issues started threads showed up with the yay and nay sayers fighting to the bitter end with their OPINIONS.

I made my opinion and our group CHOSE not to buy them and spend our money somewhere else. I'm sorry its not what YOU or others want to hear. If we all kept quiet about a products or sleds and nothing ever got challenged what would be the point of having a forum to spread the word about the products in the first place ?

If nothing ever changed and we swept everything under the rug, products services,people don't change. Otis, you should of never got on that airplane ! You went against your own judgement ! Ever watch Mayday ?

Disclaimer: That is my opinion of course

 

[jw3210]

Christopher,

I have read and re-read this thread and your posts and cannot figure out anything about what you hit or exactly how your heim joint broke.

That said, your i-Phone worked well enough to post a thread on SW, why didn't you get a hold of Skinz directly?

I don't understand what your motive is. Like you said, anyone and everyone was offered a free upgrade to the 5/8" joints. You chose to run with the original joints and are now throwing Skinz under the bus??

For the record, I am still running the 1/2" ( yes, I must be an idiot ) but I know that an upgrade is available and if I had a failure, I would not have taken the route that you chose.


Scott

The issue is when paying a premium price you expect the engineering not be based on the minim standards. Which is true even with the upgrade.<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-comfficeffice" /><o></o>

 

[jw3210]

1400 miles on my SPG front end. 1 spindle, 2 subframes and it took the worst impact of my life to break one of the original heims. 40-50 mph landed a jump and hit a rock in my bombhole. Sled rebounded some 40 feet in distance and 15 feet high from the impact. Something was going to give.

where the guy is standing is where the impact was. I was able to remove the nut from the broken heim and thread it in to ride out. Skinz had me my new heims in short order and I was back on the snow. Pissed off at nothing but such a horrible impact I had taken and being lucky I was not hurt.

picture of my subframe from the rock

Picture of the stump, broken spindle, bent subframe and un broken original heim. This was in November.

Did you have the upgrade done on the sub frame, as one of there're videos shows what appears to be excellent upgrade to sub frame for those who like jumping of cliffs?<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-comfficeffice" /><o></o>