BraKe issue

[upfront719]

So i am having a hell of a time getting the hand brakes to work on my ktm timbersled bike. I have tried every method of bleeding the brakes including using a syringe and forcing fluid from the bottom nipple up to the master cylinder. I have no pressure at all?!?!? Im assuming the brake is broken?? What should i look for to determine what is wrong? The bike is at the dealer and they have no clue what to do next.

Hoping Allen sends me a new brake system to throw on the kit... Im so tired of working on this damn issue!!

Any advice as to what to look for would be appreciated.

 

[the gman]

Last year we had a hard time getting the air out and ended up taking the master cylinder off of the handlebar andputting it lower than the slave cylinder and then using a mity vac pump, sucked the air out, gravity was working against us with the master on the bars... This year we used the syringe method and after filling the reservoir 3 times all bubbles were gone. If your master worked before...your hand pump, then you should either have a leak at the slave cylinder or a hard handle if the brake cylinder is locked up. It took two of us to bleed ours and after the second reservoir fill up as we were pressure bleeding the third time someone would tap the handle and the remaining bubbles would surface at the reservoir. Hope this helps....

 

[CATSLEDMAN1]

too horizontal

took an hour or so of fooling around to get the hand brake on tom's new mtn horse last Fri to bleed out. will remove the master cylinder next time and hold it above the slave as we bleed. Had to do that with my WR.

 

[the gman]

Also have been told to pump handle to build pressure and the zip tie handle tight to bar and let sit overnight. Not had first hand experience with this but should work to get stubborn bubbles out.

 

[Mtn. Muncher]

Bleeding Your Brake

When I install a kit I do not need to ever bleed the brake. This is what I do that work every time and will take only a few minutes to do.<O</O

1<SUP>st</SUP>. Hook the entire brake system up.<O</O
2<SUP>nd</SUP>. Remove the master cylinder fill cap (hand or foot master cylinder).<O</O
3<SUP>rd</SUP>. Prepare a 1”od medical style syringe with a hose on the end that will fit the bleed screw on the caliper.<O</O
4<SUP>th</SUP>. Suck the remaining brake fluid out of the master cylinder using the syringe.<O</O
5<SUP>th</SUP>. Fill the syringe all the way up with brake fluid.<O</O
6<SUP>th</SUP>. Crack the bleed screw loose in the caliper so you can open and close it with your fingers.<O</O
7<SUP>th</SUP>. Place the syringe hose on the bleed screw.<O</O
8<SUP>th</SUP>. Open the bleed screw with hose on and proceed to push the brake fluid in till the master cylinder reservoir is full. Then turn the bleed screw in with your fingers and remove the hose. Then tighten the bleed screw.<O</O
9<SUP>th</SUP>. Flick the brake lever about 20 to 30 times and you should see tiny air bubbles coming out; do this until you do not see any more.<O</O
10<SUP>th</SUP>. Is should work at this point. Pump your brake up until it is firm.<O</O
11<SUP>th</SUP>. If your brake is not all the way firm then full the reservoir and put the cap back on and it will firm up after the first ride or even will after setting there for a few days.<O</O

 

[powdermuncher]

Just take the brake calliper of the and hold it down low with the bleed nipple at its lowest spot and the brake line straight up to the top (highest spot).

Then shoot the whole syringe through in one smooth motion so all the air bubbles go straight up through the calliper and hose out through the master cylinder.

Put a bunch of towels around the master cylinder to catch the overflow to avoid a mess.

Pump the brake a few times( after you reinstall the Calliper!)

Use your syringe to lower the fluid level to the proper level.

Done.

Air does not like to go down in a fluid so you have to allow it to go uphill all the way.

If you do everything right it is a one shot deal 5 min tops.

Cheers

 

[upfront719]

Good information guys. I appreciate it.

The dealer has used these processes and still cannot get any pressure. There must be something wrong with the brake or the master cylinder. They are going to use a master cylinder off a different bike today to see if that will work!!?!? Crossing my fingers.

I think I'm going to have hundreds of dollars into getting my brake to work. WTF.

It better snow soon so I can take out some frustration on this thing

Thanks again,

Ryan

 

[powdermuncher]

Been there, mine would not bleed with the calliper installed at all.

Not sure why some are easy and some such a bear.

 

[KAWGRN]

are both your kits doin thre same thing??

 

[CATSLEDMAN1]

no brakes

tons of new power today, no brakes necessary.

 

[upfront719]

Nice to hear about the snow. Heading to Togwotee next Tues and looking forward to the maiden voyage. Brakes are working although im not planning on using them much.

It was a pain to get the brakes working but i think the ktm master cylinder had something to do with it. The dealer put a honda brake on my ktm and it bled alot easier.

 

[Revv Up]

A friend has similar problems, he took the slave cylinder apart and found some schmootz in there behind the piston(s), cleaned it up and all was well.

 

[Niskibum]

Reviving an old thread, sorry. Been searching for tips on bleeding the brakes because it isn't working for me. New 2014 TS on new 2013 WR450. Had to stop working on it and go inside so that I didn't take a sledgehammer to it today. Tried just bleeding, didn't work. Used a syringe and drained the master, then hooked up syringe to bleed screw and loosened screw, having to push so hard on the syringe that the tube came off syringe and sprayed brake fluid up my arm and into my face. Luckily I didn't get any in my eyes. Note to everyone WEAR SAFETY GLASSES when doing this!!! Still didn't get any brake fluid in the line, now it's sitting with the brake handle strapped back and master filled, not that I think that will work either.

Installing this kit has been a giant pain in the ***. Better be worth it when it's done. Bike has been sitting in my garage for a month now and it's still not rideable. Getting pretty frustrated with the whole thing. It's been a giant money pit, and I still don't have a way to load it in the truck. Luckily it's so cold right now I wouldn't go riding now even if it was ready.

Sorry, just venting. Think I'll go skiing next weekend and not go back in the garage for a while.

 

[ENERGIZER]

On initial install I spent several hours trying every thing mentioned in this thread including the dealer using a Vacuum tool to get a spongy feel. After several rides it firmed up.
When reinstalling kit on my Berg 570. before reading this thread.
I did exactly what mountain muncher did. Brake handle had no resistance.
Held brake handle down, cracked bleed screw, some air came out, repeated twice more until no air came out. (guessed some air trapped in caliper) Brake was 100 % firm.
See my posts regarding adding a second caliper to have both hand and foot brakes. Works great and only costs 200.00
Same technique applies to hydraulic clutches. See my posts on this topic.

 

[CATSLEDMAN1]

when it works.............it works.

I have bled out several Mtn horse kits and two that I have built. My latest setup is kicking my azz ? Sucked it down, then sucked it up. Hmmmm

Blown it down then blew it up. Took it all off and put Yam master cyl in vise and hung the little wilwood caliper on 12" line and bled it with about three strokes and a few bubbles from bleed valve. Took 5' new hose off bike, hung it all on a ladder so it could bleed with gravity, blowed and sucked and pumped, still unacceptable. So too cold to ride today, let it sit, but last week sitting and riding nothing improved. Something about the little wilwood caliper has air pocket in it.

 

[funjunkie]

You can get an air bubble under the little round plastic piece in the bottom of the master resivor where the fluid goes in and out of the resivor and it can be imposable to get out with out emptying the system completely and starting over.

 

[Hawkdoggen]

I found that i had to get about 3 to 4 feet of clear 3/16 fuel line ,put on bleeder then fill with brake fluid then take my air hose (turned down to about 15 psi) then crack bleeder and slowly blow the fluid back thru caliper up to reservior careful not to empty gas line and put air into system. make sure lid is off and watch stubborn bubbles appear . may have to repeat 2 to 4 times but it worked on a stubborn one

 

[CATSLEDMAN1]

bleeding fix

my brake system just wouldn't bleed out. Dan and I spend several hour sessions screwing will all the known solutions.


my sno bike was Yamaha master cylinder, 5ft custom brake line, same old wildwood caliper.

today I hooked the same wildwood caliper, 5 ft brake line to a 20 year old Kawasaki road bike master cylinder made for twin discs up front, used on my older sno bike.

bout 30 stokes from empty lines to blowing air and fluid, another thiry and one finger rock hard brakes. what it was doing was kicking air bubbles back up through the fluid in the master cylinder right up until it was rock hard. Stock little Yamaha NISSIN master cyl never would pop bubbles in the reservoir bleeding air back up to the top of the system ? whatever.

 

[Dam Dave]

Vacuum pump

 

[Niskibum]

Finally!!! The fourth day of screwing around with the brake and got it working. I tried bunch of different stuff, got a vacuum kit from Harbor, didn't do a thing. Didn't have any resistance on the lever, and the pads were a good quarter inch from the rotor and not moving. Finally took to using a screwdriver and tapping on the brake handle, then working the brake while loosening the bleeder and tightening again. I was getting bubbles out of the line into the Master and eventually I felt some pressure. Checked the pads and sure enough they had moved onto the rotor. I was then able to bleed them normally. WHAT A GIGANTIC PITA!

Brakes aren't quite where I want them yet, but I will run them a couple days and try bleeding them again. For now I can concentrate on the umpteen other things I need to do before the first ride. First up, figuring how to get the thing loaded in the truck.