Best Value for a snowbike setup?

[GlennRMK]

Ready to jump back in. Been on a sled the last two seasons after 2 seasons on a 16 Timbersled 137.

I previously had an 09 CRF450R one season and an 11 300 XC the next and neither one of these bikes worked well. The Honda refused to start cold (if the temp was below 20, which is almost every day). The KTM never ran consistently.


So, I would lean towards a 450 but open to options. Looks like a 19 KX450 can be had for $6900. Seems to be the cheapest e start 450.

19 YZ450 for around $8000

A 18-19 KTM 450 SX/XC is $7800-8500. I already have an 18 250 XC-W so the 18 KTM interchangeability would be nice but not mandatory. I wouldn't mind riding it occasionally in the summer so YZ450FX or KTM 500 would be nice for that, although it would add some cost. Or a new 300 XC TPI? I've seen 18 350 XC-Fs around $8000?

18-19 Honda is another option.


What kit? $7000 for a new ARO 3" is just too much to spend. Leftover 137? Regular 129? Camso?

Thoughts?

 

[aka Mr Floyd]

OK, I'll bite...

I had a 14 Honda CRF450 and found it to be really finicky in the cold. At the same time I had a 10 YZF450 that never had a single issue. Even when the cold start nob broke, it would still start easier than the Honda.

So, last year when it came time to go bike shopping I went for a new YZ. Around here, if you wait till summer is over, last season bikes go on sale, and I was able to get a year old YZ450F that had never even been pulled out of the crate for like $1500 off.

No experience with e-start, I have just avoided it after reading on here about some peoples problems with it...

As for kits, it seems most people are moving away from the 137's... With the new Timbersleds coming out might be able to find a good deal on last years ARO kit.

 

[GlennRMK]

Thanks!

I did see a new 18 YZ450F for like $7100, which seems like a good deal as well. Or an 18 450 FX for about the same which would be nice as I could add kick start to it.

 

[Wheel House Motorsports]

Honestly any 18/19 moto bike with e-start is a rocking baseline. Id feel good hopping on an 18+ YZ, KTM or 19 kawi in a heartbeat. Good battery and carry a jump pack and e-start only bikes are no biggie. Just keeping bike properly setup is key. Junk batteries and overall poor bike condition make cold starting a PITA. I'd highly recommend a tender on it in the shop just so you know it hasn't been started/stalled 10 times loading and unloading and the battery is a little worn down at the start of a cold morning.

I'd personally stay away from anything thats not a moto 450, everytime I know people who build them they work OK but always take more time and money to work as well as a race bike. IMO find a used ARO 129 would probably fit your needs the best. Those new bikes will be a lot faster then either of your old setups especially with the 137 and more HP so you will have way more fun and not need as big of a track to putter around on.

 

[Zad]

I’ve got a 2016 CMX 129” with the new CMX track for sale with the Aro ski and ktm mounting block and ski fit kit - $4000. It comes with a strut for both linkage and pds , 3.1 gallon gas tank, storage box and two spare belts. It was on a ‘17 ktm 300. I’ve gone to an 18 husky 450 race bike for the reasons listed above with a ‘19 CMX 129” for the fun, durability and customer service of CMX.

 

[needpowder]

Best value?

If you are looking for value then the last thing you should do is buy a new bike and a new kit. Say you find a good deal on a new bike and out the door you pay 8000. Then you buy a good kit for 6500. You still have to build it yourself and add on all the extras i.e. Thermostat, engine jacket, light bar, ECU, foot pegs, handwarmers/bars?, Plus whatever else I’m forgetting.
If I was starting from scratch, I would look for a complete set up. People spend 17 to 19 K and then lose their ass selling it for $13,000 after they put minimal hrs on it and take great care.

 

[GlennRMK]

If you are looking for value then the last thing you should do is buy a new bike and a new kit. Say you find a good deal on a new bike and out the door you pay 8000. Then you buy a good kit for 6500. You still have to build it yourself and add on all the extras i.e. Thermostat, engine jacket, light bar, ECU, foot pegs, handwarmers/bars?, Plus whatever else I’m forgetting.
If I was starting from scratch, I would look for a complete set up. People spend 17 to 19 K and then lose their ass selling it for $13,000 after they put minimal hrs on it and take great care.

Used is always a gamble. I think it would have to be someone I know or at least a friend of friend. Did they change the oil regularly and take care of it? 4T 450s are big bucks to fix. I'm not finding used bikes a whole lot cheaper. Used 16 KTM 450s around $6000.

$6900 for KX450. $4000ish for a new Camso? Or maybe I can find a leftover 137 ARO under $5000. I'm afraid the 120 will be too short for my 200 lbs in our dry snow so the Raw is out. I would be more apt to buy a used kit than a used bike.

All I need is a thermostat. Have the one off my 250 XC-W I could use or I like the Thermobob I had on my Honda. Might consider an engine jacket. I don't need anything else. I guess the Yamahas have enough juice to run handwarmers so I would consider that as long as I don't have to do a stator.

 

[M5-]

If you are looking for "Value" as in the title of your post I would drive to Canada from Mt. and pick up a new Camso. You should be able to find a 19 or 20 brand new in the $4500 CDN range which translates to about $3500 USD. I could hook you up with my dealer. I don't know why the huge price gouge for a Camso in the US but they are cheap in Canada. For the money there is no better value. I ride in Montana almost exclusively and the Camso just flat out works. Are there better and lighter kits out there, yes there are, but you can have 2 Camsos for the price of the new Yeti. I'm just saying for value it cant be beat. As for a bike a low hour blue bike is pretty bomb proof. You should be able to build a blue bike with a Camso for 10ish.


M5

 

[needpowder]

Yes, I hear you about used being a gamble. Like you said, I wouldn’t worry about buying a used kit so much. The bike can be a different story though. KTM’s hold their value. I just picked up a 2017 YZ450F with 6.2 hours, full FMF titanium exhaust, radiator guards...etc for 5200 bucks. Thing looks brand new. Barely even the normal boot scuffs that appear after one ride. Yes, I am probably going to miss the electric start that my FX had but oh well. ��

M5- doesn’t look like I am going to be able to see what that single ring piston looks like after 150 hrs after all. New plastic on the FX and she will be out the door!

 

[GlennRMK]

If you are looking for "Value" as in the title of your post I would drive to Canada from Mt. and pick up a new Camso. You should be able to find a 19 or 20 brand new in the $4500 CDN range which translates to about $3500 USD. I could hook you up with my dealer. I don't know why the huge price gouge for a Camso in the US but they are cheap in Canada. For the money there is no better value. I ride in Montana almost exclusively and the Camso just flat out works. Are there better and lighter kits out there, yes there are, but you can have 2 Camsos for the price of the new Yeti. I'm just saying for value it cant be beat. As for a bike a low hour blue bike is pretty bomb proof. You should be able to build a blue bike with a Camso for 10ish.


M5

Thanks for the info! I actually did notice that. Do they give you hard time coming over the boarder with that? Duties, taxes, etc?

Looks like 19 YZ450Fs have a $1000 rebate so I should be able to pick one of those up for around $7000.

 

[M5-]

Yes, I hear you about used being a gamble. Like you said, I wouldn’t worry about buying a used kit so much. The bike can be a different story though. KTM’s hold their value. I just picked up a 2017 YZ450F with 6.2 hours, full FMF titanium exhaust, radiator guards...etc for 5200 bucks. Thing looks brand new. Barely even the normal boot scuffs that appear after one ride. Yes, I am probably going to miss the electric start that my FX had but oh well. ��

M5- doesn’t look like I am going to be able to see what that single ring piston looks like after 150 hrs after all. New plastic on the FX and she will be out the door!

Buyer beware, LOL, comes with a 30 - 30 warranty, 30 seconds or 30 feet whichever comes first. Actually its probably fine but it will need changing with that hour count. Its not that big of a project really, longest part is waiting to get the cylinder back from honing. You will miss the Estart but its not that big of a deal and you will miss the taller 5th gear, but in every other way the YZ will be better than the FX by a lot.

I've never imported anything back into the states but from what I have heard its much easier than taking things from the US to Canada. Quick call to the border office and they should be able to tell you. I know American personal exemptions are much higher for American citizens then what we have in Canada. If you are thinking of doing it I would do it sooner rather than later as they are made in Canada so its only a matter of time before they get a tariff slapped on them.

M5

 

[Wheel House Motorsports]

Buyer beware, LOL, comes with a 30 - 30 warranty, 30 seconds or 30 feet whichever comes first. Actually its probably fine but it will need changing with that hour count. Its not that big of a project really, longest part is waiting to get the cylinder back from honing. You will miss the Estart but its not that big of a deal and you will miss the taller 5th gear, but in every other way the YZ will be better than the FX by a lot.

I've never imported anything back into the states but from what I have heard its much easier than taking things from the US to Canada. Quick call to the border office and they should be able to tell you. I know American personal exemptions are much higher for American citizens then what we have in Canada. If you are thinking of doing it I would do it sooner rather than later as they are made in Canada so its only a matter of time before they get a tariff slapped on them.

M5

I bought a used kit off a guy on one of my revy trips. It was sitting in the back of the truck with our bikes/kits coming home and nobody said anything and we just cruised on thru... not sure if thats how its supposed to work, but its how it happened! lol.

 

[coryf89]

the border couldnt care less. I travel from USA to canada 2x a month for the last 10 years with 1000s of dollars of parts. canada to USA is the same thing. pay your GST (no GST in montana right?) and youre good to go for the most part unless its chinese made.


last time I went through was last week, $1200 worth of bike parts that I owed $60 GST on. their machine wasnt working so told me I got a freebie. ive crossed with $25,000 worth of aftermarket road armor bumpers with no problems. pay the 5% AB GST and youre good to go.


if youre a business and its a commercial import, its one extra form to fill out and an extra $20. no biggie. if its a machine with a motor and a VIN its a tad trickier at the bigger border crossings but the smaller ones are usually pretty good about stuff. I wouldnt be worried about coming to canada to buy one.

https://www.kijiji.ca/b-alberta/camso-dts/k0l9003?dc=true

 

[GlennRMK]

Is the ARO 120 too short for my 200 lbs and dry Montana snow?

A leftover 120 ARO is $1000 cheaper than the 137

 

[M5-]

I would say yes its too short. 129 is the length I ride in Montana but its Camso which has a better track. Back when I rode TS I swapped my 120 for a 137 and never looked back. I have no experience with the Aro but didn't they change the geometry for 2020 to make them climb up on the snow better?

M5

 

[Wheel House Motorsports]

Is the ARO 120 too short for my 200 lbs and dry Montana snow?

A leftover 120 ARO is $1000 cheaper than the 137

Im still a big advocate of the 120's. They work damn good and always impress me. But if your a powder snob and put the wheels on early in the spring then maybe the 137 is the setup for you. All depends on how you ride and what you expect the setup to do for you.

Especially with a good running moto 450, the 120 just rips so hard, spin fast and are really fun, but definitely have to be rode harder then a 137 which is more just sit back and plod along.

Just like I could never ride a 163/174 sled for more then a day or two without getting bored.

 

[GlennRMK]

Im still a big advocate of the 120's. They work damn good and always impress me. But if your a powder snob and put the wheels on early in the spring then maybe the 137 is the setup for you. All depends on how you ride and what you expect the setup to do for you.

Especially with a good running moto 450, the 120 just rips so hard, spin fast and are really fun, but definitely have to be rode harder then a 137 which is more just sit back and plod along.

Just like I could never ride a 163/174 sled for more then a day or two without getting bored.

Thanks for the info! Making me consider 120 more.

Actually one of the reasons I want to go back to the snowbike is its way more fun when you don't have 18" of new snow. I usually work Monday thru Friday, so I'm a weekend warrior. I skipped a lot of weekends the last two seasons because I didn't think the snow would be great on the sled. Probably would ride a bike almost double the days or at least 50% more. So I guess I am a powder snob on sled but not on snowbike.

I really prefer the 153 to a 162 sled. I like to ride in the trees the best. Don't really care for jumping, or hill climbing and hate the trail. The 153-155 sleds just feel more nimble, have more transfer and are easier to change direction on. So maybe I would prefer the shorty ARO? Almost everyone I know has 137s so I have only rode a 120 for about 10 minutes.

 

[CATSLEDMAN1]

used 120

been riding 120 on a ktm 500, had mx bikes with 137/144/129, living here in western montana for the me 120 rocks. I see used bikes with kits on Criag list newer than mine for less money than I would take for my set up. They look like bargains . Buying used, only thing I would fear is a bike from a 20 year old kid that doesn't know the rev limiter from a bad spark plug.

If you can't judge the conditions you are riding in, the bike can get abused, the kit..............they be ok, its second gear deep powder for 1/2 hr wicked that kills motors. If they have only ever owned and snow bike and complain about lack of power..........I would walk.

 

[GlennRMK]

I am kind of leaning towards a 16-18 YZ450FX right now

I like that is has the extra stator power to run hand warmers. My hands were always freezing on my last two snow bikes.

I also like that it comes with (16) or you can add the kicker (17-18) for $200.

The wide ratio isn't ideal for snow IMO, but I've ridden one and thought second and 3rd seemed about right which are the main gears your in. I would probably just gear down a bit to close the gaps. I would ride it a little in the summer and I definitely think the wide ratio is a plus for that. I find the MX 1st gear horrible for technical single track.

16-19 450 XC-F would be my second choice as it would share a lot with my 18 250 XC-W and it looks like trail tech makes a stator for $150.

 

[Sheetmetalfab]

I am kind of leaning towards a 16-18 YZ450FX right now

I like that is has the extra stator power to run hand warmers. My hands were always freezing on my last two snow bikes.

I also like that it comes with (16) or you can add the kicker (17-18) for $200.

The wide ratio isn't ideal for snow IMO, but I've ridden one and thought second and 3rd seemed about right which are the main gears your in. I would probably just gear down a bit to close the gaps. I would ride it a little in the summer and I definitely think the wide ratio is a plus for that. I find the MX 1st gear horrible for technical single track.

16-19 450 XC-F would be my second choice as it would share a lot with my 18 250 XC-W and it looks like trail tech makes a stator for $150.

Do coolant heated handlebars.

Waaaayyyyy better than any electric heated grips.