174 MTNTK turbo pro (10 lbs) VS 174 sidewinder
- Thread starter niner
- Start date
what elevation was that at? and did he have work dun on the sidewinder? tune/clutches/pipe.exc.
I ask because im riding with a buddy that has a 2018 sidewinder btx 153 2.25 and we are running 0-4000ft I have a 2016 assault silber at 5 pounds indy dans clutch kit and I am wiping his a$$! we haven't got to the big end of things yet but we keep thinking that's where he will make up grounds
I ask because im riding with a buddy that has a 2018 sidewinder btx 153 2.25 and we are running 0-4000ft I have a 2016 assault silber at 5 pounds indy dans clutch kit and I am wiping his a$$! we haven't got to the big end of things yet but we keep thinking that's where he will make up grounds
yea I hear with a re-flash those SideWinders can get turned up over 400 HP THATS NUTS! we have found the clutching to be horrible it is absolutely the worst bottom end we have ever hade the pleasure of trying to fix! another buddy has a NA 4strok (2015 don't remember witch one} but it is rated at 130-135 HP and that sidewinder doesn't leave that sled in a race until they are doing about 30 its just silly all those ponies and they cant get them thru the drivetrain...we are working on the clutching on the SideWinder but it is proving to be a b!t(h at best...they are a lot more finicky than I thought they would be 
takes a wile for the turbo to spool up....I wonder if that's why they hade a rolling start on the clime it didn't sound like they got on it from the start.
takes a wile for the turbo to spool up....I wonder if that's why they hade a rolling start on the clime it didn't sound like they got on it from the start.
With out knowing what HP level that Yam is running.. The Pro on 10 is like a Axys on 5.
wow that's a drastic change! 10 pounds to get 200+ hp nutty
Elevation is around 7500’
Sidewinder is running stock tune, stock clutching and a Cr straight pipe ( claimed 15 hp gain)
I’m running 76 gram lightning weights in the pro.
My sled kills a Axys running on 5 lbs.
We did a rolling start to minimize variables.
The sidewinder has track speeds in the 55 mph range and mine in the low 50’s mph track speeds.
Both sleds have 174 X3 tracks. Both have Baker skids.
Sidewinders up here are running very fast on the hills. I was pretty happy to see how close they are. Snow was in the 12”-18” of fresh. When it gets deeper mine should get closer.
Sidewinder is running stock tune, stock clutching and a Cr straight pipe ( claimed 15 hp gain)
I’m running 76 gram lightning weights in the pro.
My sled kills a Axys running on 5 lbs.
We did a rolling start to minimize variables.
The sidewinder has track speeds in the 55 mph range and mine in the low 50’s mph track speeds.
Both sleds have 174 X3 tracks. Both have Baker skids.
Sidewinders up here are running very fast on the hills. I was pretty happy to see how close they are. Snow was in the 12”-18” of fresh. When it gets deeper mine should get closer.
it must be the elevation like I said I ride with a 2018 sidewinder btx 153 I have a 2016 axys assault 155 800 silber turbo 5 pounds, indy dans low elevation clutching and I am putting him to shame! so bad he just dropped close to a grand on clutching to spruce it up! we have ben riding at 1500-2500 ft so far this year but I know that the sidewinder will produce a constant HP at all elevations and has a intercooler to accommodate the bigger boost temps... is yours intercooled? at 10 pounds im sure the intercooler is needed for your charge temps. like I said above we have not got in to any big/long pulls just short ones like the vid you posted and we have not tried a rolling start ether! but it has ben no competition yet but we are going to fix that! one way or the other. the SW, is a fun sled ether way the best 4 stroke I have ever ridden. all I can guess is its the pipe...elevation.... or like AK stated the axys is just responding to boost a lot better than the pros? I feel like its the elevation or the rolling start as we don't ride that far up so I cant attest to how much HP loss that gives you and the SW feels a lot stronger after 20-25 mph than it does off the line so I can see how the rolling start could make a big difference . I am going to try the rolling start the next time we go out to see if we get the same results you did! {even though I feel its padding the test to what the 4stroke needs!} much like when they redesigned the dirt bike tracks when the 4strokes first hit them to accommodate them...and no I am not bashing 4strokes own many of them in my summer toys...all my fave summer toys are 4strokes! but I can feel the difference in the two as a 2smoker has a volatile power and the 4stroker has a very linier power.
https://youtu.be/0epoSJYEBcI
Here’s from this weekend. On the last hill in the video the sidewinder could make fresh tracks up and over. The 174 Axys belt drive Axys with gear down and Slp pipe would only get half way up the hill in fresh track. The 163 MTNTK Axys pulled the hill in fresh also.
Here’s from this weekend. On the last hill in the video the sidewinder could make fresh tracks up and over. The 174 Axys belt drive Axys with gear down and Slp pipe would only get half way up the hill in fresh track. The 163 MTNTK Axys pulled the hill in fresh also.
nice vid. im jealous its -30 hear and just to cold to have fun! that sidewinder pulls hard on top I can see the extra speed he was getting it looked like it was haling a$$! not surprising the na sled wasn't a competitor just not enough HP but I was surprised to see the 163 did as good as it did I could see it trenching a bit more than the SW 174... what boost did the 163 have and what size lugs was it pushing?
did the pro in the original post have a Intercooler?
did the pro in the original post have a Intercooler?
I would be willing to bet you would benefit greatly from an intercooler at those boost levels, your charge temps half to be well over what is desirable. how many pounds of boost on the 2018 mtntk turbo are you running? and did you get a chance to check out the winder with and without the pipe? wondering if you could tell the difference in power between the stock and aftermarket?
The 2018 MTNTK turbo is running 10 lbs.
The pipe on the sidewinder definitely helps. More power and drops 15 lbs.
Would be nice if Sean from MTNTK would build me a intercooler for my pro, but last time I checked he wasn’t making one for the pro. Just the Axys.
The pipe on the sidewinder definitely helps. More power and drops 15 lbs.
Would be nice if Sean from MTNTK would build me a intercooler for my pro, but last time I checked he wasn’t making one for the pro. Just the Axys.
well send him some cookies and a 6pack of blonds.....beers that is keep your mind out the gutter hahaha! and tell him to get to work!
did the pipe on the SW help the spool or low-end or just the mids and up?
does your cru run lock outs in the rear skids/aftermarket skids? your sleds are nice and low on the skies and i cant keep mine down in a climb starting to think about the skinz ARC. cable run shock?
did the pipe on the SW help the spool or low-end or just the mids and up?
does your cru run lock outs in the rear skids/aftermarket skids? your sleds are nice and low on the skies and i cant keep mine down in a climb starting to think about the skinz ARC. cable run shock?
The Racers Edge skid we are running are amazing. I have gained so much ground speed by using his skid. It doesn’t really have a lock out feature. His skids are set up for climbing and very precise handling. If you like to wheelie this skid is not for you.
yea that's why i was looking at the arc shock lock out you can go from a stock skid to a fully locked one wile you ride and back again by just pushing a leaver with the left thumb. still pull the skies up and over creaks and fallen logs and then lock it out on the fly to shoot a steep climb and keep the skies down for control. i have ben hesitant to get a skid because sometimes i need to get them skies 3 ft high and only have 8 or 10 ft to do it!
The winder is a much more capable sled for making power. If the pro turbo is beating on the winder, it is because it isn't setup correctly. To me, it is impressive that Niners sled is hanging with the winder at similar boost...great build.
The issue with any 4 stroke is the cost to build them right. To put down the power a winder is really capable of takes a 174 and a big coupling skid on top of everything else. Its big money to build one right. I think that is why most people have stayed away from them in general. The weight is manageable if you have big power, but the cost to get there is significant given what you can get from a 2 stroke turbo for the money.
Personally, I enjoy the comparison. It is interesting since each sled has its place, and the winder is still being developed as a platform. But, to be honest, its not gonna be much of a race if the winder owner gets serious. Thanks for the interesting discussion.
The issue with any 4 stroke is the cost to build them right. To put down the power a winder is really capable of takes a 174 and a big coupling skid on top of everything else. Its big money to build one right. I think that is why most people have stayed away from them in general. The weight is manageable if you have big power, but the cost to get there is significant given what you can get from a 2 stroke turbo for the money.
Personally, I enjoy the comparison. It is interesting since each sled has its place, and the winder is still being developed as a platform. But, to be honest, its not gonna be much of a race if the winder owner gets serious. Thanks for the interesting discussion.
Last edited:
yea I have enjoyed the vids. you ben posting makes me want to drive down their and scratch around in your litter box
I agree that once the sidewinder gets his clutching dialed in there will be a bigger gap. Another guy with a similar set up with a 174 3” stock tune sidewinder is claiming mid 60 mph track speeds. So my buddy is getting some tips on clutching from him. So we will continue to compare.
