Avid Products Carb Heater, APT and PWK

mtn-doo · May 10, 2014

Hey everyone.
This will be a much needed thread this fall so I decided to start with a progress report. As I mentioned this past season, we will find and organize an aftermarket manufacturer to address this need everyone is waiting for. This is a preview of what can be expected later this year. I am fortunate to have a brilliant machinist and close friend near by who is heavily involved in precision aftermarket products for a variety of power sport applications and a life long avid snowmobiler. With him and the support of Corey Dyess of APT we are on track. We will make some R&D adjustments, fit and finish, plans for retail sales and packaging, etc,.. soon. The hundreds of folks who have been unsure about your APT Smart Carb icing issues can be secure and excited for the next season. Everyone from the European and Canadian Ice Racers to the new Snow bike craze. I will be posting all the details here soon., Thanks

the gman · May 10, 2014

Don't forget your old friend...put me first on the list

portgrinder · May 11, 2014

that'll work spiffy.

Should measure one up for a PWK too.

Is there room to use 90 fittings instead? looks like there is. would help so you dont have a tight bend in the coolant line right there, and you could route them back towards the engine real clean.

does it bleed air out ok? having the 'out' side fitting on the top might help that. i had some issues getting mine bled.almost addeed a 3rd line back to the rad to help. using clear lines and lots of engine revs eventually got it cleared out though.

the best valve i found was off the XP's. maybe theres something else out there too if guys cant find one of those.

mtn-doo · May 12, 2014

portgrinder said:
that'll work spiffy.

Should measure one up for a PWK too.

Is there room to use 90 fittings instead? looks like there is. would help so you dont have a tight bend in the coolant line right there, and you could route them back towards the engine real clean.

does it bleed air out ok? having the 'out' side fitting on the top might help that. i had some issues getting mine bled.almost addeed a 3rd line back to the rad to help. using clear lines and lots of engine revs eventually got it cleared out though.

the best valve i found was off the XP's. maybe theres something else out there too if guys cant find one of those.

Hey Joel,
I would like to add the PWK series as well. However, without the altitude and temp compensating abilities of a Smart Carb, we feel it would be a backward step. With the Smart Carb, you will never have to remove the carb or jacket for jetting, tuning, etc. Just install it, set it, and never touch it again.

The APT cast and billet models both share the same O.D. , so we could have two models, APT Cast and Billet. That would cover all six carbs.

Yes, you can clock it to mount in any position. With nipples up, you will not get an air bubble. If you need to mount them down, you can crack the pipe plug and bleed it.

We plan to pkg each unit with 3, 5/16 shut off's, straight, 45, and 90 degree fittings, two reducing "T" fittings , 3 lengths of 5/16 hose, and clamps. Instructions and a diagram will be included. The hoses will be, 1- from head to heater, 2- from heater to pump, and 3- a "heater by-pass" short length.

I also feel a quality Carb Jacket to keep melting snow and water off the carb is essential. To have a "Package" that you can install and run, trouble free all winter, would be ideal. A carb jacket protecting from the elements and adding to the warm and dry environment would be the finishing touch. I have a custom pattern and quality Neoprene fabric I use now. We may include a Jacket with the package. I feel the heater without the jacket is less than a turn-key package.

Thanks Joel, please keep the suggestions and ideas coming.

mrquick68 · May 12, 2014

so, will this work on the Cast 38mm smart carb? I know last season there was a lot of discussion about the cast carb not being ideal for snow, but will this change that?

mrquick68 · May 12, 2014

Sweet! I will take one for a cast smarty.

eskimojoe77 · May 12, 2014

Ballpark price?

I'm interested in one for an Apt cast, when do you think you'll have them available and for what price? Thanks.

mtn-doo · May 12, 2014

eskimojoe77 said:
I'm interested in one for an Apt cast, when do you think you'll have them available and for what price? Thanks.

They will be available this fall. There will be a complete package price later this summer. It will be sold by a current performance products manufacturer I am working with. When everything is complete, we will post all ordering info, part #, web addresses, emails and Phone numbers then.

Thanks

wwillf01 · Jul 21, 2014

Has there been an update on this? I am getting together all need parts to complete the build... I assume this will not work on a Lectron correct...

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wwillf01 · Jul 22, 2014

Just to give everyone an update on this. I talked to the gentleman that is making these and we had a great conversation... It looks like they are about a month out. So we will have an answer to carb icing this winter!

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mtn-doo · Jul 22, 2014

Sorry about the lack of an update. We have a couple of prototypes done and are working on a couple of different bypass and thermostat options. We want a small, clean and universal system for everyone. We are very close. When we get the finishing pieces worked out, we will post several pic's as well as an installation video.

Robbie at Avid Products will be the wholesale and retail outlet. We will post all of that info when we're ready to ship kits. Approximately a month.

mtn-doo · Jul 22, 2014

wwillf01 said:
Has there been an update on this? I am getting together all need parts to complete the build... I assume this will not work on a Lectron correct...

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You are correct. This billet heat collar is specifically designed for the Billet model Smart Carbs from 36MM through 42MM. There is a slim chance it would fit. I would need to know the O.D. of the front of your carb. Front being the intake side.

wwillf01 · Jul 22, 2014

mtn-doo said:
You are correct. This billet heat collar is specifically designed for the Billet model Smart Carbs from 36MM through 42MM. There is a slim chance it would fit. I would need to know the O.D. of the front of your carb. Front being the intake side.

thanks it looks like if I gave him the od he could make one... I have been debating getting a smart carb but the Lectron has not missed a beat so it is hard to justify... the owner of Lectron said the he has a few in Iceland in which he said they covered them to solve the issue.. My other thought was running a handle bar grip heater and wrapping it around the bell.. has anyone tried this?

mtn-doo · Jul 23, 2014

wwillf01 said:
thanks it looks like if I gave him the od he could make one... I have been debating getting a smart carb but the Lectron has not missed a beat so it is hard to justify... the owner of Lectron said the he has a few in Iceland in which he said they covered them to solve the issue.. My other thought was running a handle bar grip heater and wrapping it around the bell.. has anyone tried this?

Yes, grip heaters, heat probes, you name it. We've experimented with about everything. Electricity is an issue for a lot of people, enough wattage, regulator/rectifier install, head lights, grip warmers, etc. You can see how this issue grows..... Also the heat transfer, conductivity was minimal. Helps some but not a real "fix".

With this system, no electricity required, head lights and hand warmers not compromised etc. These will be universal for all make and model bikes.

Also I am working with Corey from APT on the FCR series carb heat collar for 4-strokes. We plan to have the system universal for those as well. I have projects coming in to remove the pump and throttle boddies from current EFI 4 strokes and installing FCR series carbs. Huge advantages over the inaccurate EFI our bikes currently have, so this heat system will cover the FCR models as well.

portgrinder · Jul 23, 2014

Just using hose works too. For those non smarty guys like me. I put some pics up here somewhere of how I did my pwk and it works great.

mtn-doo · Aug 3, 2014

Hi everyone,

We have finished the Carb heat system and have some exciting new features that will be greatly appreciated.

First, Here are a couple of pic's of the Billet heat collar installed on a 38MM Smart Carb.

wwillf01 · Aug 3, 2014

Package cost... Are you using billet with the cast one?

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mtn-doo · Aug 3, 2014

Secondly, We have all struggled with the engine temp/thermostat issue. All bikes will benefit from a thermostat. After countless hours of testing over the past four years we have learned a lot. The straight through designs have a small leak port allowing some coolant to always cycle through your radiators. That is why they steam after start-up in the parking lot. In cold/dry pow, that small amount constantly cycling through your cold radiators defeats the purpose and temps seldom rise to acceptable levels. The stat that has NO bypass but a recirc line from the stat to the water pump cycles cylinder coolant in a closed loop. This systems allow the engine to quickly warm to operating temps and when you're in the cold pow, the stat closes and the coolant system is not used. The cylinder coolant simply cycles around and around keeping temps much more acceptable. An added plus is the recirc line is feeding the cold return line preventing any "cold shock" when the radiators become active. We decided to integrate the need of a closed thermostat system with the Carb heat system complimenting each other.

This thermostat is sealed, no leak through, and a ricirc fitting. Each half of this housing can be turned or clocked in 6 positions by rotating the two halves to make a perfect fit on your particular bike.

It is Billet aluminum.

mtn-doo · Aug 3, 2014

Tieing the two systems together simply routes the thermostat bypass line into the carb heat collar and the return from the carb heat collar ties into the return to the water pump. The end result is on start up, the stat is closed, cylinder coolant is bypassed through the carb heat collar and back to the pump. The engine quickly warms up, as does the carb's venturi. Once the temp meets 130F, for two strokes, the stat modulates gradually as needed to prevent an over heating condition. The carb heat circuit never closes or is affected by the function of the thermostat.

The install looks OEM. Very clean. Unless you look closely, you would not even notice it. This will be universal for all make and model bikes. Two stroke and FCR four strokes.

mtn-doo · Aug 3, 2014

The complete system includes the Billet Carb Heat collar, the Billet thermostat housing, 130F thermostat, all brass barbed and threaded fittings, Top of the line HPS silicone hose, a "hot line insulating sleeve", and all German worm drive clamps 9mm.

The system will be manufactured by Avid Products and available directly from Avid. Also they will be provided to wholesalers to be available at your local OEM dealer.

For ordering information, please visit; http://www.avid-products.com/

For questions feel free to contact myself or "Robbie" at Avid products 406-253-0979

Avid Products Carb Heater, APT and PWK

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