09 Dragon 800 Top End Rebuild

Jeff95 · Oct 11, 2011

I have a 09 Dragon 800 and rebuilding top end with upgrades.
Here is what I doing:
1) Fix it kit. with all new gaskets, seals and O-rings.
2) SLP Coolant bypass kit.
3) New Fuel filter.
4) Replaced green O-rings on top two injectors. Had to remove to remove cylinder.
5) Installing SLP 6000 and above head.
6) SLP single pipe and can.
7) Fluid oil tank with Polaris Blend oil (Blue). Also putting 32oz in first tank of gas.
8) Taking all PV5 tuning about 7800 that is negative and zeroing for break in.
9) Installed SLP Blue/Pink drive spring and MTX 68gram with 2g tip & 1g bottom weights.

I have PV5 (DTRD810StockStoutnerJan157hpWOT tuning) with 2010 update ECU flash. Motor ran good pistons looked good and most of the cross hatching was still visable. Set cylinders to PMS to hone and set ring cleance.

Questions I have:
How many heat cycles should I do to break in?
Anything else I should check or do before putting back together.

I would like to get a couple more seasons out of this sled.

Jeff

KrazyKen · Oct 11, 2011

I'm in the same boat!

I just did the "Fix" and new cylinders in my '09 800.

The only thing I question is your oil, even though I'm a firm believer in the Polaris Blue, which I run in my '02 800 and my 700 mod, due to it's improved lubrication qualities over other (mostly synthetic) oils.
I have switched to Redline Race Oil. It is highly recomended by SLP and many others in these injected engines.

I will follow the MTN TEK guidlines and run the mix in the tank for at least 100 miles but i am also running it in the oil tank. It will cost me more but I'm not taking any chances on this thing.

Right now I have 5 heat cycles in mine and I'm planning on doing about 2 per week until we ride. I figure the more the better unless someone can tell me different.

Good luck,
Ken

Jeff95 · Oct 11, 2011

I'm just using the blue until the break in is done. I have been using the Polaris Gold and thinking about changing to Redline. Is it OK to change after using Gold for three years on bottom end.

Jeff

KrazyKen · Oct 11, 2011

I'm not about to claim that I'm an oil expert, but, I've done a lot of reading on 2 stroke oils over the years. As far as the VES Gold goes, for bearing protection I would say it's at the bottom of the list with those 3 oils. I switched from the gold to the blue on my 02 and ran a whole season with no issues at all. Frankly i like the way my pistons look better. As far as exhaust valve build up goes I didn't see much if any difference. I had an 04 600 that was running on the blue and my 800 on the gold, cleaned the EV's at the same time and after a full season, one was no worse than the other. Never had a sticking issue.
I would just make sure and drain the tank completely when switching one to the other.
I can understand why you would want to break in with the Blue over the Gold, i'm just not sure how the injectors will like that oil.

Jeff95 · Oct 11, 2011

Shawn at PMS recommended blue for break in.
How did your pistons and cylinders look?
Polaris recommends the same for breaking in new sleds.

2XM3 · Oct 11, 2011

pop the case apart and change the pto side bearing and seal....just to be really safe. imho

Jeff95 · Oct 11, 2011

I did that when I melted the mag piston about 800 miles ago!

Best sled ever to keep your mechanical skills tuined!!!!:boxing::faint:

KrazyKen · Oct 12, 2011

Jeff95 said:
Shawn at PMS recommended blue for break in.
How did your pistons and cylinders look?
Polaris recommends the same for breaking in new sleds.

That's news to me, but makes perfect sense. I know that on just about any engine it's best to break in on a mineral based oil over synthetics. i was thinking that I heard that the injectors don't like it but i could be wrong. Oh well, last night I did heat cycle #6 so it's a done deal with the Redline for me. I did pull the E-valves again and from what I'm seeing everything looks great so far.

kahonies · Oct 12, 2011

KrazyKen said:
That's news to me, but makes perfect sense. I know that on just about any engine it's best to break in on a mineral based oil over synthetics. i was thinking that I heard that the injectors don't like it but i could be wrong. Oh well, last night I did heat cycle #6 so it's a done deal with the Redline for me. I did pull the E-valves again and from what I'm seeing everything looks great so far.

Not to be stupid. What are talking when you say heat cycles?

gerrman · Oct 12, 2011

Jeff95 said:
I have a 09 Dragon 800 and rebuilding top end with upgrades.
Here is what I doing:
1) Fix it kit. with all new gaskets, seals and O-rings.
2) SLP Coolant bypass kit.
3) New Fuel filter.
4) Replaced green O-rings on top two injectors. Had to remove to remove cylinder.
5) Installing SLP 6000 and above head.
6) SLP single pipe and can.
7) Fluid oil tank with Polaris Blend oil (Blue). Also putting 32oz in first tank of gas.
8) Taking all PV5 tuning about 7800 that is negative and zeroing for break in.
9) Installed SLP Blue/Pink drive spring and MTX 68gram with 2g tip & 1g bottom weights.

I have PV5 (DTRD810StockStoutnerJan157hpWOT tuning) with 2010 update ECU flash. Motor ran good pistons looked good and most of the cross hatching was still visable. Set cylinders to PMS to hone and set ring cleance.

Questions I have:
How many heat cycles should I do to break in?
Anything else I should check or do before putting back together.

I would like to get a couple more seasons out of this sled.

Jeff

I have same year sled and have/am making basically the same changes. FIx Kit installed, no bypass, FTX motor plate & Power Addition 12.5 head(3000-5500'), PCV c/w SLP map. Polaris blue for break-in, then VES Gold2. Redline oil is just way to expensive where I live. Nobody carries it, have to order in. Will do 4 heat cycles, that's enough. Nov 5 will be first ride of the season. Like you Jeff I have to keep this machine for another 3 years or so. Good luck!!!

pura vida · Oct 12, 2011

think you are way good on heat cycles. i usually do three. don't think more is necessary and could potentially have negative effects (although i have no personal proof of this). i would absolutely NOT use polaris gold. i personally like non-synthetic oils but am currently using red line. good luck. should be a ripper when it ready to go.

pv

KrazyKen · Oct 12, 2011

kahonies said:
Not to be stupid. What are talking when you say heat cycles?

Running the engine at idle until up to full operating temp, or beyond. The thermostat in these sleds is 120 f. I usually let it get to about 130 and shut down. Takes about 10 minutes at idle. This allows the engine to run with heat soak in the cylinders and pistons to get full expansion. It's not the same as when a load is put on it since the piston temps get hotter but gives the rings a chance to seat and cylinders break in before loading it.

Jeff95 · Oct 12, 2011

On the Gold do you mean for break in or in general?
I have not tought about the oil in gas effecting the injectors. Is the tinking that the oil may slow the flow through the injectors?

I hope I can keep up my buddy who got a new 2012 ProRMK 163.

KrazyKen · Oct 12, 2011

I've heard a lot of negative comments on the VES Gold. Personally I can't pin any of my previous failures on it but I've heard accounts where they claimed oil related issues. I switched from the Gold to the Polaris Blue in my two carbed sleds with great success. I've been told, and read, that there is no substitute for the Redline Race oil. SLP states this along with many others. I know successful race teams that swear by it and won't run anything else. I know it's expensive but I need this thing to survive. I was assuming it was good for break in use. I hope so anyway cause it's done now.

kahonies · Oct 12, 2011

Thanks KrazyKen for the clarification on heat cycles.

thefullmonte · Oct 12, 2011

It wouldn't hurt to check the throttle body boots on the engine side just to make sure they aren't de laminating. I don't see any real reason to change the PCV settings on break in, but that is ultimately your decision. It all comes down to what you are comfortable with.

Jeff95 · Oct 12, 2011

Good idea, I will check the boots.
Adding fuel to the 7800 RPM and above is not just for break in but for the new High Comp. Head. After break in I will montior plugs and adjust if needed.

diamonddave · Oct 12, 2011

thefullmonte said:
It wouldn't hurt to check the throttle body boots on the engine side just to make sure they aren't de laminating. I don't see any real reason to change the PCV settings on break in, but that is ultimately your decision. It all comes down to what you are comfortable with.

Look what the Cat dragged in....where you been?

Jeff95 · Oct 15, 2011

Thanks for the tips!
The Throttle body boots look good and going to put back together next week.

I put installed the Team 64-40er.46/64-44er.46 helix last year and didn't notice any difference. I also messed with weights to try and get the RPM's up about 8000.
What changes should it make over stock helix?

Jeff

Jeff95 · Dec 6, 2011

Top End Update

Update:

Took sled out for first time after top rebuild.
Problem #1:
When climbing the temp. would rise to 160-170 than lower after letting off the gas. This was do to some air bubbles in cooling lines. Added cooling ran a bit problem of rising temp. went away.

Problem #2.
When doing short climbs full throutle the engine light would come on and go into safe mode. The plugs looked rich so thinking maybe put to much oil in gas for break in. Drained all gas from tank added new gas, installed new plugs and took computer with me for PV5 tuning. Found that the mid range was too rich and top end was too lean. I also noticed that at 5500 feet elevation the motor liked the richer top end but when climbing at 6500 feet I could lean the top a little. Is this because of the high compression head?
I'm thinking of having two maps one for trails to mountains and one for bondocking. The trail map would be richer on top end (7000 rpms and up). I added about 3 persent to the top end of the map.

It seems like the safe mode is very sensitive and 3% makes a bike difference.

Looks like I have to go through and retune after installing Fix kit, SLP High compersion head, SLP pipe & can.

SLP PV5 map looks to be lean on the top end for 5000-7000 feet elevation.

Buy the way 3% more fuel on top dropped PRM about 300.

Jeff

09 Dragon 800 Top End Rebuild

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